An alternative to gear swaping

**Exn** · 04-13-2012 10:19 AM

Originally Posted by Frein

If you think a modern MMO gamer new to FFXIV would swallow mid-combat gear swaps, you're utterly delusional. Not only does it have direct negative consequences to the game's presentation and offered gameplay experience, but as game design it is completely unintuitive. No new player who hasn't played FFXI is even going to entertain the thought of being able to change pants during combat because of how detached from their idea of "combat" it is.

Ohhh I didn't know you spoke for all "modern MMO gamers new to FFXIV"...

Your opinion is that it it will have negative consequences. Based on the rest of that paragraph it would seem that is due to 'immersion' issues. See what you quoted for my opinion on that...

**illriginalized** · 04-13-2012 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by Exn

Ohhh I didn't know you spoke for all "modern MMO gamers new to FFXIV"...

Your opinion is that it it will have negative consequences. Based on the rest of that paragraph it would seem that is due to 'immersion' issues. See what you quoted for my opinion on that...

After extensively reading people and their immersion claims.. I'm starting to think these people prefer this virtual reality (FFXIV) more so than their very own actual reality. Which is quite interesting yet scary.

**Enfarious** · 04-13-2012 01:22 PM

Originally Posted by StateAlchemist

No one told you to go out and violate to ToS by using a third-party program to make an excessive macro-list. Obviously not only was it your choice to do it, but you wanted to do it so badly that you broke the rules of the game and risked getting banned to do so. Sounds to me like your all for it. I never gear-swapped more then what one macro would allow me to do for any spell/ability in FFXI.

Ok that does make it seem that this was something I enjoyed, it wasn't at all, and that wasn't what I was trying to convey by posting that, the point is, I don't want to see things like that again. Will they eventually happen? Yes. Let's not encourage it by having another gearswapping nightmare though.

**Enfarious** · 04-13-2012 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by illriginalized

lol... you're pretty ballsy.

It seemed like the best way to make a point at the time, maybe not the smartest way to do it, but effective I think if people take it with a grain of salt and in the nature it was intended.
Figure worst case I lose a string of FF accts, here's to hoping that doesn't happen though.

**WendyMarvell** · 04-13-2012 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by Enfarious

Why I don't want gear swapping:

<?xml version="1.0" ?>
<spellcast xmlns:xi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XInclude">
<config RequireVersion="2.4" Debug="false" HideErrors="false" ShowGearSwaps="false" ShowSpellInfo="false" />

<variables>
<xi:include href="../include/elasandria.xml" xpointer="/includes/include[@name='ElementalGear']/*" />
<xi:include href="../include/std.xml" xpointer="/includes/include[@name='StandardVars']/*" />

