Zepla: The Players Endwalker Left Behind

[Kaurhz]

I would go so far to say that casual content should not be a cakewalk at all. the reality is, they are stumbling over themselves by trying to make this a solo game, and sure, its well and good that a turnip with a learning disorder can complete the MSQ, but I would say many of us did not come to this game at that skill level. I am fairly sure this whole lack of complexity and content can start being traced back to when they started leaning into making the game more solo friendly. why bother learning a decent skill efficiency when you can now be a sea sponge with minimal dexterity to clear most content except extremes and savages?

I mean inherently, some of these changes aren't necessarily overly detrimental, as you still have fundamental mechanics present in the normal mode counterpart, which do get expanded on across other tiers of difficulty. It's just a shame they were changed, but IMO, with all the content between Level 1-to-89, there's a significant amount of learning opportunities, assuming you go through the natural process of doing story > optional trials/24-man raids. - When I do talk about "I don't think it should be easy all the time is mostly just in reference to working on the pacing itself rather than the absence/removal of certain mechanics. Most encounters just feel like mechanics are far between, Take Number XXIV, sure, it lost Barrier Shift, but even when this was going on, it just felt so slow - It just literally repeats Barrier Shift, and the mechanic in execution is just walk into a tower. Encounters should feel faster-paced. Having other mechanics going on in tandem - It shouldn't matter if it's barrier shift with elements, or even barrier shift as just standard towers to soak.

For example, If I were looking at Number XXIV, I would probably have it with just standard towers, but then have another mechanic, such as a tether mechanic going on in tandem with this, e.g., have 2 pairs of players tethered to each other, first 2 players are resolved by spreading, and the other 2 by stacking. It could be you resolve the tethers, which then deal a moderate amount of damage to all players, versus potentially ongoing damage like with burning chains from Shinryu, and then have a small window to take towers, then also follow up with a stack marker to occur shortly thereafter. Or it could even be as simple as XXIV doing a massive donut AoE around the hitbox, at the same time as doing towers going off, then you can have it to where players need to resolve one and then the other in that particular sequence. instead of something such as Gale Cut which does absolutely nothing at all. You then introduce people to a fairly adequate pacing, where 1 mechanic follows another straight after, in addition to multiple mechanics going off in tandem.

Pacing IMO, has always been the biggest issue, things don't happen quickly enough, or at the very least not enough things happen in tandem... I would say this was probably the biggest hurdle I had when I initially went into Eden's Verse... I was far, far too used to everything happening at a snail's pace.

[ZephyrMenodora]

For me anything requiring that I schedule set times with 7 to 23 other people and have to give an actual time commitment moves content out of mid-core into hardcore for me.

Having to guarantee my availability at specific times would be too much for me at this stage in life.

Same with content that would require outside communication systems like discord or voice chats.

[PercibelTheren]

I think I would call myself a midcore player. I'm not completely casual but I'm also not ready to invest the time and energy required for hardcore content.

The one thing that really stands out to me regarding Endwalker fights is that the difficulty in Extreme and Savage seems WILDLY inconsistent. I have only dipped my toes in Savage but the fights feel like they're all over the place.

You have EX1 and EX2, both of them are very easy. But then you also have Barbariccia. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed that fight. Took our FC group of people with varying skill levels a two or three sessions to clear but it was fun. It was challenging but not insurmountable with some amount of effort. Still, Barbariccia and some of the other Extremes don't feel like they should be in the same difficulty bracket.

Savage is kind of the same, I think? P1S is very easy. It was a good "baby's first Savage" fight for me, though. P2S is probably the level of difficulty that I enjoy the most. Same as with Barbie, you can't do the fight half asleep, but it isn't particularly punishing and can be learned in a reasonable timeframe. After that, P3S follows. I don't like that fight. I ended up getting the clear recently and it was not a good time. There are people who enjoyed it, I'm sure, I just wasn't one of them. But again, P1S and P3S feel like they shouldn't both be in the "Savage" difficulty bracket.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that there is some small amount of midcore content in the game, but it's a pain to identify it. We most certainly can't rely on the fight difficulty labels.

[Supersnow845]

For me anything requiring that I schedule set times with 7 to 23 other people and have to give an actual time commitment moves content out of mid-core into hardcore for me.

Having to guarantee my availability at specific times would be too much for me at this stage in life.

Same with content that would require outside communication systems like discord or voice chats.

I think the problem here is in the environment 14 has cultivated over the years if your definition of midcore involves basically having no preplanning no communication and no outside discussion tools, just pugging in instance then really the only content devs can make that satisfy’s that is your difficult alliance raid bosses like Diablo

Even pugging easy extremes generally have FOMO and is server time dependant and a lot of people will still want to communicate

That’s a very limited window for what defines midcore (note I’m not saying you are wrong for having this opinion)

[ZephyrMenodora]

I think the problem here is in the environment 14 has cultivated over the years if your definition of midcore involves basically having no preplanning no communication and no outside discussion tools, just pugging in instance then really the only content devs can make that satisfy’s that is your difficult alliance raid bosses like Diablo

Even pugging easy extremes generally have FOMO and is server time dependant and a lot of people will still want to communicate

That’s a very limited window for what defines midcore (note I’m not saying you are wrong for having this opinion)

Just stating how I feel. I'm not saying people can't watch guides or anything to pre-plan/ prepare. I do that even for normals. But at the point where I have to schedule on my calendar a time I have to be available, it's no longer mid-core to me. It's hard-core to get to the point where the game has become such a priority you have to cancel plans or not make plans at certain times because you have to be online with your pre-made.

