Dawntrail Healers need a rework

[ForsakenRoe]

It's a shame FFXIV's net code is so abysmally sloppy, as one complete left of field avenue to explore would be abilities to actively counter incoming attacks such as timed shields and barriers that get significant bonuses for being correctly timed. If the pay off could be big enough that it was worthwhile over simply smashing glare as fast as the GCD allows then that's an instant huge shakeup to the current gameplay loop right there. Drop it in a reasonably short cooldown so that it's frequent enough to be impactful but not causing us to stand around doing waiting for something to counter and IMO it'd be a neat addition.

14: Pepsis now costs 500mp, has a very low CD (maybe 5sec), and generates 8 Addersting on use (even if it doesn't do anything you get the gauge). When Eukrasian Diagnosis or Eukrasian Prognosis break, they leave a buff on that player called Second Opinion for about 5 seconds. When Pepsis is used, it consumes Second Opinion to heal that player for the amount of HP the barrier protected for. Essentially, if you ever played a Character Action game like Viewtiful Joe, Wonderful 101, whatever, and used the Ukemi (jump button right as you land, instantly heal back the damage you took), it's that with a bit more leniency. And it gives Pepsis a much more interesting use case.

I mean uhh yeh a counter-based healing gameplay would be pretty interesting possibly

[ty_taurus]

I mean uhh yeh a counter-based healing gameplay would be pretty interesting possibly

As a separate note, I've been playing a mobile game called Reverse 1999 that came out a few weeks ago. We have a few months of foreknowledge about the game from its Chinese release, and there's a healer that will arrive in the next event that has a really interesting mechanic where she revolves around critical hits (and heals can also critical hit it seems, like with XIV). She can heal with an increased chance to critically heal, she can attack and inflict a debuff on enemies that causes them to have a much higher chance of receiving a critical hit from your next attack, and her ultimate is an attack that, when it crits, it cleanses all crowd control from the party.

It got me thinking... It could be incredibly cool in concept if Sage's Kardia were only triggered by critical hits instead of just casts, or rather, critical hits was how you generated gauge to spend on powerful heals and utility, or having a few different versions of certain attacks that are normally weaker than your standard spell, but under certain conditions, always crit, ultimately making them worth more damage, while simultaneously granting different effects like a party cleanse, or mitigation, or other form of utility.

[Renathras]

You didn't. Where in my post did I say "Renthras is saying Healers should either have only 1 or only 0 DPS buttons?"

Idk why you're hounding me over nothing. I don't like that original sentiment because it's not fair and not consistent. That's all I said.

Where you replied to me instead of just making a general statement, and where you answered my asking with "Because of this sentence"?

When you reply to someone, attacking a concept, people generally take it to mean you're addressing them. It'd be like if I quoted you and then talked about some random thing you didn't say. It might lead you into feeling like you were being attacked or called out unfairly.

If you want to make general statements, by all means. Just please don't quote me when you aren't replying to anything I said, and when I ask about it, just say "Oh, I didn't mean to reply to you and was speaking generally", not quote something ELSE I said to try and justify the initial quote, only to then say "It's not related to what you said, IDK why you're hounding me over it". Fair enough?

It got me thinking... It could be incredibly cool in concept if Sage's Kardia were only triggered by critical hits instead of just casts, or rather, critical hits was how you generated gauge to spend on powerful heals and utility, or having a few different versions of certain attacks that are normally weaker than your standard spell, but under certain conditions, always crit, ultimately making them worth more damage, while simultaneously granting different effects like a party cleanse, or mitigation, or other form of utility.

There are times I wish FFXIV was a bit different of a game. WoW used to (not sure if still does) have stuff like this. Like the Mage specs, Fire was built around getting and using crits. So was Healadin circa Wrath era where crits restored mana, so the build was to go heavy crit then you could just endlessly cast your big bomb heal since you were super mana efficient.

FFXIV...doesn't really work like that (a healing class that only heals [mostly] when it gets crit attacks would either not work well or work WAY too well, all depending on how crit scaled and the RNG gods). Though it'd be nice if we could break out of the rigid combat system to allow for more of that.

