New healers skills

[Mortex]

Soil gives you 6 ticks, kera 5. I don't think you can say the movement makes it outright better.

"The DPS tradeoff of Energy Drain is big and as much as some people vehemently defend it, it is a problem. Sage can go all out on healing without a care in the world about loosing damage when it comes to their Addersgale usage. SCH doesn't. While they are different things, Sage having 5 instant gcd to DPS while moving is also stricly superior to RuinII in most situation"

Why are you bandying some of the worst aspects of sage's design around as if they're a good thing?

It does depend on the mechanics you have in a fight. That’s the reason you can argue sch has fey illumination and crit adlo spread. Some specific mechs make kerachole stronger the soil, doesn’t matter that soil last 5 seconds longer because of server stuff. This flaw was even worse before the range increase in a good number of fights, TOP being the worst contender because of the amount of mits you need for almost all in p6 and even p4.

And people can defend energy drain (even I think it’s a fun but anti heal designed ability) as much as they like but you can’t argue that ED in general is just a bad ability that on one side does in normal raid and of gameplay nothing amazing and in higher pre-made optimised groups makes the co healer (mostly astro) do around 95 % of the healing because using all stacks for ED is the way for a higher parse. The ability gives so little gain for a pretty heavy price (if it would actually give mana back or we had quick aetherflow back then it would be way better).

Like I said I don’t mind ED and I rather play sgn if I do healer content more so for the not clunky gameplay (aka fairy ghosting and not doing what you want for like 3 seconds because she has to finish a embrace cast)

[Mortex]

The only point that I agree with is Chain Stratagem being useless due to its rng nature.

1. Before giving further opinion(s), what did you find clunky with SCH?
2. The idea of spending AF stacks to dps vs using it to heal is choosing what is the best use of it given the situation...... Opportunity Costs. That is something SGE does not have.

The main clunky factor in my eyes is the ghosting and ai of the fairy. It was way more responsive in stormblood and way more interesting. They tried fixing this at the start of endwalker because shadowbringer fairy ghosting was the worst problem the job had. They made it ok ( it does still ghost a decent number of times and sometimes takes ages doing an ability you used 2 gcd before). Worse offender in that case being seraph when you actually wanna use it as a big cooldown and it does not do the aoe shield for 3 seconds for whatever reason.

The problem I have with ED is the none existing synergy with the healer kit in general. It does 100 potency and doesn’t give anything back to except minimal potency (atleast back then you had mana back something sch really does need in bad situations) You could make it so that ED gives charges for a fairy aoe heal or reduce the CD of AF like old Quickening Aetherflow. Same with fairy gauge being almost useless. Just give sch anything for spending gauge on a aoe heal

[OliviaLugria]

I will sing ED praises to the high heavens casue any complaint about it will just get it removed rather than fixed in some way.
They gave it back after mass outrage, I don't know if it'll happen again seeing how the Sams have been treated. It's a bandaid over a gaping wound, but I like having the bandaid more than having nothing at all.

I don't like the just play sage argument. They could have fixed all the clunk by now, but they instead took all the QoL improvements and packaged it as a "new" job rather than fix what they had. Of course, some people also like the fairy and tactician aesthetic and don't like the lasers.

Sage personally represents a broken promise to me. They said it was a healer that healed through their damage, and the devs barely accomplished that.

[Aravell]

Here's the thing, you guys may find SCH "clunky" while some of us appreciate how SCH works and enjoys the kit interaction that requires pre-planning.

By repeatedly shouting about how "clunky" SCH is, you're dictating that we're having fun in the wrong way and you know how we should have fun better than us, when you could just be enjoying the thing you find fun and leaving us to enjoy what we like.

I enjoy SCH's mixed systems that interact with each other and with none of them being overbearing. I do not appreciate being told by others that I should accept a fairy mage and be happy about it. I want a tactician with a bag of tricks, not an uwu fairy mage.

[Moqi]

This is a place to leave feedback to developers. If you enjoy current SCH, say that. Those that don't will say that and SE will see what to do with the data.

[rawker]

The main clunky factor in my eyes is the ghosting and ai of the fairy. It was way more responsive in stormblood and way more interesting. They tried fixing this at the start of endwalker because shadowbringer fairy ghosting was the worst problem the job had. They made it ok ( it does still ghost a decent number of times and sometimes takes ages doing an ability you used 2 gcd before). Worse offender in that case being seraph when you actually wanna use it as a big cooldown and it does not do the aoe shield for 3 seconds for whatever reason.

The problem I have with ED is the none existing synergy with the healer kit in general. It does 100 potency and doesn’t give anything back to except minimal potency (atleast back then you had mana back something sch really does need in bad situations) You could make it so that ED gives charges for a fairy aoe heal or reduce the CD of AF like old Quickening Aetherflow. Same with fairy gauge being almost useless. Just give sch anything for spending gauge on a aoe heal

First of all, apologies if you already know about this, but from what I noticed, pet abilities are executed every 3 real world seconds. There is a window of at least 0.5s, most likely affected by your ping, between each weave, it will do both pet abilities, granted that both weaves were done within the 3 second pet "GCD". If you fail either weaving too fast or too slow, then the 2nd pet ability queued will be pushed to the next pet "GCD".

Another factor contributing to the ghosting issue is when you commanded your pet to use an ability and then you used Place, the queued ability/ies will be interrupted and held until the pet:

• arrives to its destination
• issued a Heel command.

