Results -9 to 0 of 94

Threaded View

  1. #21
    Player
    Renathras's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    2,747
    Character
    Ren Thras
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Katish View Post
    ...
    WHM in XIII is Medic, not Synergist. Synergist had the En spells, not Medic. Some spin offs and XI (where RDM did it better) aren't exactly the best cases. Also...doesn't WHM in XI only have the Holy element En spell?

    It has BAR spells, like Barthunder. Maybe that's what you're thinking of?

    True that many were turn based, but not all of them have been.

    WHM in its current state is like many other WHMs in the series. If anything, it's far more offensive.

    Many WHM Jobs have Cure spells, Protect/Shell (sometimes -ga versions for AOE, sometimes both at once with Wall), Raise (Life/Life 2/Reraise), Regen, Esuna, and Holy and that's it. That's FFTactics WHM right there. X-2 has Reflect, Dispell, and Haste/-ega. FF3's, origin of the Job system, White Mage didn't have Shell, Raise 2, Reraise, but did have Libra, Aero/-ga, Stone/-a, Sight (opens the world map...how novel), Teleport (which we all have), and stat effects Toad, Mini, Confuse, Silence, and Poisona to specifically cure Poison at low levels when the player didn't have Esuna. FF5, second game to use the Job system, had a WHM that added Blink to its spell list but dropped Aero/Stone magics, but picked up Arise (Life 2). FF4's Rosa adds Hold (stun), Slow, and Float (mainly used in two dungeons to prevent damage from stepping on damaging tiles in the non-battle environment maps); she also has Pray (chance of a party heal or failure doing nothing) and Aim (when using a bow, making a slower attack that is guaranteed not to miss). Porom from the same game, the other White Mage, has the same spells, does not have Pray or Aim, instead having Cry (makes enemies easier to steal from) and Twincast (combination attack with her brother, which is a bit more of a story thing). Neither have Stone or Aero spells. In fact, NO White Mages other than FF3 in the mainline series have Stone or Aero spells (in FF7, they aren't even from a standard Materia, and are skills enemies use, I think exclusively...)

    Tactics Advanced is a slimmed down version of Tactics (doesn't even have Holy), though it has "White Combo". A2 has Refresh (which isn't an MP recovery, it cures things that Esuna doesn't, because Esuna in that game...doesn't). And the OG Final Fantasy 1 White Mage had an expansive ability list...because it didn't have Esuna and had individual heals for various status effects, the Cure line of spells, the Heal (basically Medica) line of spells, the Dia line of spells (OG WHM had Dia, not Aero/Stone, which seems to ONLY be a WHM thing in FF3 specifically), Holy, Protect, Blink, Invis, Silence, Dispel, Exit, Life, Full-life, five Null- spells (including NullAll), and the "Stone" you might see in the list is Stona, the cure for petrification (falls under the status effect heals).

    WHM in 14 is only unlike other WHMs in the series in that it has a lot of powerful heals with no cast times or MP costs (and unlike Pray, are both large and have no risk of failure), and has possibly the largest slate of offensive spell lines of any Final Fantasy White Mage, having Glare(Stone), Dia(Aero), Assize, Holy, and Afflatus Misery. While it only has 5 at one time, the only other WHM to match that was FF3, and only if you include the AOE versions of Stone and Aero as separate abilities...in which case they're both tied at 5. Not being a menu based game, FFXIV doesn't have separate status effect cures for each status effect (opting for only Esuna) and doesn't have a "better Raise" (or Reraise). It doesn't have Protect or Shell, but has Divine Benison and Aquaveil/Temperance (the latter 2 of which do the same thing). It further has extra utility and modifier spells like Plenary Indulgence and Presence of Mind (a self-only Haste spell)

    It actually stacks up pretty well against any of the WHMs in the single player games...

    Healing isn't "a joke", it's just not balls to the wall intense. And I'll note WHM in FFXIV is already at risk of being LOW in number of heals compared to several WHMs in the series. If it had many less, then it WOULD be "unlike any WHM in the series (in a bad way)", actually.

    Quote Originally Posted by Osmond View Post
    SGE is great to play, but too easy for its own good. It has more healing than a SCH, has more DPS than a SCH, has more mitigation than a SCH. The job ends up becoming too forgiving so I can see ppl like it more than SCH.

    They will be forced to overhaul SCH if they make SGE even more forgiving in 7.0.
    It may be more forgiving, but I don't think that's why people like it more. Its kit isn't at war with itself. I've said it since at least SB, and a lot of other people have said it as well, SCH's kit fights itself.

    Some people absolutely love that, but a lot of people abjectly hate it. Energy Drain is fighting your AF heals like Soil, Excog, and Indom (the first two of which are cool abilities people, WANT to use), Faerie abilities are unavailable during Seraph (Fey Blessing, Aetherpact) and Dissipation (all of them), Dissipation gives you AF but doesn't boost your AF/oGCD healing, only your magic (GCD/cast) heals, and even though it gives you AF, the expended AFs for its duration (since Eos is dismissed) don't contribute to Faerie Gauge, your Faerie is sometimes unresponsive and abilities can be ghosted (this is way better than it used to be, but still CAN happen), your level 60, 70, and 80 capstone abilities are at war with each other. SCH spends so much time fighting its own kit, that it is clunky, unintuitive, and feels bad to play. Worse, it's signature heals - Adlo, Succor, and Sacred Soil - are all abilities you rarely, if ever, want to use, and the cast heals are less responsive than SGE's due to their cast times.

    SGE, on the other hand, takes SCH's base and fixes...all of that. Its signature move is Kardia, which it uses all the time. Kardia doesn't have any ghosting issues like Eos. Your Addersting and Addersgall are two separate gauges, so you never feel bad about using abilities like Kerachole or Taurochole, its level 60 (Physis II), 70 (Haima), and 80 (Panhaima) abilities aren't at war with each other (though the latter two are best used in series not simultaneously - but they don't lock you out of the other nor out of any part of your kit), no part of the kit at all is at war with any other part, and even its shields are more responsive than SCH's, including its oGCD Haima/Panhaima/Holos ones. It doesn't have the clunk that SCH has for any of these things, either.

    While SGE doesn't exactly match the big brain archetype in execution, its design just works while SCH's design has the player fighting with their kit and the kit fighting with itself.

    Again, some people love that...many people do not. So it's not about being easy, it's about not being clunky. And as many people have said before, clunk is not challenge, it's bad design.
    (0)
    Last edited by Renathras; 04-02-2023 at 10:50 AM. Reason: EDIT for length

Tags for this Thread