Picto is still the worst thing ever

[Supersnow845]

They aren't balanced in savage though, PCT was ahead by in 10% in cDPS in patch 7.05. And let me assure you, the 7.1 buffs did not buff BLM by anywhere close to that.

I keep seeing people complain that if BLM gets buffed too much then PCT won't have a niche. I don't mind BLM being a little bit behind PCT. I absolutely do mind when it's behind a lot in content that favours it (full uptime) and is absolutely getting wrecked in ultimate content?

How do the PCT defenders not see how much of a massive balance problem SE has on their hands right now? Like we could all see how absurd PCT was going to be with downtime as soon as the job was released. And instead of changing ultimate fight design or making changes to PCT, they went ahead and released a fight that massively favours one particular DPS job. Not just to the point of "NIN is better because it's ult" but "this job can singlehandedly carry phases by bringing 5k+ DPS to the entire raid".

Seriously this PCT cope needs to stop.

cDPS isn’t the be all and end all either, cDPS is specifically for speed kills because it represents a jobs ability to buff feed, comparison of a job that has good buff feed and bad buff feed from the perspective of general balance is much better done as rDPS in which they are almost equal. Looking at PCT and BLM together under cDPS to paint general balance pictures is like comparing SAM to NIN under aDPS and saying that’s justification for SAM to be nerfed because it’s so far ahead of NIN

But like I’ve said 4029592@6@3 times, I have no problem nerfing PCT, I’m pushing back against the age old BLM discussion of “I only do damage so I must do the most damage”, the only place PCT is doing the sort of damage that OP is losing their mind about is FRU, FRU specifically favours PCT and disfavours BLM, does that mean that PCT isn’t still too strong; of course not, PCT/DRK/AST/SCH are all disgustingly too strong right now. But it OP wants to complain about PCT dominating BLM then FRU is exactly not the content to point out this discrepency

[Realfoxy]

cDPS isn’t the be all and end all either, cDPS is specifically for speed kills because it represents a jobs ability to buff feed, comparison of a job that has good buff feed and bad buff feed from the perspective of general balance is much better done as rDPS in which they are almost equal. Looking at PCT and BLM together under cDPS to paint general balance pictures is like comparing SAM to NIN under aDPS and saying that’s justification for SAM to be nerfed because it’s so far ahead of NIN

But like I’ve said 4029592@6@3 times, I have no problem nerfing PCT, I’m pushing back against the age old BLM discussion of “I only do damage so I must do the most damage”, the only place PCT is doing the sort of damage that OP is losing their mind about is FRU, FRU specifically favours PCT and disfavours BLM, does that mean that PCT isn’t still too strong; of course not, PCT/DRK/AST/SCH are all disgustingly too strong right now. But it OP wants to complain about PCT dominating BLM then FRU is exactly not the content to point out this discrepency

Why would you ignore cDPS when balancing jobs though? It's not like you can just ignore the existence of raid buffs when it's very clear that the designers are trying to balance jobs with them in mind.

The definition of cDPS is the damage your job contributes to the raid - your own personal damage, the raid buffs you bring AND the damage that you feed into other people's raid buffs. For an individual player it's literally the damage you contribute to the raid.

So yes, we should look at cDPS, and yes, BLM is still losing out in full uptime Savage to PCT.

And look, if PCT players want to lose all utility and compete with BLM for top DPS, that's fine by me. Hell, we could even have BLM ahead in rDPS (favoring situations like uncoordinated PFs or TOP P4 where raid buffs are not as important) while PCT is ahead in cDPS (favoring situations where burst alignment is important). But looking at Savage stats, that's very much not the case (ignoring 7.1 because no one's playing in 7.1).

[Supersnow845]

Why would you ignore cDPS when balancing jobs though? It's not like you can just ignore the existence of raid buffs when it's very clear that the designers are trying to balance jobs with them in mind.

The definition of cDPS is the damage your job contributes to the raid - your own personal damage, the raid buffs you bring AND the damage that you feed into other people's raid buffs. For an individual player it's literally the damage you contribute to the raid.

So yes, we should look at cDPS, and yes, BLM is still losing out in full uptime Savage to PCT.

And look, if PCT players want to lose all utility and compete with BLM for top DPS, that's fine by me. Hell, we could even have BLM ahead in rDPS (favoring situations like uncoordinated PFs or TOP P4 where raid buffs are not as important) while PCT is ahead in cDPS (favoring situations where burst alignment is important). But looking at Savage stats, that's very much not the case (ignoring 7.1 because no one's playing in 7.1).

I’m not saying ignore it I’m saying it’s not the only relevant measure of balance because high performance in cDPS is reliant on comp and clear time. Looking at the top cDPS parses is like looking at the number 1 speed kill and going “yep that’s the number one speed kill” then balancing everything around that. It’s not meaningless but it’s not the only important stat either. rDPS gives a better representation of average performance when under the situation of kill time and buff comp being not under the control of everyone simultaneously

Regardless you just bought the point back to again what I’m trying to push back against “if PCT wants to lose all its utility and compete with BLM”

If your only identity is “I need to better than everyone else or I’m useless” that’s a flawed identity and needs to change

[Carighan]

Why would you ignore cDPS when balancing jobs though?

I think the point was to look at (mostly) rDPS instead, as it presents a better overall picture of how jobs interact and perform in the context of such interactions, instead of focusing nearly-exclusively on the very upper end of speed kill performance.

That doesn't change that Picto needs a pretty hard nerf, but just saying, cDPS isn't some magical metric that is universally better.