Okay they weren't lying about the relic

[NekoMataMata]

What is it with you thinking this is about me not being able to get some random loot I want? I want it accessible so that more people can get it. Also by your logic Ultimates are accessible, which they fundamentally are not by design.

I don't think that. Just pointing out that anyone who wants any of the relics out there is free to go work towards them. They are accessible. There is no gatekeeping.

Ultimates are a different form of content. We both know you're being disingenuous by making the comparison though.

[Xirean]

But what part of the relics is inaccessible, none of the content is hard, it’s all still easy to do, Im struggling to see how you can say they are inaccessible, ultimates are inaccessible because they are damn hard and require a lot of group coordination

Going into eureka is not

Ultimates are obviously harder but exploring around those zones alone is not something I would call easy. The amount of currency required to upgrade basically necessitates being in a group on its own, but they also remove progress from you for dying and returning to spawn. They are actually very punishing if you don't have a party. The NM's in Bozja also have this lovely habit of near one shotting you unless you're a tank or have finished the thing and bought the extra stats you can get later.

I don't think that. Just pointing out that anyone who wants any of the relics out there is free to go work towards them. They are accessible. There is no gatekeeping.

Ultimates are a different form of content. We both know you're being disingenuous by making the comparison though.

The worst part about this response is that it comes off as you genuinely believing it.

[Supersnow845]

Ultimates are obviously harder but exploring around those zones alone is not something I would call easy. The amount of currency required to upgrade basically necessitates being in a group on its own, but they also remove progress from you for dying and returning to spawn. They are actually very punishing if you don't have a party. The NM's in Bozja also have this lovely habit of near one shotting you unless you're a tank or have finished the thing and bought the extra stats you can get later.





The worst part about this response is that it comes off as you genuinely believing it.

But you can easily form a party, like shout chat is there, I’ve never struggled to find a party in Bozja or eureka, and eureka doesn’t even delevel you if you should for a rezz, the communities in those zones are community focused, they want to help new people, dying in NM’s barely loses you any mettle, you are designed to die in them till you learn them, that’s why they give so much mettle

[Xirean]

But you can easily form a party, like shout chat is there, I’ve never struggled to find a party in Bozja or eureka, and eureka doesn’t even delevel you if you should for a rezz, the communities in those zones are community focused, they want to help new people, dying in NM’s barely loses you any mettle, you are designed to die in them till you learn them, that’s why they give so much mettle

My bad on Eureka's xp then. Thought it was the same as Bozja, it's been a while. But also congratulations for never having an issue getting a party in there. But also, we shouldn't need them so much if they are so accessible. Also just gonna throw out there for the Bozja NM's; dying sucks and if the system wants you to die a lot, that's a punishing system and I'd rather not deal with it. Nor do I want other people to be forced to deal with it either.

[Supersnow845]

My bad on Eureka's xp then. Thought it was the same as Bozja, it's been a while. But also congratulations for never having an issue getting a party in there. But also, we shouldn't need them so much if they are so accessible. Also just gonna throw out there for the Bozja NM's; dying sucks and if the system wants you to die a lot, that's a punishing system and I'd rather not deal with it. Nor do I want other people to be forced to deal with it either.

It’s an MMO, I really don’t get the logic, do you do the tomestones steps entirely by soloing variant dungeons, asking for a party to better do content is the absolutely most bare bones foundational behaviour of an MMO

[Xirean]

It’s an MMO, I really don’t get the logic, do you do the tomestones steps entirely by soloing variant dungeons, asking for a party to better do content is the absolutely most bare bones foundational behaviour of an MMO

No, but I can and that's part of why I prefer it. Even if you can't que into dungeons you can still do other things to get tomes.

Edit: If you are wondering why I specifically don't want to need a party for exploratory zones it's because you don't need a party in the rest of the overworld zones. They call it exploratory content but you are punished for exploring without baby sitters. Quite lame if you ask me.

[Supersnow845]

No, but I can and that's part of why I prefer it. Even if you can't que into dungeons you can still do other things to get tomes.

So functionally whether something is accessible or not is entirely based on your ability to have the option of soloing it and not being punished in any way shape or form for wanting to do it entirely solo

I genuinely don’t understand why someone would hold this opinion while playing an MMO

It’s not like there is a shortage of single player collectathon style games

[NekoMataMata]

So functionally whether something is accessible or not is entirely based on your ability to have the option of soloing it and not being punished in any way shape or form for wanting to do it entirely solo

I genuinely don’t understand why someone would hold this opinion while playing an MMO

It’s not like there is a shortage of single player collectathon style games

You're arguing with a brickwall who at this point is just looking to make up excuses.

The capacity for people to solo it is irrelevant. It's disingenuous to expect people to do so just for a relic. I'm firmly of the opinion that tomes is the best way to do the relic. Considering how much the HW relic just got turned into a poetics dump, this just seems like a stream lined process.

[Xirean]

You're arguing with a brickwall who at this point is just looking to make up excuses.

You are comparing soloing exploring a large open zone with something that has an exclusive title. The two are not even close to the same.

So functionally whether something is accessible or not is entirely based on your ability to have the option of soloing it and not being punished in any way shape or form for wanting to do it entirely solo

I genuinely don’t understand why someone would hold this opinion while playing an MMO

It’s not like there is a shortage of single player collectathon style games

No, not at all. The lack of accessibility comes in a lot of ways for those zones. But at this point it seems like you two really just don't care.

The exclusive title you're referencing is for soloing up to floor 200. No one said you had to solo that. You only have to solo 10 floors, and soloing the first 50 or even first 100 floors is rather accessible.

You're just here to make up excuses at this point.

First you stated that regardless of whether or not something could be done solo was irrelevant. Now you're mentioning that it's one of your criteria. Your shifting the conversation around in any which direction you can in an attempt to make fairly reasonable content seem like it's ultimate level difficulty and inaccessible.

Nice to know I was right about you not caring. And no, I am not comparing it to Ultimate level difficulty. You mentioned "putting in the work and it is accessible". That's effectively what Extreme, Savage, and Ultimates are. Put in the work and you get it. That was the only reason I made the comparison to begin with and it flew right over your head.

[NekoMataMata]

You are comparing soloing exploring a large open zone with something that has an exclusive title. The two are not even close to the same.



No, not at all. The lack of accessibility comes in a lot of ways for those zones. But at this point it seems like you two really just don't care.

The exclusive title you're referencing is for soloing up to floor 200. No one said you had to solo that. You only have to solo 10 floors, and soloing the first 50 or even first 100 floors is rather accessible.

You're just here to make up excuses at this point.

First you stated that regardless of whether or not something could be done solo was irrelevant. Now you're mentioning that it's one of your criteria. Your shifting the conversation around in any which direction you can in an attempt to make fairly reasonable content seem like it's ultimate level difficulty and inaccessible.