Suggestion Identity for Phy Range Jobs

[BabyYoda]

I way thinking a bit on how we can fix current Phy range identity I would draw it this way:

1- MCH:
Attack range is High
90% of the weaponskills walk casting (PVP)
High damage focus on machines more

2- BRD:
focusing more on songs part
Attack range is High
mix between walk casting (PVP) and actual casting.

3- DNC:
Keep the buff identity
Attack range is medium (it is range but having some skills that need to be done melee)
High move speed
ability to extend buffs by moving nearby allies


what do you suggest for Phy range?

[mallleable]

Yeah, I mostly agree except I feel like for BRD its songs have become paradoxically too important right now in terms of damage contribution, and rotation mechanics, especially in terms of death recovery, and to a certain extent, solo play -- like BRD barely a playable job with out having a song running. I think BRD needs more damage that is independent of its songs as well as continuing to improve song usability.

[BabyYoda]

Yeah, I mostly agree except I feel like for BRD its songs have become paradoxically too important right now in terms of damage contribution, and rotation mechanics, especially in terms of death recovery, and to a certain extent, solo play -- like BRD barely a playable job with out having a song running. I think BRD needs more damage that is independent of its songs as well as continuing to improve song usability.

What I mean by BRD focusing on songs is how we can have a system for songs to be performed..

DNC must press standard dance then have to see the RNG buttons shine.

I want BRD to press different tunes to perform song(similar to ninjitsu system).. each 60s have mini game song to empower current buff even more.

I want DNC and BRD to have more rDPS than nDPS

[mallleable]

What I mean by BRD focusing on songs is how we can have a system for songs to be performed..

DNC must press standard dance then have to see the RNG buttons shine.

I want BRD to press different tunes to perform song(similar to ninjitsu system).. each 60s have mini game song to empower current buff even more.

I want DNC and BRD to have more rDPS than nDPS

Oh I see. It would be cool if the game could handle simultaneous inputs so we could play chords both in performance mode, and in combat.

[Valence]

More rDPS than nDPS is crazy and wouldnt work in the current system. It would also essentially completely nullify their viability in other types of content like solo or especially deep dungeons / eureka / bozja if even supports can deal more damage than their squishy asses.

I way thinking a bit on how we can fix current Phy range identity I would draw it this way:

1- MCH:
Attack range is High
90% of the weaponskills walk casting (PVP)
High damage focus on machines more

2- BRD:
focusing more on songs part
Attack range is High
mix between walk casting (PVP) and actual casting.

3- DNC:
Keep the buff identity
Attack range is medium (it is range but having some skills that need to be done melee)
High move speed
ability to extend buffs by moving nearby allies


what do you suggest for Phy range?

So, essentially going for the path where all ranged should be casters then? Is this really strengthening job identity or homogenizing it?

What does high range vs medium range actually address?

[Ramiee]

What does high range vs medium range actually address?

Going to assume medium range attacks deal more damage so it's like a range tax answer.

[Valence]

But what would you gain from high range attacks in the current encounters? You play at melee or medium range 99.9% of the time...

If the whole model actually embraced mechanics that have multiple range bands in mind where the closest to the target the higher damage attacks you could use, then sure though. But it doesn't.

[BabyYoda]

More rDPS than nDPS is crazy and wouldnt work in the current system. It would also essentially completely nullify their viability in other types of content like solo or especially deep dungeons / eureka / bozja if even supports can deal more damage than their squishy asses.



So, essentially going for the path where all ranged should be casters then? Is this really strengthening job identity or homogenizing it?

What does high range vs medium range actually address?

There should be a mechanism to increase buffs power while in 4 party member or solo..

Miduim range is having range skills and melee skills instead of having walking casting removing range tax completely from the game and forever

DNC have 3 dashes that can be utilized to get in range and out of range

[BabyYoda]

But what would you gain from high range attacks in the current encounters? You play at melee or medium range 99.9% of the time...

If the whole model actually embraced mechanics that have multiple range bands in mind where the closest to the target the higher damage attacks you could use, then sure though. But it doesn't.

It is like you save melee attacks after the mechanics.. you don't have to be melee all the time it's 50% 50%

[Connor]

Bard should get cast times on its songs again and have them turned back into spells. Make Paean/Minne GCD spells. Return Foe Requiem. Make them drain MP to limit the duration.

Frankly i don’t see the point in ‘just give it more dps’. I mean, first of all we all know that’s never going to happen; we’ll get a 10 potency increase on Empyreal Arrow and that’ll be it for ‘more dps’. I mean, Bard is already fairly high in rDPS so more nDPS would just unbalance it against all other non-blm/Picto ranged and break the balance, would it not?

SE will never risk Bards having good dps after the 4X Bard fiasco at Coil release, they’ve been absolutely fucking terrified of the job ever since lol. So even if it did get ‘more personal dps’, it would be such a minuscule increase it would be completely unnoticeable unless you’re on a PC specifically running metrics. That’s not even mentioning that it would just make Bard laugh even harder at Machinist’s inferior dps contribution lol.

At least if they increase the value of its defensive / non-offensive abilities like Paean/Minne it might have a chance of being worth bringing over a Summoner / Red Mage with Raise. Returning Foe Requiem would still give it a slight overall dps increase; MP drain and long uptime could prevent it being cannibalised by 120-meta. Cast times on songs balances the main three while giving more leeway on rotating them with no cool-down.

I mean, Bard has been at the absolute bottom of the personal dps charts since its inception, and that only changed (slightly) when Dancer was added. Does it really matter if they stay there? Giving every phys ranged cast times is homogenisation, sure, but isn’t making them all even more heavily pDPS oriented homogenisation as well? We have Machinist for phys ranged who want extra high personal dps without having to support the party in any way.