DRK - AST/AST/AST - The frontline meta

[Hik3n]

frontline will always be a mess when cc/feast is the focus. this just how it is they wont make two different pvp playstyles

Exactly, this is the real problem here, not everything else other talk about here, they balance the game around a PVP mode that has nothing to do with entire Alliances against each other, if they want any improvement, it needs to be the other way around, or do balancing separately for them, how they do now is just dumb, even CC has massive problems with balancing, so they obviously have no idea how to do that right either, making every job a Damage dealer was a mistake, giving them shields and way way to much HP recovery is another one... makes PVP feel like garbage.

[Xylira]

At this point, group queuing should probably just be disabled in frontlines.

The real problem is the awful balance and how ridiculously well certain jobs synergize together with other jobs or even themselves, but it's abundantly clear that SE doesn't care to do proper balance passes for larger scale pvp.

And yeah, yeah, you don't need premade groups to pull off the cheap combinations, but it's significantly easier to when you queue in a premade group to do it than not. So much so that when a well coordinated premade will absolutely stomp random groups. It's just straight up not fun ending up in grossly uneven matches.

Of course, if SE does actually do anything, it will probably only be to throw a -10% damage debuff at AST.

[eeto]

If you get oneshot by a single DRK LB on its own there is probably something you're leaving out of the picture.

Not sure whether you were replying to me, but this entire thread is talking about DRK + ASTx3. I don't think anyone is talking about getting one shot by DRK lb.

I had a few games where the AST-crew pressed Macrocosmos while the DRK jumps in. Even though I hit Shield immediately (literally saw DRK charging in), I still watch my HP slowly drained and died, 3 seconds after I casted the bubble. Server lag is messing with the priority of how damage is registered.

Corroborated the findings with other online friends residing in different parts of North America, and we come to the same conclusion that by the time you see the DRK launches above ground, the bubble is already too late.

Perhaps there might still be some leeway if the execution of the combo is communicated through in-game chat, but it is absolutely deadly if it is coordinated through voice-chat or other means.

Aside from that, you need to allocate all your attention to that one DRK and those 3 ASTs. If there's more then one DRK, then it becomes a nightmare. Even one mistake is costly.

Asking other players to "git gud" is an impossible ask. The few that knows how to pre-emptively mitigate the effects of this combo, cannot possibly overcome the large amount of casualty it causes to the rest of the alliance. It isn't just the kills, it's also the BH that quickly generates.

For all the aforementioned reasons, it shows that this combo in the current FL setup is broken.

[AnotherPerson]

A rant. The most laughable game I had just now was people saying DRK + AST combo on maelstorm was broken when in reality...
Our team kept on focusing flames and ignoring the actual threats that were killing them. Then they go "Wow, that's broken!" Even worse, they weren't "focusing" on the threats, they weren't even trying at all. The scoreboard at the end went as expected as well. Half the team was under 200k dps for a 15 min+ match. And this was them "fighting" for majority of the time, against flames too... No shit the combo looks OP when half of the players are just standing there doing nothing. I literally had 5 to 6 people follow me to do a pincer attack. We literally killed the BH 5 AST and other members from maelstorm by flanking them from their blind spot before getting out. It's not hard, people just don't try.

Next game, I had the DRK + AST combo on my alliance and the DRK was trying to coordinate with other ASTs in other alliance parties as well. A bunch of calls were made for capturing / maneuvering and were ignored. Unsurprisingly, we were in last place for majority of the game until the other two alliances forced a skirmish with each other. We got lucky with the 2-3 A and S rank ovoos spawns being uncontested on the opposite side of the map afterwards. Scoreboard pops up at the end. Lo and behold, a bunch of people on our alliance with a ton of deaths and less than 100k dps/healing. Yeah, it's not a surprise why fights were so one-sided - half the players aren't even trying to win. They're just there to make up for the body count, and not even for your alliance but for the enemy's BH score. >.> I understand the desire for wanting to queue into Frontlines for exp, but when it's literally this obvious, you're making it hard to not report for lethargic play.

