Zepla: The Players Endwalker Left Behind

[Supersnow845]

For me anything requiring that I schedule set times with 7 to 23 other people and have to give an actual time commitment moves content out of mid-core into hardcore for me.

Having to guarantee my availability at specific times would be too much for me at this stage in life.

Same with content that would require outside communication systems like discord or voice chats.

I think the problem here is in the environment 14 has cultivated over the years if your definition of midcore involves basically having no preplanning no communication and no outside discussion tools, just pugging in instance then really the only content devs can make that satisfy’s that is your difficult alliance raid bosses like Diablo

Even pugging easy extremes generally have FOMO and is server time dependant and a lot of people will still want to communicate

That’s a very limited window for what defines midcore (note I’m not saying you are wrong for having this opinion)

[ZephyrMenodora]

I think the problem here is in the environment 14 has cultivated over the years if your definition of midcore involves basically having no preplanning no communication and no outside discussion tools, just pugging in instance then really the only content devs can make that satisfy’s that is your difficult alliance raid bosses like Diablo

Even pugging easy extremes generally have FOMO and is server time dependant and a lot of people will still want to communicate

That’s a very limited window for what defines midcore (note I’m not saying you are wrong for having this opinion)

Just stating how I feel. I'm not saying people can't watch guides or anything to pre-plan/ prepare. I do that even for normals. But at the point where I have to schedule on my calendar a time I have to be available, it's no longer mid-core to me. It's hard-core to get to the point where the game has become such a priority you have to cancel plans or not make plans at certain times because you have to be online with your pre-made.

So yes I think there can be some pre-planning. The content can also require that you get a certain level of gear that isn't 40 ilvls behind current gear. Like needing 640 or 645 for current content. And you can communicate with tools in game, so I didn't say no communication.

I want to have the need for communication, organization and pre-planning just without having to make a set schedule for it, that's about it for me when it comes to that topic.

An example is taking dispel before fighting Ovni in Hydatos because it's required for at least one person to bring it so everybody doesn't die.

Sorry - out of posts. I think this is fair. I could compromise on communication tools - but for me the hard line is needing a static and scheduling my life around one.

People want no outside discussion tools required because then all control goes outside the window, you lose all protections that the TOS normally gives, since SE typically punts all out of game conflict to the players to handle.

Honestly this didn't even cross my mind. I was more concerned with having to coordinate personal accounts outside FFXIV that I'd rather not have to share with people for mid-core content. I'm not even personally adverse to parses - I personally like them. And I think mid-core content should be challenging enough that people need to perform at a certain level. But I know parses are against the TOS so I guess finding a way to guarantee performance just isn't possible unless that rule changed.

[Zairava]

Just stating how I feel. I'm not saying people can't watch guides or anything to pre-plan/ prepare. I do that even for normals. But at the point where I have to schedule on my calendar a time I have to be available, it's no longer mid-core to me. It's hard-core to get to the point where the game has become such a priority you have to cancel plans or not make plans at certain times because you have to be online with your pre-made.

So yes I think there can be some pre-planning. The content can also require that you get a certain level of gear that isn't 40 ilvls behind current gear. Like needing 640 or 645 for current content. And you can communicate with tools in game, so I didn't say no communication.

I want to have the need for communication, organization and pre-planning just without having to make a set schedule for it, that's about it for me when it comes to that topic.

An example is taking dispel before fighting Ovni in Hydatos because it's required for at least one person to bring it so everybody doesn't die.

[Supersnow845]

I want to have the need for communication, organization and pre-planning just without having to make a set schedule for it, that's about it for me when it comes to that topic.

An example is taking dispel before fighting Ovni in Hydatos because it's required for at least one person to bring it so everybody doesn't die.

Which is actually funny because you really don’t actually need dispel if you know what you are doing on ovni, bringing dispel just makes it impossible to die

But again I think you guys have a warped view oh what’s gonna happen on discord (note I’m not saying discord should be required except maybe for old content to keep it alive), 14 players are so conflict averse if you truly are underperforming on ACT they won’t call you out for it they will just leave or just quietly kick you, things they can already do now

[Zairava]

Which is actually funny because you really don’t actually need dispel if you know what you are doing on ovni, bringing dispel just makes it impossible to die

But again I think you guys have a warped view oh what’s gonna happen on discord (note I’m not saying discord should be required except maybe for old content to keep it alive), 14 players are so conflict averse if you truly are underperforming on ACT they won’t call you out for it they will just leave or just quietly kick you, things they can already do now

Oh, I couldn't care less about muh barse, even if someone were to call me out it just would be a silent "okay, and?" and I'd be on my merry way. I know not everyone is like that, but for me how the job is actually designed mechanically is far more important, potencies could always be adjusted.

(For the record, this is not me saying I don't care about my overall performance. I can tell if I'm doing something wrong and whether someone corrects me or not I aim to improve it)

[Supersnow845]

Oh, I couldn't care less about muh barse, even if someone were to call me out it just would be a silent "okay, and?" and I'd be on my merry way. I know not everyone is like that, but for me how the job is actually designed mechanically is far more important, potencies could always be adjusted.

(For the record, this is not me saying I don't care about my overall performance. I can tell if I'm doing something wrong and whether someone corrects me or not I aim to improve it)

Sorry that was my bad only the dispel part was actually in relation to your comment, the rest of it about discord is as more just general for the current direction of this thread, I should have made the distinction

[VerdeLuck]

I think the problem here is in the environment 14 has cultivated over the years if your definition of midcore involves basically having no preplanning no communication and no outside discussion tools, just pugging in instance then really the only content devs can make that satisfy’s that is your difficult alliance raid bosses like Diablo

Even pugging easy extremes generally have FOMO and is server time dependant and a lot of people will still want to communicate

That’s a very limited window for what defines midcore (note I’m not saying you are wrong for having this opinion)

People want no outside discussion tools required because then all control goes outside the window, you lose all protections that the TOS normally gives, since SE typically punts all out of game conflict to the players to handle.
If I join a discord server for voice and get screamed at because someone's ACT says I'm underperforming, I'm forced to just take it, there's nothing I can do. All the normal protections that would stop them from doing it are not applicable.
If the discord that owns the content decrees that I have to authenticate my main account with their bots and unhide my fflogs or I can't do the content, I just have to take that because if I call up a GM they're gonna tell me they don't handle anything that happens outside the servers or officials.

It doesn't need to be no communication but it shouldn't require anything outside of the parameters of what the game client provides. Savage is hardcore content and that is perfectly puggable with no voice chat and just the in game text chat and markers.