I mean uhh yeh a counter-based healing gameplay would be pretty interesting possibly

They KINDA have started dabbling with this with stuff like the level 82 Tank defensive CDs. The first 4 sec having a bigger effect makes them somewhat more reactive tools since timing becomes more important. It's not the most amazing thing ever, but it's a step in that direction. As Healers, we don't notice this because our go-to heals are all oGCDs, but in theory, that's how oGCD vs GCD healing should work. It DOESN'T, but...

[Payadopa]

Because I had no interest in partaking in the hobby analogy discussion and it wasn't what I was addressing. All I was addressing was that this mentality of 'healers are not DPS, therefore, they should not have DPS beyond the bare minimum necessary for getting through solo' that I have seen regurgitated by mulitple people in different ways over the years is inconsistent. Because no one says that about tanks. Tanks do not need anything more than the bare minimum to function, so where is the person crying 'I play tank because I want to tank!' when someone talks about adding a new attack to a tank? Where is the person that goes 'I don't want attacks on my tank. If I wanted to DPS, I'd play DPS'?

I want consistency. If the way healers are currently treated is the "correct" way, then I want the same for tanks. If the way tanks are treated is the "correct" way, then I want the same for healers. That's all.

All I'm saying is that tanks have always dealt damage to keep aggro. So your logic doesn't make sense to me. That being said I'd take anything at this point to break up the boredom of the content as healer.

[ty_taurus]

All I'm saying is that tanks have always dealt damage to keep aggro. So your logic doesn't make sense to me. That being said I'd take anything at this point to break up the boredom of the content as healer.

You're right. If only I referenced them still having the bare minimum single target attack, AoE attack, DoT or similar 30 second duration attack, and singular bonus attack unique to each tank, just like the healers have, maybe that would've made more sense. But you know me, specifying that tanks shouldn't have any DPS abilities at all whatsoever and would require the help of other players to do anything solo, or I guess just auto things to death. That is verbatim what I said a dozen times now, and not the former statement.

[Calysto]

What's next, do Healers need an invuln because Tanks have them?

I mean, that would be nice to have something like that and it would fit for barrier healer.
Invuln are a remnant of ARR(or maybe 1.0 ?), and back then healers had their version : benediction and lustrate (that was 3 third of a benediction back then). yet of that era, only benediction remain, newer healers never got it and the lv.50 capstone for SCH if now... sacred soil ?

There are tank-busters that require Invuln (I'd say fairly often but not really in casual content) ; heck, some fights require tank LB3 or DPS LB
No way any fight will ever require healer LB. It would technically be possible, but would require the party to die, thus losing their gauge/buffs/etc ; not a good thing for a forced mechanic.

Also what about utility ? Silence is supposed to be a WHM spell. Tanks have both interrupts and stuns ; healers, not even WHM do (I guess you would argue about Repose if it worked on anything...)
At best, healers got esuna (used in a handful of fights) and like 10% mitigation ? WHM do have the stun effect on Holy, but that's about it and only useful in dungeons

[Zairava]

All I'm going to say regarding the whole "what if tanks had healer dps kits" is for those of you still actively playing and maining healers I admire your dedication, because the day they do that to tanks I'm gone lmao. They're already on thin ice because of the Shadowbringers pruning

[Aria1]

I don't get this topic at all, if you don't like not having as many dps tools as a healer, maybe play a DPS instead.
The only change healers actually need is to have Freecure removed to stop baiting sprouts and make Cure (I) and their similar versions change automatically to Cure II and alike as soon as you reach the level for it.
Peace out.

[Zairava]

I don't get this topic at all, if you don't like not having as many dps tools as a healer, maybe play a DPS instead.
The only change healers actually need is to have Freecure removed to stop baiting sprouts and make Cure (I) and their similar versions change automatically to Cure II and alike as soon as you reach the level for it.
Peace out.

I swear every one of you that say this think healers are asking for dps kits level of dps abilities.

They aren't, and you just come off as ignorant and tone deaf as YoshiP has when asked about this numerous times

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

I don't get this topic at all, if you don't like not having as many dps tools as a healer, maybe play a DPS instead.
The only change healers actually need is to have Freecure removed to stop baiting sprouts and make Cure (I) and their similar versions change automatically to Cure II and alike as soon as you reach the level for it.
Peace out.

Have you glimpsed the 4.0 healer DPS options that the OP was referring too? Because they're clearly not 'as many dps tools' when compared to those possessed by an actual DPS job.