Once the above are satisfied, then it will follow the pet "GCD" rules.

As for summoning Seraph/Dissipating the pet, I may need to do more tests to verify my observations.

As for ED, it is used to spend any remaining AF stacks so it is not wasted when you use Aetherflow/Dissipation.

I dunno where I posted it but for me, playing SCH requires you to manage a lot of resources at the same time:

1. GCD/MP
2. oGCDs that modify the properties of our GCDs
3. healing oGCDs
4. mits
5. Aetherflow stacks
6. Pets

I like it to stay that way. If possible, giving more interactions and opportunity costs between all these resources, the better.

[Mortex]

Here's the thing, you guys may find SCH "clunky" while some of us appreciate how SCH works and enjoys the kit interaction that requires pre-planning.

By repeatedly shouting about how "clunky" SCH is, you're dictating that we're having fun in the wrong way and you know how we should have fun better than us, when you could just be enjoying the thing you find fun and leaving us to enjoy what we like.

I enjoy SCH's mixed systems that interact with each other and with none of them being overbearing. I do not appreciate being told by others that I should accept a fairy mage and be happy about it. I want a tactician with a bag of tricks, not an uwu fairy mage.

Saying that only sch requires pre planning is just not true. And good healer player will pre plan the entire fight with the healer he plays after doing it for some time. I don’t mind if you like sch or any other job. It’s just my opinion that sch was a way more fun job in stormblood and became clunky because they didn’t like that the job had actual pet management that did feel meaningful. Like if you think we dictate anyone or anything because I at least have a different opinion on sch from stormblood and before then I don’t know what to say. Play whatever job you like but don’t assume that people that have a different opinion dictate you anything. This is just a childish response and arguing in bad faith.

[Mortex]

First of all, apologies if you already know about this, but from what I noticed, pet abilities are executed every 3 real world seconds. There is a window of at least 0.5s, most likely affected by your ping, between each weave, it will do both pet abilities, granted that both weaves were done within the 3 second pet "GCD". If you fail either weaving too fast or too slow, then the 2nd pet ability queued will be pushed to the next pet "GCD".

Another factor contributing to the ghosting issue is when you commanded your pet to use an ability and then you used Place, the queued ability/ies will be interrupted and held until the pet:

• arrives to its destination
• issued a Heel command.

Once the above are satisfied, then it will follow the pet "GCD" rules.

As for summoning Seraph/Dissipating the pet, I may need to do more tests to verify my observations.

As for ED, it is used to spend any remaining AF stacks so it is not wasted when you use Aetherflow/Dissipation.

I dunno where I posted it but for me, playing SCH requires you to manage a lot of resources at the same time:

1. GCD/MP
2. oGCDs that modify the properties of our GCDs
3. healing oGCDs
4. mits
5. Aetherflow stacks
6. Pets

I like it to stay that way. If possible, giving more interactions and opportunity costs between all these resources, the better.

Ah cool thanks for this information I actually had no clue that they changed the pets to this. But I’m pretty sure that was only in endwalker the case. Pretty sure shadowbringer fairy ai was worse than what we have now, or what we had in stormblood or before (I miss old fairy man). I agree that in general all healer should have more interaction and risk/reward in the kits. But with how job design is going since a while now we probably will not get these interesting changes. Like Whm has the most basic healing/dps kit interaction every (not much but at least something)

[Mortex]

I will sing ED praises to the high heavens casue any complaint about it will just get it removed rather than fixed in some way.
They gave it back after mass outrage, I don't know if it'll happen again seeing how the Sams have been treated. It's a bandaid over a gaping wound, but I like having the bandaid more than having nothing at all.

I don't like the just play sage argument. They could have fixed all the clunk by now, but they instead took all the QoL improvements and packaged it as a "new" job rather than fix what they had. Of course, some people also like the fairy and tactician aesthetic and don't like the lasers.

Sage personally represents a broken promise to me. They said it was a healer that healed through their damage, and the devs barely accomplished that.

Yeah like I said in some other posts I think ED is a cool idea but it’s just bad on paper and barebones. But let’s be honest all healer are pretty barebones in the healing/ dmg kit interactions with Whm being the only and most basic one (press 3 Lily’s every minute and be dmg neutral hur dur)

I do think it’s sad that the healer role is just so barebones that people defend “clunk” as a form of fun. The healer role in general needs some massive overhaul and meaningful choices.

And yeah sages is not what I thought they would do when they said “healing through damage”. No clue why there isn’t a tool to spread kardia on other targets in exchange for a stack or other possibility’s

[Aravell]

Play whatever job you like but don’t assume that people that have a different opinion dictate you anything. This is just a childish response and arguing in bad faith.

I don't have a problem with differing opinions, you can dislike parts of SCH, I never said you had to like everything about it.

What I'm saying is that if someone has only praise for SGE and only criticism for SCH, why not just play SGE and leave SCH be for those who enjoy it? I think it's extremely selfish when someone who already has a job they enjoy a lot decides to ask for a rework of another job they dislike so they can enjoy that job too.

Also, ED being bad is an opinion, not a fact. The problem is that most people treat ED as baseline damage rather than the bonus 100 potency you gain when you don't need the utility or healing. It's like if someone treats 3 Saber Dances on DNC as a standard opener, they'd see a 1 Saber Dance opener as them "losing 2", same as how people treat having to Indom once as "losing an ED", instead of "gaining 200 potency". It's basically just parser brainrot, even non-parsers can have it if all they care about is their personal DPS.