You pull you tank question.

[Ruruura]

So let us resume the thread for everyone's benefit, what seems to be the general idea is:

DPS&Healers

DPS & Healer players are allowed to do whatever they want, take decisions for the entire party, force the pace, and whether or not they are competent at their own role or even manage to stay alive thru mechanics is irrelevant.
Any and all failures or death by DPS/Healer players are automatically and preemptively forgiven because they are human, who have the right to be tired, or stressed, or be new, or be distracted, and no complaint can ever be directed towards them.

They are also not required to perform at a level even remotely close to optimal because that is just mean elitism and gatekeeping.
P:S: Commendations should be automatically given to them by the system as a default


TANKS

Tanks are meant to know every single encounter, boss, dungeon and ideal layout for every single piece of content both released AND uneleased and are meant to do perfect boss to boss pulls in the fastest and most ideal way possible.

Tanks are not allowed to feel anything at all, if you are stressed, you should not tank, if you want to take it easier to learn, you should not tank, if you feel uncomfortable in any way, you should not tank, and if you perform, it is only to be expected, easiest role.

Tanks are meant to play at world first raid progression level at all times and in all content, forgetting to use a CD even once or eating a single mechanic by mistake automatically should remove your ability to queue and it is worthy to be memed on.

Tanks should have their trust/duty support options removed and playing with their friends instead of with randoms should triple their subscription´s price.

Tanks should not be having any sort of fun and no matter how many times the group fails mechanics and how much time they waste, tanks are not allowed to solo any boss above 3% hp.
It is not really even about saving time, a tank being happy with himself in any sort of fashion simply offends god.

Tanks should not ever be given commendations and if they receive any by accident they should immediately pay 1m gil to all party members.

Did i miss anything?

[Galvuu]

Did i miss anything?

I guess you missed actually reading what people are talking about, because no one sane defended 0 damage healers or single target dps.
Only tanks need to know the encounters...? What are you even going on about.
I mean, this is obviously bait, but come on... put a bit of effort into it.

Here. let me summarize it for you:
No matter what role you play, try your best to complete every duty as swiftly and cleanly as possible. If someone, somehow, is making clearing impossible, vote dismiss them. Leave your ego at the door regardless of role. There you go.

Snip.

Woa there! I didn't know we were in the presence of the gillionaire, multiple world-first, rank 1 pvp FF XIV celebrity Voidsent Veneer!
I didn't even read what the other person posted, but if you need to try this hard to flex on them, it really makes it sounds like what you're trying to argue has no legs to stand on.
What even is this thread right now...

[VoidsentStatus]

I didn't even read what the other person posted,

Starting to see why every big youtuber says to stay off the forums. literally every day is someone coming in mid-conversation, with no context, and wants to have an opinion just for the sake of having one and starting an argument.

1) No, you're not in my presence. Not in a real sense. You remind me of a venue owner I know on Aether oddly enough, and if this wasn't the forums, I would just pay someone to find out who you are because your behavior is odd considering the people I know on EU. You act surprised, almost in a condescending tone like you haven't seen people that have massive achievements in the background on Chaos and Light yet, and a part of me is curious if you're actually that oblivious to your peers or is this just forum jokes. Giving me vibes like Suhr on Crystal where he runs around random places asking for gil in venues etc. and people think he's a random, and he's like a 8 time Rank 1 PLD in PvP for Feast and CC, competed at Fanfest, and literally won tournaments that companies and big streamers like MrHappy/Rook/RinKari commentated for.

2) few correction:
"making clearing impossible" -> "making clearing more of a nuisance"
"vote dismiss them" -> "persuade them to stop being a nuisance".

You do not slide passes to annoying/negative behavior in content until it reaches a threshold. That's enabling behavior that's going to negatively affect other players, and you don't want that around sprouts who are already giving a multitude of reasons to quit the game at the start.

In addition to that, vote to dismiss actually punishes the voter more than the person that was kicked. Depending on when you kick in the instance and what their role is, them getting inside a fresh instance is going to be faster than you replacing them depending on the demographic of how people have their settings for joining in-progress instances. And you also locked yourself from being able to vote on another person for several hours in the future. Dissuading and reporting for a ban if continuation happens is more effective than just a vote to dismiss.

[noelregnard]

So let us resume the thread for everyone's benefit, what seems to be the general idea is:

DPS&Healers

DPS & Healer players are allowed to do whatever they want, take decisions for the entire party, force the pace, and whether or not they are competent at their own role or even manage to stay alive thru mechanics is irrelevant.
Any and all failures or death by DPS/Healer players are automatically and preemptively forgiven because they are human, who have the right to be tired, or stressed, or be new, or be distracted, and no complaint can ever be directed towards them.