<var name="DayNight">Day</var>
<var name="DawnDusk">Dawn</var>
</variables>

<sets>
<group name="GearCollection">
<set name="Gear">
<item>Kamome</item>
<item>Taimakuniyuki</item>
<item>Twilight Knife</item>
<item>Crimson Blade</item>
<item>Shellbuster</item>
<item>Unger Boomerang</item>
<item>Bomb Core</item>
<item>Fire Bomblet</item>
<item>$LightStaff</item>
<item>Twilight Torque</item>
<item>Thunder Belt</item>
</set>
</group>
<group default="yes" name="Default">
<set name="Base|*Resting">
<ammo>Fire Bomblet</ammo>
<head>Iga Zukin +2</head>
<body>Iga Ningi +2</body>
<hands>Iga Tekko +2</hands>
<legs>Iga Hakama +2</legs>
<feet>Iga Kyahan +1</feet>
<waist>Twilight Belt</waist>
<neck>Iga Erimaki</neck>
<back>Iga Dochugappa</back>
<lear>Iga Mimikazari</lear>
<rear>Suppanomimi</rear>
<lring>Epona's Ring</lring>
<rring>Heed Ring</rring>
</set>
<set name="*Idle" Default="true" BaseSet="Base">
<feet>Danzo Sune-Ate</feet>
</set>
<set name="*Engaged" BaseSet="Base">
<body>Ninja Chainmail</body>
<back>Atheling Mantle</back>
<neck>Agasaya's Collar</neck>
</set>
<set name="*Regen|*Refresh">
</set>
<set name="Acc|DayAcc">
<head>Theia's Hairpin</head>
<body>Alcide's Harness</body>
<waist>Potent Belt</waist>
<back>Belenos' Mantle</back>
</set>
<set name="NightAcc" BaseSet="DayAcc">
</set>
<set name="Eva|DayEva" BaseSet="$DayNight%Status">
<neck>Torero Torque</neck>
<waist>Sveltesse Gouriz</waist>
<back>Blur Mantle</back>
<lear>Elusive Earring</lear>
<rear>Elusive Earring</rear>
</set>
<set name="NightEva" BaseSet="DayEva">
<legs>Koga Hakama</legs>
</set>
<set name="*MaxEva" BaseSet="$DayNightEva">
<head>Theia's Hairpin</head>
<body>Alcide's Harness</body>
<feet>Ballerines</feet>
</set>
<set name="Tank" BaseSet="$DayNightEva">
</set>
<set name="PDT" BaseSet="Tank">
<neck>Twilight Torque</neck>
</set>
<set name="MDT" BaseSet="Tank">
<neck>Twilight Torque</neck>
</set>
<set name="Haste|DayHaste">
<feet>Ballerines</feet>
</set>
<set name="NightHaste" BaseSet="DayHaste">
<hands>Koga Tekko</hands>
</set>
<set name="Fast_Cast" BaseSet="$DayNightHaste">
</set>
<set name="Ninjutsu" Baseset="Fast_Cast">
</set>
<set name="Elemental" Baseset="Ninjutsu">
</set>
<set name="WeaponSkill" BaseSet="$DayNightEngaged">
<ammo>Bomb Core</ammo>
<head>Aias Bonnet</head>
<body>Iga Ningi +2</body>
<hands>Ochiudo's Kote</hands>
<lear>Centaurus Earring</lear>
<rear>Spike Earring</rear>
</set>
<set name="DayDex" BaseSet="Base">
<head>Iga Zukin +2</head>
<hands>Iga Tekko +2</hands>
<feet>Lithe Boots</feet>
<back>Nifty Mantle</back>
<waist>Fatality Belt</waist>
<lring>Airy Ring</lring>
</set>
<set name="NightDex" BaseSet="DayDex">
<feet>Koga Kyahan</feet>
</set>
<set name="DayAgi" BaseSet="Base">
<head>Theia's Hairpin</head>
<legs>Ambusher's Hose</legs>
<feet>Lithe Boots</feet>
<neck>Arctier's Torque</neck>
<waist>Sveltesse Belt</waist>
<back>Blur Mantle</back>
<rring>Solemn Ring</rring>
</set>
<set name="NightAgi" BaseSet="DayAgi">
</set>
<set name="DayStrDex">
<head>Aias Bonnet</head>
<hands>Iga Tekko +2</hands>
<feet>Iga Kayahan +1</feet>
<back>Nifty Mantle</back>
<neck>Ire Torque +1</neck>
<waist>Sentry Belt</waist>
<lring>Spiral Ring</lring>
<rring>Airy Ring</rring>
</set>
<set name="NightStrDex" BaseSet="DayStrDex">
<hands>Koga Tekko</hands>
<feet>Koga Kyahan</feet>
</set>
<set name="DayStrInt">
<head>Varangian Helm</head>
<body>Iga Ningi +2</body>
<feet>Iga Kayahan +1</feet>
<neck>Ire Torque +1</neck>
<waist>Sentry Belt</waist>
<back>Nifty Mantle</back>
<lring>Spiral Ring</lring>
<rring>Flame Ring</rring>
</set>
<set name="NightStrInt" BaseSet="DayStrInt">
<hands>Koga Tekko</hands>
</set>
<set name="Critical">
<ammo>Qirmiz Tathlum</ammo>
<body>Loki's Kaftan</body>
<neck>Iga Erimaki</neck>
<back>Iga Dochugappa</back>
</set>
</group>
</sets>

<rules>
<if advanced='"$initialized"=="false"'> 
<var cmd="set initialized true" />
</if>
<xi:include href="../include/std.xml" xpointer="/includes/include[@name='CancelRules']/*" />
<xi:include href="../include/std.xml" xpointer="/includes/include[@name='ReturnRules']/*" />
<xi:include href="../include/std.xml" xpointer="/includes/include[@name='StdRules']/*" />