So yes I think there can be some pre-planning. The content can also require that you get a certain level of gear that isn't 40 ilvls behind current gear. Like needing 640 or 645 for current content. And you can communicate with tools in game, so I didn't say no communication.

I want to have the need for communication, organization and pre-planning just without having to make a set schedule for it, that's about it for me when it comes to that topic.

An example is taking dispel before fighting Ovni in Hydatos because it's required for at least one person to bring it so everybody doesn't die.

Sorry - out of posts. I think this is fair. I could compromise on communication tools - but for me the hard line is needing a static and scheduling my life around one.

People want no outside discussion tools required because then all control goes outside the window, you lose all protections that the TOS normally gives, since SE typically punts all out of game conflict to the players to handle.

Honestly this didn't even cross my mind. I was more concerned with having to coordinate personal accounts outside FFXIV that I'd rather not have to share with people for mid-core content. I'm not even personally adverse to parses - I personally like them. And I think mid-core content should be challenging enough that people need to perform at a certain level. But I know parses are against the TOS so I guess finding a way to guarantee performance just isn't possible unless that rule changed.

[VerdeLuck]

I think the problem here is in the environment 14 has cultivated over the years if your definition of midcore involves basically having no preplanning no communication and no outside discussion tools, just pugging in instance then really the only content devs can make that satisfy’s that is your difficult alliance raid bosses like Diablo

Even pugging easy extremes generally have FOMO and is server time dependant and a lot of people will still want to communicate

That’s a very limited window for what defines midcore (note I’m not saying you are wrong for having this opinion)

People want no outside discussion tools required because then all control goes outside the window, you lose all protections that the TOS normally gives, since SE typically punts all out of game conflict to the players to handle.
If I join a discord server for voice and get screamed at because someone's ACT says I'm underperforming, I'm forced to just take it, there's nothing I can do. All the normal protections that would stop them from doing it are not applicable.
If the discord that owns the content decrees that I have to authenticate my main account with their bots and unhide my fflogs or I can't do the content, I just have to take that because if I call up a GM they're gonna tell me they don't handle anything that happens outside the servers or officials.

It doesn't need to be no communication but it shouldn't require anything outside of the parameters of what the game client provides. Savage is hardcore content and that is perfectly puggable with no voice chat and just the in game text chat and markers.

[Zairava]

Just stating how I feel. I'm not saying people can't watch guides or anything to pre-plan/ prepare. I do that even for normals. But at the point where I have to schedule on my calendar a time I have to be available, it's no longer mid-core to me. It's hard-core to get to the point where the game has become such a priority you have to cancel plans or not make plans at certain times because you have to be online with your pre-made.

So yes I think there can be some pre-planning. The content can also require that you get a certain level of gear that isn't 40 ilvls behind current gear. Like needing 640 or 645 for current content. And you can communicate with tools in game, so I didn't say no communication.

I want to have the need for communication, organization and pre-planning just without having to make a set schedule for it, that's about it for me when it comes to that topic.

An example is taking dispel before fighting Ovni in Hydatos because it's required for at least one person to bring it so everybody doesn't die.

[Supersnow845]

I want to have the need for communication, organization and pre-planning just without having to make a set schedule for it, that's about it for me when it comes to that topic.

An example is taking dispel before fighting Ovni in Hydatos because it's required for at least one person to bring it so everybody doesn't die.

Which is actually funny because you really don’t actually need dispel if you know what you are doing on ovni, bringing dispel just makes it impossible to die

But again I think you guys have a warped view oh what’s gonna happen on discord (note I’m not saying discord should be required except maybe for old content to keep it alive), 14 players are so conflict averse if you truly are underperforming on ACT they won’t call you out for it they will just leave or just quietly kick you, things they can already do now

[Elissar]

This video is objectively speaking, wrong.
The way she describes the casual player is awful. The leap between easy/normal content and extremes is not big. Each fight teach you as the battle goes on (Golbez is a good example), you don't need a static to clear extremes. Savage is a different thing, they do more puzzles and positioning than extremes. It's more complicated to clear Savage in party finder.

Tbh if you reached lv90 and have no main or any idea of your rotation, you need to explore more. Variant/criterion content can be great for training. We have dummies for a reason. The game does what it can do to stimulate your progress. She said "the game doens't teach you about your rotation", what else do you need? lol

As i said, weird video, feels like she started to play ANY GAME last week.

This one was made just to pay her bills.

[Zairava]

Which is actually funny because you really don’t actually need dispel if you know what you are doing on ovni, bringing dispel just makes it impossible to die

But again I think you guys have a warped view oh what’s gonna happen on discord (note I’m not saying discord should be required except maybe for old content to keep it alive), 14 players are so conflict averse if you truly are underperforming on ACT they won’t call you out for it they will just leave or just quietly kick you, things they can already do now

Oh, I couldn't care less about muh barse, even if someone were to call me out it just would be a silent "okay, and?" and I'd be on my merry way. I know not everyone is like that, but for me how the job is actually designed mechanically is far more important, potencies could always be adjusted.

(For the record, this is not me saying I don't care about my overall performance. I can tell if I'm doing something wrong and whether someone corrects me or not I aim to improve it)