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Thread: Pulling why?

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  1. #1
    Player
    MistakeNot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    2,312
    Character
    Auriana Redsteele
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 83
    Quote Originally Posted by aodhan_ofinnegain View Post
    Please tell me you are actually trolling?
    No, I am not. There are NO good reasons to do wall-to-wall pulls. They just make runs more difficult and stressful for no good reason, and are poor tactics in general.
    Doing w2w pulls is not a sign of being skilled - obviously since so many people try it even in low-level dungeons where it doesn't even speed up the run.

    If people's time is so precious that a minute or two extra for a dungeon run actually matters, then they shouldn't be wasting their precious time on a video game.
    (3)

  2. #2
    Player
    ThorneDynasty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2021
    Posts
    817
    Character
    Gisela Thorne
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by MistakeNot View Post
    They just make runs more difficult and stressful for no good reason
    You make the dungeon runs painful for everyone else. You aren't the main character.

    Everything else you said is so ridiculously wrong I can only assume you are baiting.
    (12)

  3. #3
    Player
    Lyth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Meracydia
    Posts
    3,883
    Character
    Lythia Norvaine
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Viper Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by MistakeNot View Post
    There are NO good reasons to do wall-to-wall pulls.
    You can see the benefits from reading your tooltips. AoE actions provide more outgoing damage with more mobs present. This translates into faster clears. In addition, a greater proportion of your damage will be under burst, and a greater number of defensive actions will be up for each two pack pull. This translates into faster, safer pulls.

    The reason why newer tanks find this process to be stressful is because they mistakenly believe that wipes during wall-to-wall pulls are automatically due to mitigation or healing errors and then take this to indicate a personal failure on their part. While wipes sometimes occur because someone forgets to press a defensive action, it's incredibly rare that you'll die in mid transit due to overwhelming burst damage.

    What's more likely is that both supports to burn through their suite of defensive actions due to substandard dps, resulting in a slow death by attrition. In fact, I'll go a step further and say that the main determinant of a group's success during a wall-to-wall pull is group dps. If you have even a single geared and competent DPS with you, you're not going to wipe.

    Bottom line, just pull everything. If there isn't enough dps between yourselves to do it safely and you wipe, just scale it back to chain pulls for the rest of the instance. No dialogue whatsoever is necessary for any of this.
    (14)

  4. #4
    Player
    Sqwall's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    844
    Character
    Sqwall Lionheart
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by MistakeNot View Post
    No, I am not. There are NO good reasons to do wall-to-wall pulls. They just make runs more difficult and stressful for no good reason, and are poor tactics in general.
    Doing w2w pulls is not a sign of being skilled - obviously since so many people try it even in low-level dungeons where it doesn't even speed up the run.

    If people's time is so precious that a minute or two extra for a dungeon run actually matters, then they shouldn't be wasting their precious time on a video game.
    I would have to disagree on the skill comment. Pulling wall to wall IS a gauge of skill for ALL members in a dungeon. Knowing how many Holy Spams I can get away with until diminishing returns kick in for the stun before I have to start healing takes understanding and a level of skill or if i'm healing and I see a WAR...I pretty much just don't even heal...GRAVITY go brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. As a tank I know that if I hear 3 holys pop off I can start using mitigations and spreading them out. As a DPS I should know cone shaped AOE's vs Circle AOE's and where to position myself. Ogi Namikiri is a good example as it's very specific to hit all the mobs, and same for SMN Slipstream as it's a ground AOE that stays...and making sure I use it when the tank settles on a location for the pack...and as a tank knowing where those AOES on the ground are (Doton, Slipstream, Salted Earth)

    So no you do need to have some level of skill and job knowledge so that you can pull wall to wall, and if you get in a grp that is REALLY CRANKING out the high numbers....dungeons DO go way faster.
    (0)
    Last edited by Sqwall; 02-14-2024 at 02:13 AM.