They are also not required to perform at a level even remotely close to optimal because that is just mean elitism and gatekeeping.
P:S: Commendations should be automatically given to them by the system as a default


TANKS

Tanks are meant to know every single encounter, boss, dungeon and ideal layout for every single piece of content both released AND uneleased and are meant to do perfect boss to boss pulls in the fastest and most ideal way possible.

Tanks are not allowed to feel anything at all, if you are stressed, you should not tank, if you want to take it easier to learn, you should not tank, if you feel uncomfortable in any way, you should not tank, and if you perform, it is only to be expected, easiest role.

Tanks are meant to play at world first raid progression level at all times and in all content, forgetting to use a CD even once or eating a single mechanic by mistake automatically should remove your ability to queue and it is worthy to be memed on.

Tanks should have their trust/duty support options removed and playing with their friends instead of with randoms should triple their subscription´s price.

Tanks should not be having any sort of fun and no matter how many times the group fails mechanics and how much time they waste, tanks are not allowed to solo any boss above 3% hp.
It is not really even about saving time, a tank being happy with himself in any sort of fashion simply offends god.

Tanks should not ever be given commendations and if they receive any by accident they should immediately pay 1m gil to all party members.

Did i miss anything?

Putting aside the blatant disingenuous tone of your post, the current topic here is about bad tanks. Feel free to make a thread about bad DPS and healer, I'll even go there and support you.

Also, mate, aside from getting hit in the face by the enemies, tanks don't do much anything more special than DPS and healers. Pressing some mit buttons every now and then isn't rocket science.

[Ruruura]

Putting aside the blatant disingenuous tone of your post, the current topic here is about bad tanks.

That is my point though, that "Tanks bad m i right?" has been "the current topic" a little too often, some days over several threads all at the same time, across not only this forum but Reddit and now Twitter/X as well.
"Tanks bad lmao" is becoming the new "dragoon floor tanks" FFXIV meme and everyone wants in on it, which has a clear effect on how people behave around tanks in-game.

I never had issues with DPS wanting to pull until YPYT and the bad tank meme began to be a daily discourse, and now it feels like every single DPS i run into is competing with each other to see who is the one to do it.
I´ve had DPS bringing up arguments or complain about "party authority" before i even said anyhing or reacted to their pulling, and it´s getting old.

Even you could not stop yourself from pulling the "Tanks are not special" card when i never implied we were lmao

As i said, "tank bad" or "tank ego" is just the newest meme and y´all want a piece of it, and it´s getting old.

[Galvuu]

That is my point though, that "Tanks bad m i right?" has been "the current topic" a little too often, some days over several threads all at the same time, across not only this forum but Reddit and now Twitter/X as well.
"Tanks bad lmao" is becoming the new "dragoon floor tanks" FFXIV meme and everyone wants in on it, which has a clear effect on how people behave around tanks in-game.

I guess you missed a lot of people torching healers, between the healer strike thing and their general dissatisfaction then? Be it Reddit or content creators, making healers the butt-end of a joke has been on a particularly high level lately.
But yea, poor tanks. You even mention the "lol foor DRG" meme which still exists in some capacity today after a decade.
Every role has bad players. Every role will be on the receiving end of sarcastic remarks. It's always been that way. Every role matters in high-end content, and no role matters in everything else.

This whole discussion is, honestly, dull. You have a number of tools at your disposal, depending on role and job. Given a situation, you should utilize all of them to clear the content as quickly as possible. Some people won't, but a good player will.
If someone's being disruptive and making clearing impossible, you have a vote kick function for that. If someone is struggling and asks for help- or seems open to it- you can go out of your way to offer advice (though you have no obligation to). If they take it, great. If they don't take it, or don't want it to begin with, you nod, do your best, finish the 20 minutes roulette and go on about your way knowing you did all that you could as a good player.
That's all there is to it. Imagine if me or my healers threw a fit every time I rip aggro on a trash pack in an Expert dungeon as Pictomancer because I do half a million aoe damage in 4s. Who cares, I pop my barrier, my healer throws a shield on me, I stay close to the tank and I trust him to regain aggro. Even if he doesn't, it's fine, at worst I die and just release and rejoin. Same when I heal, ok you died to a mechanic, or you got hit by burns in ex1, I got you fam, I'll try my best to keep you alive so we don't lose raid damage. People are more concerned about proving a point of who's right, or who leads, or whose pace it is instead of grabbing the tools they have to bring the duty to swift completion. Just do your best, really.

snip.

I don't think this is worth replying to, but like... you're not that guy. I know you think you're some sort of ascended XIV player, but none of us are that special.

[VoidsentStatus]

Imagine if me or my healers threw a fit every time I rip aggro on a trash pack in an Expert dungeon as Pictomancer because I do half a million aoe damage in 4s. Who cares,

Square cares.