Tanks holding fights hostage in Roulettes

[kaynide]

This comes ups enough for me to have a canned response to it.. so just imo:

Don’t hate the player, hate the game.

It’s not a player’s fault the game is badly designed in this way. Also, nothing stopping you (any “you”, not anyone specific) from asking to reset.

1) ToS: It's not against policy to solo the fight

It is not against the ToS to solo a fight once the party wipes.

People can disagree on how to play, and can/should discuss it in a civil manner. Do note that specifically telling a player, including a tank, that they’re not allowed to play their job as it is designed IS against ToS. Asking and discussing is encouraged, forcing others to play how you want to play is not.

And before you say “but the tank is forcing you to sit and watch!”, they are not. It is not their job to keep you alive. And it is certainly not their fault that you died.

If a healer refuses to raise you, then sure, you might have a case.

Now if you wanna talk about what’s polite, then sure, the tank probably SHOULD kill themselves and rest the fight, but it is important to distinguish between set rules and polite manners.

2) My solution: Give Tanks Raise

Hear me out:

The problem (including #healerstrike) is that the healer role is just not that fun or challenging, and generally unneeded for a LOT of content.

Imho, it is because the devs painted themselves into a corner:
1) If you make it so healers are crucial, then there's too much pressure on when/if they die, which..
2) Makes people not want to play healer so...
3) You make the tank able to survive without a healer, even though it takes forever.

This is easily alleviated by giving raise to more jobs so that the healer can die without much penalty, as long as someone else can "save the day" by raising the healer.

This would allow enemies to hit harder and allow healers to die if they screw up, but not cause a single healer death to sour the duty for everyone (aka healer dies and we all die...or we all just sit here for 10 minutes waiting for the tank to solo)

3) Tl;DR:

1) Make Mobs hit a LOT harder. Like the vuln debuff you get for not avoiding a boss attack? Straight up 25% damage per stack (4th time no dodge? you 100% dead!)
2) Give tanks raise
3) Allow healers to die, and be raised mid boss.

This makes healers:
A) need to focus on healing over DPS, even in trash packs
B) makes the tank survive at best 20% of a boss’s hp bar. They would NEED to focus on raising their healer.

[Toutatis]

Judging from this dudes signature, he just hates tanks and wants to punish them because how of healers have been treated.

I love to play tank but he is right. Atm high level tanks have a ridiculous self sustain to the point that I consider them broken. It should not be possible to clear synched and current content with just the tanks. The worse is that it doesn’t even take skill nor great gear, it’s just that easy. On normal content, you can even collect vuln stacks for fun and ignore them. The balance is totally off.

[EponaTBHSMH]

I feel like for normal content, time is the biggest factor in deciding if a tank should solo a boss after the rest of the party is dead or not.

I believe if the boss has 50-80% HP left when your party is dead, soloing it is not smart at all and wastes time

Of course, I experienced exceptions to this rule with the first boss of Straybourough for example.
I've had a party where we wiped twice, so on the 3rd time when everyone else died, i decided that i need to just lock in and kite all the mascots as GNB, it was very slow but mascots are much easier to dodge when they target only you, which made me have less of a hard time than when the rest of my party was alive.

It was very slow but I was convinced that if I didnt solo those 40% we would just wipe again so I think in these situations that's the better decision

[Lollerblades]

Tanks just need their self sustain nerfing. I've never understood the selfishness to force 6/7 other people to watch you solo a boss. Fair play if it's at like 5% - but most cases it's not.

[Larirawiel]

Genuinely haven't seen this at all since DT launched and I've been doing content ranging from normal dungeons to savage almost every day.

I have seen this two times already in DT. And if more people will reach level 100, it will happen more often.

Tanks just need their self sustain nerfing. I've never understood the selfishness to force 6/7 other people to watch you solo a boss. Fair play if it's at like 5% - but most cases it's not.

I guess, they will nerf the content as a whole. Because no dead people = no tanks soloing the bosses.


Cheers

[Anzaman]

Tanks just need their self sustain nerfing. I've never understood the selfishness to force 6/7 other people to watch you solo a boss. Fair play if it's at like 5% - but most cases it's not.

Especially since it's very easy to cleave rest of the party down first.

Was doing weekly raids earlier, and tank accidentally aimed the attack towards party, killing two players instantly, while they themselves barely lost any health.

[Plumerian_Ariadust]

This is easily alleviated by giving raise to more jobs so that the healer can die without much penalty, as long as someone else can "save the day" by raising the healer.

There's a perfectly good item in-game already called Phoenix Down they should at least make this useable during combat and people can only use one per pull.

[TBerry]

There's a perfectly good item in-game already called Phoenix Down they should at least make this useable during combat and people can only use one per pull.

Phoenix Down doesn't work during fights, though.

[Zairava]

Phoenix Down doesn't work during fights, though.

They covered that in the second part of their quote.

That aside...

As a tank main in mmo's for going on 12 years now I gotta say:

Last 5-10% is one thing, but for what OP is getting at is obnoxious.

Any one of them could have left that instance and they would have been completely justified in doing so.

Reading "just don't die" is beginning to become a bit of a pet peeve regarding this topic.

Fuck the people new to the instance, fuck the people who are still learning, and fuck the ones who just learn at a slower pace than others, huh? Hell, mistakes just happen. Everyone makes them from time to time.

It doesn't take some massive amount of brain power to use your mindless short CD's that carry you through everything not EX or savage, you aren't some benevolent highly skilled game genie. You're able to do this because SE keeps power-creeping the hell out of the tanks.

I play tank because I want to be the tank. Not to play god and waste 15-30 minutes of 3-6 other people's time and possibly ruin another player's experience because all they got to do was eat asphalt instead of actually playing the game.

[Ketojan]

The people saying just don’t die are either trolling or woefully ignorant to how the game works (or maybe just rude). There is unavoidable dmg, if your healer gets a stack marker but your little baby team don’t stand with you then the healer will die, making all the raid wides that happen kill the team if no one will mitigate. On top of that if the team is so fresh they are probably just getting hit by anything they don't expect, so give them a chance to retry. Crazy to have to type this out when it should be obvious.

People used to be more patient and willing to help on this game, but the rise of impatient gaming is here to stay I guess.