Can anyone clearly explain "job homogenization" in this game?

[Namir]

I see this word thrown around a lot but I don't think you know what it means.

Please educate me on how jobs are homogenized in this game.

Make sure you are fully articulate and explain your reasoning clearly and thoroughly.

People need to let this thread die already. It’s obvious from the very first post that OP isn’t interested in “clarifying” or understanding, or even debating anything. Hence why he said “educate me on homogenization” while at the same time saying “I don’t think you know what it means”. Now why would you want to be educated about a subject by people you think don’t know what the subject means, pray tell?

Let the OP have his dose of validation thinking he did a good thing (he keeps repeating over and over how amazing of a thing it is that he made this thread so that single handedly this will let the devs and a ton of other people know… something) and move on. No use discussing anything with someone that is just looking to prove you wrong, not actually trying to understand anything outside himself.

[HikariKurosawa]

People need to let this thread die already. It’s obvious from the very first post that OP isn’t interested in “clarifying” or understanding, or even debating anything. Hence why he said “educate me on homogenization” while at the same time saying “I don’t think you know what it means”. Now why would you want to be educated about a subject by people you think don’t know what the subject means, pray tell?

Let the OP have his dose of validation thinking he did a good thing (he keeps repeating over and over how amazing of a thing it is that he made this thread so that single handedly this will let the devs and a ton of other people know… something) and move on. No use discussing anything with someone that is just looking to prove you wrong, not actually trying to understand anything outside himself.

I agree, this thread has served its purpose and yes, it did serve it well.

I never was looking to argue or debate anything. I wanted to hear the perspective clarified, and I did. It's to understand where people are coming from and have it out there for everyone to read.

Don't be upset that after understanding where you're coming from that I think your opinion is bad and invalid. At least I know where you're coming from when I didn't before.

[Carighan]

I never was looking to argue or debate anything.

Thread was flamebaiting, got it. TY for confirming. Block it is.

[HikariKurosawa]

Thread was flamebaiting, got it. TY for confirming. Block it is.

I mean I couldn't care less about what you think. I made the thread for the reason I have been saying over and over: I didn't understand where the job homogenization angle was coming from since the jobs in this game are all wildly different, and I wanted clarity.

Every post you make is dog tier and I've never taken you seriously or respected your positions in or out of this thread, so good for you?

Fact is, 2 minute meta =/= problematic or even homogenization. It's just how balance works. You are out of touch with what is good for the game, so go ahead and block me little person.

[Mikey_R]

I mean I couldn't care less about what you think. I made the thread for the reason I have been saying over and over: I didn't understand where the job homogenization angle was coming from since the jobs in this game are all wildly different, and I wanted clarity.

...

Fact is, 2 minute meta =/= problematic or even homogenization. It's just how balance works. You are out of touch with what is good for the game, so go ahead and block me little person.

Whilst I agree with the first point, jobs do play differently, the thing people have an issue with is the fact they all follow the strict 2 minute meta, with the vast majority of jobs also having a smaller burst every odd minute.

However, this does not mean that it is the only way to balance jobs. In a 100% uptime fight, you can balance between a sustained DPS and a more burst centric DPS. The absolute easiest way to do this is to get rid of all raid damage cooldowns, essentially making all jobs selfish. Whilst this allows for all damage profiles to be viable, not everyone wants to have that, they want to feel they are contributing to the team in another way. This is why if you allow raid buffs, having them up 100% of the time is a good solution, as it doesn't favour one particular time for burst damage at all.

Another alternative is to weaken the raid buffs and make them line up less. In the past, all buffs only lined up every 6 minutes, mainly down to the 90 seconds and 180 seconds buffs that some jobs had. With fewer buff windows and them being weaker, you reduce the impact they have on the job's overall damage.

So, whilst you might not see the 2 minute meta as an issue, to many, it is and there are ways around it.

[HikariKurosawa]

Whilst I agree with the first point, jobs do play differently, the thing people have an issue with is the fact they all follow the strict 2 minute meta, with the vast majority of jobs also having a smaller burst every odd minute.

However, this does not mean that it is the only way to balance jobs. In a 100% uptime fight, you can balance between a sustained DPS and a more burst centric DPS. The absolute easiest way to do this is to get rid of all raid damage cooldowns, essentially making all jobs selfish. Whilst this allows for all damage profiles to be viable, not everyone wants to have that, they want to feel they are contributing to the team in another way. This is why if you allow raid buffs, having them up 100% of the time is a good solution, as it doesn't favour one particular time for burst damage at all.

Another alternative is to weaken the raid buffs and make them line up less. In the past, all buffs only lined up every 6 minutes, mainly down to the 90 seconds and 180 seconds buffs that some jobs had. With fewer buff windows and them being weaker, you reduce the impact they have on the job's overall damage.

So, whilst you might not see the 2 minute meta as an issue, to many, it is and there are ways around it.

There is almost nothing that would hurt the expression of skill and make this game more stale than removing raid buffs. The difference between groups that consistently line everything up and groups that do not is huge. Removing team play from an mmo is a really bad idea, just like the idea of making jobs without burst moments.

Since raid buffs are necessary to add real depth of optimization to the game, burst will always be prioritized over sustain. There is nothing unique or interesting about adding burst to odd cooldown timings. The whole idea of removing 2 minute burst timings must be rooted in people wanting to play with no regard for synchronizing with their team. Some people just want to do their own thing, but why play an mmo then?

[Supersnow845]

There is almost nothing that would hurt the expression of skill and make this game more stale than removing raid buffs. The difference between groups that consistently line everything up and groups that do not is huge. Removing team play from an mmo is a really bad idea, just like the idea of making jobs without burst moments.

Since raid buffs are necessary to add real depth of optimization to the game, burst will always be prioritized over sustain. There is nothing unique or interesting about adding burst to odd cooldown timings. The whole idea of removing 2 minute burst timings must be rooted in people wanting to play with no regard for synchronizing with their team. Some people just want to do their own thing, but why play an mmo then?

“Synchronising burst in ShB required communication”

“Now everyone’s burst syncs by default”

“Burst synchronisation now requires communication”

Literally how did you manage to argue the literal reverse of the truth unironically, like I don’t even want ShB stale design but random burst CD’s back but you are literally saying that burst is good for an MMO because it requires communication then point to the modern design where your job’s CD’s do it for you

[Exmo]

Thread was flamebaiting, got it. TY for confirming. Block it is.

Why do so many people in this forum do this - take something completely out of context and deliberately misinterpret it. Do people even know they're acting in bad faith or is it subconscious by this point?