You want to know how our alliance won with over a 800 score difference on the third game as maelstorm even though there was the DRK + AST combo showed up again on the Immortal Flames in the third game? We had most of the people playing and trying to win. People listened to shot calls. The team with the DRK + AST combo? When the score came out, they had at least 6 sandbaggers dragging their team down. The result of the DRK +AST Combo? Immediately got destroyed by our alliance when they fought against us for nodes. We didn't need any fancy combos, we just had people willing to play as a team. We had plenty of people doing above 300k to 500k damage and it was enough, provided that calls were being listened to. People retreated on time, regrouped towards different nodes and focused on specific targets. The difference was enough to help the entire alliance gain BH and be able to win any skirmish for the node even if two alliances ran at us at the same time.

[Valence]

Not sure whether you were replying to me, but this entire thread is talking about DRK + ASTx3. I don't think anyone is talking about getting one shot by DRK lb.

I had a few games where the AST-crew pressed Macrocosmos while the DRK jumps in. Even though I hit Shield immediately (literally saw DRK charging in), I still watch my HP slowly drained and died, 3 seconds after I casted the bubble. Server lag is messing with the priority of how damage is registered.

Corroborated the findings with other online friends residing in different parts of North America, and we come to the same conclusion that by the time you see the DRK launches above ground, the bubble is already too late.

Perhaps there might still be some leeway if the execution of the combo is communicated through in-game chat, but it is absolutely deadly if it is coordinated through voice-chat or other means.

Aside from that, you need to allocate all your attention to that one DRK and those 3 ASTs. If there's more then one DRK, then it becomes a nightmare. Even one mistake is costly.

Asking other players to "git gud" is an impossible ask. The few that knows how to pre-emptively mitigate the effects of this combo, cannot possibly overcome the large amount of casualty it causes to the rest of the alliance. It isn't just the kills, it's also the BH that quickly generates.

For all the aforementioned reasons, it shows that this combo in the current FL setup is broken.

I think I misunderstood your earlier post, my apologies.

I personally have never advocated for more casual players to git gud, and I loathe that gamer idiocy. There is counters to everything, but their ease of use, accessibility, and effort required isn't always obvious or accessible for the majority of FL players. I'm not even sure if a DRK is actually needed when stacking AST tbh, considering the ludicrous range of macrocosmos.

[eeto]

I think I misunderstood your earlier post, my apologies.

I personally have never advocated for more casual players to git gud, and I loathe that gamer idiocy. There is counters to everything, but their ease of use, accessibility, and effort required isn't always obvious or accessible for the majority of FL players. I'm not even sure if a DRK is actually needed when stacking AST tbh, considering the ludicrous range of macrocosmos.

No worries. You are quite right, macrocosmos does have a ridiculous range, but having a DRK charging in probably help divert enemy's attention towards the DRK rather than the AST that is more squishy.

Just finished another game... DRK+ASTx3 all over 15 kills. I was on the winning team, but there's no joy in the win--one that exploits a design flaw. The other two team finished with less than 300 points, surely they didn't find it fun either. How many out of the 72 players were actually having fun in a game like this...? (we know the answer...)

[DracoCookie]

Honestly, they need to cap the AoE to X number of players OR divide the damage amongst all players in the AoE.

I'm sorry but seeing DRG get 1.8m damage (2~3x higher than average), absorb 600k damage (about the same as Paladin), and come out with a 0 death count is ridiculous. They're a glass cannon and tank mixed into one, add in a DRK and Warrior and you have yourself a perfect nuke.

[Yegu]

It's a joke

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

It's a joke

Is infinitely more scary than a Bahamut ICBM squad, not gonna lie.

Macrocosmos memed me in Crystalline Conflict many a time without being the intended target - the range is silly for the damage output it can provide, it is actually bullsh** that it does 12000 base damage (6000-9000 at BH0 in FL) at a 15y radius around themselves.

I would not be surprised if they reduce macrocosmos to 8000 base damage and maybe compensate them in a different way (faster CD on Draw perhaps).

[Valence]

Since it can't happen in CC, do buffs from identical LBs stack? I'd assume not since standard buffs?