Are we destroying "our own" game?

[chizLemons]

You're clueless if you think gam devs make their msq/story content based on twitch.


Steam reviews mean nothing in this day and age. Games like Elden Ring's DLC was "mixed" for a while because the game was "too hard" for the underdeveloped brain players. What ultimately matters in mmos in this day and age is the long term content; the real question is what will people do post msq until the next expansion? Will we have to wait until 7.3 for relics to give us long term content? Will 7.1 be devoid of long term playable content? That's what actually matters in mmos. square enix can't win when it comes to msq, there will always be some haters one way or the other; they shouldn't even care.

So you're saying neither the forum opinions, the influencer opinions nor the steam reviews matter. What feedback do YOU think should matter to the devs, then?
If you don't care about the MSQ, then don't come complain about it. Let the people that care do, and go make your own thread about relics or whatever.

[Rekh]

"Steam reviews mean nothing"

Your original claim was that these forums were the only place that was producing negative feedback. Now, it's "this other place producing negative feedback doesn't actually matter because x reason"

Which argument is it? Fortunately I'm not that clueless to not spot the shift in the goalposts.

Yes, yes you are clueless

You're creating your own goalposts and moving them yourself and then accusing me of moving it. Nice try.
My original statement was an observation between forum and ingame; nowhere was it about steam/other locations. The steam statement was in regards to someone bringing up steam after the fact. If you can't follow a discussion and the sequence thereof then there's some issues you need to look into there haha.

So you're saying neither the forum opinions, the influencer opinions nor the steam reviews matter. What feedback do YOU think should matter to the devs, then?
If you don't care about the MSQ, then don't come complain about it. Let the people that care do, and go make your own thread about relics or whatever.

Who are you talking to? I loved the DT MSQ.

Furthermore, no, when it comes to MSQ they shouldn't care, there's no way to please what everyone's looking for in an msq. Scientifically msq will always be "mixed reviews" with only the outliers being "mostly positive." The only type of feedback they should care about is what occupies 80% of the game's playtime, which is battle content, housing, and the other miscellaneous content types. Those types of content is what keeps your customers subbed. MSQ-only enjoyers are not long term subscribers. They'll always buy your initial expansion no matter what since they're story lovers. Yes, they might resub for 1 month 6 months later, but is that really your bread and butter subscriber as a company? I'd say no. If you're a msq enjoyer but you also stay subbed for other content then you prove my point that the devs shouldn't care about msq feedback and focus more on battle content/other type of content feedback which are more crucial/high priority.

[chizLemons]

Who are you talking to? I loved the DT MSQ.

Furthermore, no, when it comes to MSQ they shouldn't care, there's no way to please what everyone's looking for in an msq. Scientifically msq will always be "mixed reviews" with only the outliers being "mostly positive." The only type of feedback they should care about is what occupies 80% of the game's playtime, which is battle content, housing, and the other miscellaneous content types. Those types of content is what keeps your customers subbed. MSQ-only enjoyers are not long term subscribers. They'll always buy your initial expansion no matter what since they're story lovers. Yes, they might resub for 1 month 6 months later, but is that really your bread and butter subscriber as a company? I'd say no. If you're a msq enjoyer but you also stay subbed for other content then you prove my point that the devs shouldn't care about msq feedback and focus more on battle content/other type of content feedback which are more crucial/high priority.

You "loved the MSQ", yet you say the only content that MATTERS is everything else. So, no, I don't think you CARE about the MSQ. If you did, you would know how valuable feedback is, and would be able to at least understand where it comes from.

[Rekh]

You "loved the MSQ", yet you say the only content that MATTERS is everything else. So, no, I don't think you CARE about the MSQ. If you did, you would know how valuable feedback is, and would be able to at least understand where it comes from.

I sincerely hope you understand that no story whether in a book, movie, or video game will appeal to everyone, right? The main difference in xiv is that it's an mmo and by its nature mmos don't ride out a story between content patches. You can't msq your away from july 23, 2024 until whenever 7.1 comes out which is most likely late this year. If this was a single player game like FFXVI then railing against the msq/story and giving feedback on it would be valuable, but in an mmo you will always get mixed reviews when it comes to that, specially the bigger the mmo becomes.

square enix knows what will hold dawntrail together will be all content outside of msq, as it's an mmo at the end of the day.

There's a reason that a lot of those threads are getting heavily dissenting voices. Historically a lot of people have ignored the forums as it's something of an archaic method of communication in modern society, kind of a relic of bygone times. However, Shadowbringers and Endwalker brought a bunch of changes that most people never wanted or asked for, and eventually SE stated that they are focusing on the forums for feedback. There are some very loud individuals with some really awful takes claiming to represent the community at large. All the conflict you are seeing is largely just because the player base is sick and tired of being misrepresented by the people claiming to 'represent the casual community' with their anecdotal experiences and individual preferences. There are many people that are enjoying the content of the game, it's just hard to see that because there's also a battle going on against the people that would squander all the good that has come out of this expansion. Essentially we are no longer letting people get away with sabotaging the game.