<if TimeLT="6.00" mode="OR" TimeGT="17.59">
<var command="set DayNight Night" />
</if>
<else>
<var command="set DayNight Day" />
</else>
<if TimeLT="7.00" mode="OR" TimeGT="16.59">
<var command="set DawnDusk Dusk" />
</if>
<else>
<var command="set DawnDusk Dawn" />
</else>

<if TPGT="5">
<disable slot="Main|Sub|Range" />
</if>
<else>
<enable slot="Main|Sub|Range" />
</else>
<if EquipRange="empty">
<enable slot="ammo" />
</if>
<else>
<disable slot="ammo" />
</else>


<if buffactive="Yonin">
<equip when="aftercast">
<legs lock="true">Iga Hakama +2</legs>
</equip>
</if>
<elseif buffactive="Innin">
<equip when="aftercast">
<head lock="true">Iga Zukin +2</head>
</equip>
</elseif>

<if Skill="Ability">
<if spell="Yonin">
<equip when="Aftercast">
<legs lock="true">Iga Hakama +2</legs>
</equip>
<command when="precast">autoexec unregister 11112</command>
<command when="aftercast">autoexec registeronceq 11111 losebuff_Yonin input /ja "Yonin" <me></command>
</if>
<elseif spell="Innin">
<equip when="aftercast">
<head lock="true">Iga Zukin +2</head>
</equip>
<command when="precast">autoexec unregister 11111</command>
<command when="aftercast">autoexec registeronceq 11112 losebuff_Innin input /ja "Innin" <me></command>
</elseif>
<if Type="WeaponSkill">
<xi:include href="../include/std.xml" xpointer="/includes/include[@name='WeaponSkillRules']/*" />
<if spell="*Teki|*To|*Chi|*Kamu">
<equip when="Precast" set="$DayNightStrInt" />
</if>
<elseif spell="*Rin|*Retsu|*Jin|*Ten|*Ku|Tachi*">
<equip when="Precast" set="$DayNightStrDex" />
</elseif>
<elseif spell="*Yu">
<equip when="Precast" set="$DayNightInt" />
<equip when="Precast" set="$DayNightDexInt" />
</elseif>
<elseif spell="*Metsu|*Shun">
<equip when="Precast" set="$DayNightDex" />
</elseif>
<else>
<equip when="Precast" set="$DayNightAgi" />
</else>
<if spell="*Rin|*Jin|*Hi">
<equip when="precast" set="Critical" />
</if>
</if>
</if>
<else>
<if Skill="Ninjutsu">
<equip when="precast" set="$DayNightHaste" />
<equip when="precast" set="Ninjutsu" />
<if Spell="Utsusemi*">

<equip when="midcast">
<feet lock="true">Iga Kyahan +2</feet>
</equip>
</if>
<elseif Spell="Hyoton*|Katon*|Suiton*|Raiton*|Doton*|Huton*">
<equip when="midcast" set="Elemental" />
</elseif>
<elseif Spell="Migawari*">
<equip when="midcast|aftercast">
<body lock="true">Iga Ningi +2</body>
</equip>
</elseif>
</if>
</else>

<if spell="autoset">
<equip when="%status|aftercast" set="$DayNight%status" />
<if status="engaged" advanced='("$DDMode" == "Tank" OR "$DDMode" == "Haste" OR "$DDMode" == "Acc" OR "$DDMode" == "Eva" OR "$DDMode" == "MaxEva")'>
<equip when="engaged|aftercast" set="$DayNight$DDMode" />
</if>
<if Status="resting">
<var cmd="set DDMode Idle" />
<command>autoexec unregister 11111;autoexec unregister 11112</command>
</if>
<if HPPLT="95">
<equip when="idle|resting|aftercast" set="Regen" />
</if>
<if MPPLT="95">
<equip when="idle|resting|aftercast" set="Refresh" />
</if>
</if>
<elseif Status="Engaged">
<equip when="engaged|aftercast" set="$DayNightEngaged" />
<if advanced='("$DDMode" == "Tank" OR "$DDMode" == "Haste" OR "$DDMode" == "Acc" OR "$DDMode" == "Eva" OR "$DDMode" == "MaxEva")'>
<equip when="engaged|aftercast" set="$DayNight$DDMode" />
</if>
</elseif>
<elseif Status="Idle">
<equip when="idle|aftercast" set="$DayNightIdle" />
<if HPPLT="95">
<equip when="idle|resting|aftercast" set="Regen" />
</if>
<if MPPLT="95">
<equip when="idle|resting|aftercast" set="Refresh" />
</if>
</elseif>
<else> 
<var cmd="set DDMode %Status" />
<equip when="idle|engaged|aftecast" set="$DayNight%status" />
</else>
</rules>
</spellcast>

