Tanks holding fights hostage in Roulettes

[Karious]

Thinking this is acceptable advice is a skill issue

The people who can't clear the fight seem to actually have the skill issue.

Cheers

[Larirawiel]

Thinking this is acceptable advice is a skill issue

It is an acceptable advice because it works.


Cheers

[Erinellza]

Yeah, I've seen this a few times in clumsy PUGs. I just alt+F4 and do my dailies in my other MMOs. I refuse to sit there like a clown for half an hour.

[GTK0HLK]

Its not faster to die and restart. Your party was weak and died, there is no promise of a sudden gain of competence next pull.
By comparison, you know what your capable of as a tank, thus its lower risk to just solo it and get the guaranteed move on rather than be a tutorial bot for your party

Thats how I feel about it anyway.

Holy Strawman.

You're working under the assumption that the party doesn't know what they're doing.

Even if they know what they're doing.

If they're simply taking too damn long, it'll just eventually fail.

Even parties that know what to do eventually run out.

Cause this will still apply in content where the game is more balanced.

Let alone in MSQ Tier Content that were mostly talking about.

No one thinks you're impressive if you out last the boss when you're Solo/Duo/Trio. and it takes 2 minutes for 1% health to tick away. and the boss has 15% health left. (or any variance)

Also, Conveniently ignore the part where I state. if shits hemorrhaging hp real fast. then feel free to commit. long as you don't take too long.

[Inserting Basic Competency doesn't Fkn Matter. That's inserting subjectives into what is cut and dry taking too long. cause ego. About as dumb as YPYT.]

[FudoMyoo]

Another solution, get a VPN play in Japanese datacenters.

[Dakimakura]

This is why we should give one of the tanks Raise.
I vote DRK.
Imagine being the last alive as a tank, res a healer, LB3 if available, you just allowed for a second wind for the group.

[Larirawiel]

Another solution, get a VPN play in Japanese datacenters.

You do not need a VPN to play on JP servers.




Cheers

[Evo1171]

Gonna play devil's advocate here, nobody owns a monopoly on wasting time, in your eyes they wasted 20 minutes of your time, but to them the rest of the team already wasted 20 minutes of their time, if you're doing roulettes they're already pushing 2-3 hours so when a group is struggling why wouldn't you guarantee that they won't waste more time by just clearing, this is going to be the obvious option for a lot of people.

When it comes to the actual players, if they were just wiping on the stack mechanic this would be at least the 3rd run since the stack happens around 4:30 seconds into the fight, but we can also tell that at least 3 people were dead even before stacks since they all have weakness, this means that it wasn't the stack mechanic that was being failed, but likely also a lot of others, this would give the tanks even less confidence that people will even be able to clear, this trial is a trust, people should be able to determine their own skill level and whether they should be doing content in a trust or with other players, it's the same in savage where if you're the one guy who's wasting 7 other people's time you should probably, out of respect, join a party that's at a closer skill level to you.

this was right after adds phase where i believe the boss had around 50-60% left and the clock was at 37 min left when they finally killed it so we spent about 30 minutes in there total after 2 pulls

Also with the timer, you stated in a previous post that the fight ended at 37 on the clock, looking at the screenshot this is the start of lightning phase which is 2/4 minutes after stacks start, this means that at most they took 6/8 minutes to kill the boss, not 30, let's say it was a typo and you mean't to say 27, that's still less time than they already had wasted before that, and still not 30.

In the first post you said you wiped 2 to 3 times, but then you clarified in a following post that you only wiped twice, this is functionally untrue, the screenshot is taken during lightning phase transition which only happens one more time in the fight 2/4 minutes after stacks, this is the third time you've been disingenuous in your post, it didn't take 30 minutes, you yourself said that, stack wasn't the only problem mechanic, weakness on 3 players shows that, and you tried to downplay the amount of wipes, the fight timeline shows that, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that the post was likely emotionally charged and you were angry and wanted to make these tanks look as bad as possible but having these logical inconsistencies doesn't help your argument and ends up discrediting you as a reliable narrator.

[Evo1171]

Now when it comes to people giving armchair advice about how to solve these issues, enrage wouldn't work in casual content, in fact, valigarmanda already has a soft enrage where they throw out the same mechanic back to back until it dies, the thing is that there are people in the game who would be functionally unable to clear the fights, this would lead to even more animosity towards new or poor performing players and would end up splitting the community more than it already does. Someone said make it so that if only 1 player is alive the boss gets a damage bonus, this also doesn't work because there are 2 tanks in trials and raids, putting it on when there's 2 players also doesn't work because one of those players could easily be a healer waiting until lb3 pops, these solutions would all add massive problems.

I don't think that tank sustain is necessarily the only problem, they have to tune these fights so that they can be cleared by the lowest common denominator, which means that if you perform the mechanics you will generally take almost no damage, this includes tanks, autos barely tickle in normal content because they don't want a tank to take a mechanic and then die to autos because they weren't healed in time, I think it comes down to them wanting to make fights challenging mechanically but still push people through. Personally I don't think this issue is so easily solved, tanks were given so much sustain because a lot of the time in dungeon trash pulls they would die due to poor performing healers or improper cooldown usage, so the whole dungeon hinged on a healer being able to perform, but as the game has gotten bigger, the toolkits have too, and the skill levels of players are much more varied, it's likely they didn't want normal content hinging on one/two players so much that something could be unclearable.

I also want to make it clear I'm not defending what they did, I'm just trying to show that it's not something as clear cut as people make it out to be.

Edit: Also want to note that they objectively in this case didn't waste time if op is to be believed, they cleared 6-8 minutes after the rest of the party wiped at best, this is if they died as soon as stacks started, and Valigarmanda takes 8-9 minutes without people dying.

[LilyPendragon]

The people who can't clear the fight seem to actually have the skill issue.

Cheers

Heaven forbid first timers can't clear immediately upon seeing the fight.

They need to have enrages in normal content to stop this nonsense happening. Either that or severely nerf tank self sustain. Ideally both.