Great points; and I have to agree; it takes a nuanced and objective approach to really tackle Endwalker, the issues with it and the release of Dawntrail as its own product and the separation between content types and how they measure up.

[Ruris]

Yes, yes you are clueless

My original statement was an observation between forum and ingame; nowhere was it about steam/other locations. The steam statement was in regards to someone bringing up steam after the fact. If you can't follow a discussion and the sequence thereof then there's some issues you need to look into there haha.

"No, you!!" isn't going to work here, I'm afraid:

Normally when msq/story/content is bad it gets expressed in all locations where the community exists, including in-game; but that's not what I'm seeing with DT.

My original statement was an observation between forum and ingame; nowhere was it about steam/other locations.

You are literally contradicting yourself. I'm not sure if you're realising you're even doing it. But then, your original post that I responded to in the first place was pretty abysmally presented, so par for the course.

[Rekh]

"No, you!!" isn't going to work here, I'm afraid:





You are literally contradicting yourself. I'm not sure if you're realising you're even doing it. But then, your original post that I responded to in the first place was pretty abysmally presented, so par for the course.

Haha you'd be perfect at cnn/fox news who love misquoting or piecing together different quotes to suit your misguided attemps. Let me find my original post and put it into the real context. Context seems to be some that's hard to understand for someone like you it seems.

When taken as a full quote which can be referenced the statement speaks for itself. The first statement refers to difference between forum and ingame and the second refers to an additional observation which can be found outside of the game. Steam and metacritic are not the only places where the community exists; if you didn't know, now you know.

This is the issue with people like you who see everything in black and white; words such as context and nuance seem to be foreign concepts, when in reality those concepts are the most important factors in any discussion.

[Ruris]

Haha you'd be perfect at cnn/fox news who love misquoting or piecing together different quotes to suit your misguided attemps. Let me find my original post and put it into the real context. Context seems to be some that's hard to understand for someone like you it seems.

Normally when msq/story/content is bad it gets expressed in all locations where the community exists, including in-game;

"Feedback is expressed in all* locations where the community exists, including** in-game" which means all* locations and not limited to** in game.

My original statement was an observation between forum and ingame; nowhere was it about steam/other locations.

and then you whittle down your orignial post, outright contradicting it to remove Steam from inclusion. Your original comment includes Steam by nature of including all communities. But you claim that your original post never included Steam. Read it again.

I'm done. As much as I'm going to miss conversing with a person who struggles to keep "haha"; "you're clueless"; "this is hard for you to understand", out of their post, I won't.

[Rekh]

There are a lot of locations where it is disussed though. I don't know how many times that was already said and even my tone is starting to get sharper now because this take is so often brought up and already answered.
There is the forum (english and japanese), there is reddit, there is YouTube, there is twitch, there is 4chan / 5chan and several japanese sites, there is steam, there are other mmo-forums.
The story is the big thing of this expansion being discussed with lots and lots of back and force.

There doesn't seem to be any majority on either vocal site to be found.

I get the anectodal part and players not encountering stuff (I encountered negativity ingame) and i get liking the story. that's absolutely ok and no one asks those to chnage theri opinion.

But all of you should stop already with this stupid take of only this forum being unhappy with the MSQ. It doesn't help your standpoint at all.

Edit:
After reading your other responses it's clear you are just a troll trying to get a kick of antagonising people.
Won't waste my time on you any further.

Couldn't stand to see someone liking DT msq? It's ok, you'll live.

"Feedback is expressed in all* locations where the community exists, including** in-game" which means all* locations and not limited to** in game.



and then you whittle down your orignial post, outright contradicting it to remove Steam from inclusion. Your original comment includes Steam by nature of including all communities. But you claim that your original post never included Steam. Read it again.

I'm done. As much as I'm going to miss conversing with a person who struggles to keep "haha"; "you're cluleless"; "this is hard for you to understand", out of their post, I won't.

This is you right now
You'd be a good salesman/woman of broken records since you continue to not quote my entire posts. But you do you; you think you're slick but you're not.

It's not my fault that you pretend that you know what you're reading when you're only half quoting and/or piecing together quotes in certain ways to suit your empty arguments.

[Voidmage]

Couldn't stand to see someone liking DT msq? It's ok, you'll live.

Your answer clearly proved my point and showed that you never even read any of my other posts on this forum.
But it's ok, you'll live. On my ignore list.

Have a nice day.


Edit:
And he lost the argument.
Cute