Yes I really have 20+ of these and wrote them all, they're obscene, but super useful, I don't want to go through it again for this game though. That's ~1/3 of the actual script, and only for 1/20 jobs, considering I left out the includes. Obviously I wouldn't actually use this in game or condone the use of such...

But the OP gives a very nice alternative to it, just having gear slots that we could swap specially "souls" in and out of, I can even see this with a minor animation maintaining the immersion that so many MMO players enjoy, while giving the min/maxers their gear swaps in a slightly different form. Keeping a smallish pouch of souls that I've extracted from my favorite gear.
Unless I completely misunderstood. Yes I simplified the crap out of it too.

It is a very valid point that as the game progresses, the macro scripts become increasingly more complex (although these macros were very easy to write).

So lets tweak the system a little, it could be eased in with what SE has planned for the mannequin system, a set of souls that you call into your macro. If i remember correctly, we are going to be having a limited number of mannequins, so lets make the number of soulsets limited as well (per job) a random number not greater than 10 perhaps it increases through quests or levels?

This new limit to the system will make it so you have to make your choice of which soulsets you want to take to the raid/primal/NM/whatever content, and ensure that your macros don't get out of hand. While still allowing you to fulfill many roles in the fight (again looking at the mages).

Perhaps the system would involve a very high amount of sets you can save, but you can only choose a small amount of these sets to actually "carry".

I want also to mention that the purpose of the thread is to establish a middle ground, for those who want gear swap and those who do not. Clearly there is a difference of opinion.

Everyone thanks for your replies. Please keep them coming =)

**Enfarious** · 04-13-2012 10:56 PM

Originally Posted by WendyMarvell

It is a very valid point that as the game progresses, the macro scripts become increasingly more complex (although these macros were very easy to write).

So lets tweak the system a little, it could be eased in with what SE has planned for the mannequin system, a set of souls that you call into your macro. If i remember correctly, we are going to be having a limited number of mannequins, so lets make the number of soulsets limited as well (per job) a random number not greater than 10 perhaps it increases through quests or levels?

This new limit to the system will make it so you have to make your choice of which soulsets you want to take to the raid/primal/NM/whatever content, and ensure that your macros don't get out of hand. While still allowing you to fulfill many roles in the fight (again looking at the mages).

Perhaps the system would involve a very high amount of sets you can save, but you can only choose a small amount of these sets to actually "carry".

I want also to mention that the purpose of the thread is to establish a middle ground, for those who want gear swap and those who do not. Clearly there is a difference of opinion.

Everyone thanks for your replies. Please keep them coming =)

I'm all for finding that middle ground, that's why I like the idea of "souls" and I like the idea of only being able to have so many "carried" perhaps a section of our "moghouse" just for storing the ones we aren't using atm, and only being able to carry say 10 on our person at any given time. It's enough that mages could carry 1 for each element and 1 for enfeebles/enhancing/curing.

I can't see whipping a mannequin out in the middle of a fight while I have my spear up trying to ready a WS then trying to pull of my hat to switch it with the mannequin, then my shirt, and so on. It'd be f'in hilarious though if SE said, "You know what we're sick of this gear swap argument, you can swap anytime you want, BUT we've added animations to every gear change. Say 15 seconds to change your shirt, 30 to change your pants. There's your immersion, now you have to watch yourself change and while doing it get wailed on while you've no defense at all."

Souls I can see as just having to "activate" one that's already slotted in your gear, or the few seconds to pull one out to put in another, digging through a puch of 10 different colored glowing golfballs would not take too long to find the yellow. But back to that "activate" if we could have say a varrying amount of souls "slotted" in our gear.
AF Head/Hand/Feet 1 slot > AF Head/Hands/Feet +1 2slots
AF Body/Legs 2 slots > AF Body/Legs +1 3 slots
But you can only have 1+(1 per piece of AF+2) Active.
Now we just need to be able to upgrade AF > AF +1 > AF +2...

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