Dual purpse classes/jobs

[Enfarious]

So even after the update, and proposed patches up to 1.22b WAR remains the only job that can truly dual purpose, does that continue it on the path of OP?

What I mean by this is:
With the switch of a stance a WAR goes from competent DD to competent Tank and back again. No other job can do this, not truly, I've seen/heard the argument that any job can tank, ok so they can, but I mean actual tanking, not "wonder if this can be done" 1 time tanking like ppl did for whm and blm to show off.

MNK maybe w/ some minor adjustments, eva buff during FoW enough to actually dodge Primals, a little more def in FoE.
DRG ... yeah that'll happen, gimme a pet I can stick between me and the mob
PLD gets tanking, assuming these patches give enough, but still not a competent DD
BRD I can't say alot here, I've only seen one play and it's a friend in my LS we grind together on PLD and BRD, I'm the PLD, and the dmg is impressive for a support job, but we're both only 40s and not geared for EG so someday I'll get to see it up close from a friend.

WHM and BLM I'd leave out, but let's face it, they can both DD well, BLM sublimely.
Guess WHM also fills as a healer don't know if we'd count it as dual-role though.

[indira]

they need to just make jobs sole purpose & keep classes rounded like they are.

[Enfarious]

I agree, every job should be focused on a single thing and be truly expert at that thing. This thing where they "want" war to be multi purpose even tho every other job is single purpose just doesn't make sense to me.

[Vaymathias]

I agree, every job should be focused on a single thing and be truly expert at that thing. This thing where they "want" war to be multi purpose even tho every other job is single purpose just doesn't make sense to me.

Am I the only one who sees this as the "FFXI NIN" argument all over again? "They need to do high damage so that they don't lose hate." >.<

[Enfarious]

Am I the only one who sees this as the "FFXI NIN" argument all over again? "They need to do high damage so that they don't lose hate." >.<

Not where I'm going no, I don't think a job should be a DD and Tank, but rather that every job should be single focus.

Nin was failed at conception, the original plan behind it, from what I remember reading was a melee support class, able to function much like a rdm, only with a real ability to be front lines. That obviously is NOT the way players saw it, SE adjusted to suit, a nin never had to do high dmg to hold hate, not a good one anyway, but rather had to have solid ninjutsu, it's enfeebles netted more hate than most other things it did.

My argument on the WAR front in this game is that it's the only class that is being designed to fill 2 roles with equal skill, all the other jobs are designed with 1 role being focused on. Why do all jobs not have equal ability to play more than one role?

[Frein]

WAR is not a true DD, so it's more like 1.5 roles. I think this type of design with slight flexibility is much better than forcing rigid party roles on each job.

[Kitfox]

WAR only fits the tank role, they just happen to do decent damage while at it. WAR is not as good as other DDs in a DD slot, because they have absolutely no enmity reducing abilities, or dmg boosting abilities (compare to power surge / fists of fire / Raging Shot even). Even MRD is probably better as a single target DD when they're not tanking.

[Enfarious]

Really though?
A WAR can drop a group of mobs in the time it takes a mnk or drg to drop 1 while not doing bosses that's significant, enough so that drg and mnk are mostly useless. Then when you get to a boss/NM war turns on the tank and proves pld worthless.

So I'll say yes, single target WAR falls short on dmg, but the reality here is when a group is facing a single target the war is tanking it so it's irrelevant when facing the groups otw to that single target the war is putting them down faster than any other job, except WHM.

That's 2 roles covered better than other jobs can do them, run out on lnc/drg and get 10 mobs do the same on war, tell me which works out better.

My point continues to be, war and NO other job can dual purpose. It doesn't make sense. As much as I love melee jobs, and don't really want to see anything nerfed things are not equal or even close to it.

[DoctorMog]

Actually, a good BRD can DD and do a very good job at support.

But too many bards would rather DD than heal/stoneskin/double song/rebuff/dd

Enhancing magic potency / healing magic potency / MP build IS an option I haven't seen any other bards do.

[Enfarious]

They can DD and support, but their support isn't comparable to a WHM, it's a role unto itself.
I've never payed much attention to a BRDs dmg output, tho I imagine it can be substantial if it's anything like rng from XI.
But I somehow don't think that their dual purpose really stacks up to a war, war puts others out of business, brd keeps others in business.
So maybe it's more a problem w/ what roles war plays. I'm still inclined to think that no job should be dual purpose, jobs were, unless I'm horribly mistaken, specializations from a class, specializtion typically means PIMP at 1 thing, not good at 2.

I won't mention that I think brd being based off arc was a horrible thing, I can't think of any time that that's been done before, brd has always been and "song and dance" rogue job, going all the way back to original D&D, I know this isn't D&D just saying though.