Dual purpse classes/jobs

[Enfarious]

So even after the update, and proposed patches up to 1.22b WAR remains the only job that can truly dual purpose, does that continue it on the path of OP?

What I mean by this is:
With the switch of a stance a WAR goes from competent DD to competent Tank and back again. No other job can do this, not truly, I've seen/heard the argument that any job can tank, ok so they can, but I mean actual tanking, not "wonder if this can be done" 1 time tanking like ppl did for whm and blm to show off.

MNK maybe w/ some minor adjustments, eva buff during FoW enough to actually dodge Primals, a little more def in FoE.
DRG ... yeah that'll happen, gimme a pet I can stick between me and the mob
PLD gets tanking, assuming these patches give enough, but still not a competent DD
BRD I can't say alot here, I've only seen one play and it's a friend in my LS we grind together on PLD and BRD, I'm the PLD, and the dmg is impressive for a support job, but we're both only 40s and not geared for EG so someday I'll get to see it up close from a friend.

WHM and BLM I'd leave out, but let's face it, they can both DD well, BLM sublimely.
Guess WHM also fills as a healer don't know if we'd count it as dual-role though.

[indira]

they need to just make jobs sole purpose & keep classes rounded like they are.

[Duelle]

they need to just make jobs sole purpose & keep classes rounded like they are.

The problem with this is that several have multiple facets that can be explored. Tank (Cecil) or Holy Sword Skill face-melting (Agrias) Paladin. Tank or DD Warrior. Red Mage as a whole. And so on.

I don't want WAR to lose DD or tanking ability. By that token, the only option would be to look at the other jobs and see what they can do outside of their proposed singular role.

Also false.

Bards throughout D&D and RPGs have been the jacks of various weapons and fighting styles.

Indeed. Bards in older RPGs (Bard's Tale) were pretty badass. D&D introduced them as ridiculously versatile and VERY combat-competent. The RPGs that remember this built up further on it. I often mention Leliana from Dragon Age because she is the harbinger of the Bard as a spy/assassin, which is how I look at our very own Thancred.

[Enfarious]

I agree, every job should be focused on a single thing and be truly expert at that thing. This thing where they "want" war to be multi purpose even tho every other job is single purpose just doesn't make sense to me.

[Vaymathias]

I agree, every job should be focused on a single thing and be truly expert at that thing. This thing where they "want" war to be multi purpose even tho every other job is single purpose just doesn't make sense to me.

Am I the only one who sees this as the "FFXI NIN" argument all over again? "They need to do high damage so that they don't lose hate." >.<

[Enfarious]

Am I the only one who sees this as the "FFXI NIN" argument all over again? "They need to do high damage so that they don't lose hate." >.<

Not where I'm going no, I don't think a job should be a DD and Tank, but rather that every job should be single focus.

Nin was failed at conception, the original plan behind it, from what I remember reading was a melee support class, able to function much like a rdm, only with a real ability to be front lines. That obviously is NOT the way players saw it, SE adjusted to suit, a nin never had to do high dmg to hold hate, not a good one anyway, but rather had to have solid ninjutsu, it's enfeebles netted more hate than most other things it did.

My argument on the WAR front in this game is that it's the only class that is being designed to fill 2 roles with equal skill, all the other jobs are designed with 1 role being focused on. Why do all jobs not have equal ability to play more than one role?

[illriginalized]

I agree, every job should be focused on a single thing and be truly expert at that thing. This thing where they "want" war to be multi purpose even tho every other job is single purpose just doesn't make sense to me.

WAR is a tank. WAR is a DD.

Get over it. Otherwise go play some other game.

[Enfarious]

Hold the phone. You're saying that aside from WAR, jobs are suited to one specific specialization?

...Sounds like things are working as advertised. Nothing to see here, folks.

Yeah except the part where war isn't ... or everything else isn't?

WAR is a tank. WAR is a DD.

Get over it. Otherwise go play some other game.

Say something productive or stfu

Moving on though.
Someone nailed it, I just don't see why one job is successful as 2 roles but no others are.
Points made about other jobs having other purposes, except drg (poor poor drg), those purposes aside from brd aren't really put to use, yes whm buffs and heals, by my way of thinking that's support which is a single role. Perhaps that's where the real problem lies, I didn't say "Nerf WAR it's the only way" I just said "it's broken as is".

Maybe I misspoke about brds throughout history in rpgs, perhaps they've always been awesome DDs, ones that used heavy dmg weapons rather than rogue like tactics, I just can't seem to think of any. I did mention "song and dance ROGUES" before though didn't I? Rogue covering roles like thf, assassin, and various other "dirty dealing, back stabbing" DD jobs. I can't remember a brd that ran w/ a g.axe or a g.swd, I may just be missing something my bad then. Not to say they couldn't do those things, they just didn't and mostly still don't, isn't really the point of the thread but oh well lol

[Duelle]

Someone nailed it, I just don't see why one job is successful as 2 roles but no others are.
Points made about other jobs having other purposes, except drg (poor poor drg), those purposes aside from brd aren't really put to use, yes whm buffs and heals, by my way of thinking that's support which is a single role. Perhaps that's where the real problem lies, I didn't say "Nerf WAR it's the only way" I just said "it's broken as is".

I'd be in favor of separating WAR's DD and tank sides so that the party bringing the WAR is either bringing a tank or bringing a DPS, but not both.

[Frein]

WAR is not a true DD, so it's more like 1.5 roles. I think this type of design with slight flexibility is much better than forcing rigid party roles on each job.