Is there a possibility of making every single S rank working like Ixion?

[Eisi]

Oh look, it's a troll

I mean a little bit sure I thought that was obvious the way I talked about DCs but Deveryn took it all at face value.

Weeell partially a troll, a lil serious too.

[Jojoya]

Early pullers, with some of those mostly NOT even being the spawners, relayers or otherwise making any contribution other than rushing every single S rank for no reason, are actually plaguing the hunt community because "they're not against ToS for not respecting others", and "if you shout their name you would be reported for harassment". As a part-time spawner/relayer I've done my share of S/SS rank hunting at least for Endwalker part, but new, casual or returning players doing it as part of their gameplay.

I know Squeenix is not going to do anything to punish those morons, but please introduce some ADHD-proof to S rank such as those of Ixion. These mobs are SUPER notorious and deserve such mechanics.

There's no such thing as an early puller per Square Enix. They have held fast to that every time the subject comes up.

What's more important is that someone pulling on arrival isn't a problem as long as the rest of those showing up don't follow suit. Get a hit in then back off. I've watched S ranks pulled almost immediately last 3-4 minutes because those showing up did exactly that - got their hit in then backed off. Three minutes is more than enough time for players to arrive and participate. There's no sensible reason to be trying to hold S ranks for 10 minutes.

If the rest of those showing do follow suit and attack, then the problem doesn't seem to be the player pulling on arrival. The problem is the player who wants things held up despite the majority attending not agreeing to a delay.

It's pretty funny that most of the hunt drama I've seen so far on Dynamis would have been 100% avoided if the spawns were simply relayed to the entire community the moment they were found instead of a certain segment of players trying to play control games through their special app (and no, I'm not talking about hunt bots). Most players don't mind waiting the 3 minutes it takes to get to the majority of S ranks (with Leucrotta spawning in Gamma and the like needing an extra minute for travel). They do mind waiting the 10 minutes that some want to insist on. That's enough time for players to clear a dungeon, why would they want to wait that long for a single kill?

The advice we always give to players on Crystal - if you want to attend the S rank, drop what you're doing the moment the relay goes out and get there now. Don't expect others to wait for you. Don't get upset if you miss out - there will be others.

Maybe the best solution is just to remove them. Drama over.

Best solution is to change the rewards. If hunts weren't such a good source of tomestones (and augments in the odd patches) for almost zero effort on the part of those that don't actually do the hunting, the majority of players wouldn't care about them.

Improvements would include blocking Wanderer and Traveler tags from damaging the boss, limiting rewards to the first 24 or so people, and other stuff that emphasizes the FFA nature of the Hunt. Improvements would not include timed invuln on the boss or a "can't pull" timer.

Remove the FFA from the Hunt and it's no longer the Hunt.

The real problem is the players who want to be rewarded without doing any of the hunting.

While it goes against the idea of FFA, the tag block sounds like a great idea. At the very least, DC hopping for hunts should be discouraged.

The excessively long pull timers that some what to use is precisely what encourages the cross world/cross data center hunting.

If you know it's going to be pulled almost immediately after the relay goes out, you're not going to bother leaving your world. You know you won't get there in time.

If you know there's a good chance it won't get pulled for 5-10 minutes, then you will because that's plenty of time. Right now, data center travel in NA is taking less than 90 seconds unless you're trying to get to a congested world during prime time. I've had times it's taken less than 30 seconds in offpeak hours.

I don't think hunt trains were ever intended anyways.

They weren't. SE has told us they don't particularly like the trains. They're not going to do anything to stop players from forming them but they're also not going to do anything to help formalize them.

I have a vague memory that they maybe addressed this one time and said that they can't make S-ranks work like FATEs and still have the unique triggers to spawn the bosses.

They said they could do it but it would take too much time that could be used for developing new content. It would also be removing a more unique form of content from the game and turn them into just another FATE. FATEs are generally disliked by the player community so why would they want to take other content just to make more FATEs?

As for triggers, we already have triggers for the big FATEs so that would be a non-issue. They might not be able to have the same variety of triggers used for S ranks but there could still be triggers.

The current Hunt, at least for S Ranks (I enjoy A Rank trains) I only engage in because of the rewards, not because the encounters are so fun to play.

And that is what is leading to the current problems with the hunt - the rewards.

Many of us do enjoy the actual hunt for its sake, not for the rewards. But the massive piles of rewards that are relevant to end game make the Hunt far too lucrative for most players to pass up. Significantly reduce or change the rewards, and those who don't like the content would stop taking an interest in it.

Imagine actually trying to claim that hunts are keeping people from logging in

They obviously don't prevent players from logging in but they do prevent players trying to do other content from entering zones on occasion. While most players will find the delay a momentary inconvenience at worst, gatherers can miss out on timed windows if they try to teleport and are locked out due to congestion. It's especially bothersome for FSH since some of their big fish windows are extremely rare and short in duration.

Maybe you exist on a cultured, smarter and more self-serving datacenter which values maximum S Rank exploitation for everyone. If there are 200 people interested in an S Rank on those worlds, 200 will get the S Rank. Those DCs usually respect a construction they call the spawner's right to engage and are strictly organized and dominated by a central hunt force.

SE has never intended for 200 players let alone 500 players to attend a specific S rank kill.

Most of organized hunting and its terminology is 100% a construct of the community not intended by SE. In their eyes, there is no such thing as early pulling, there is no such thing as sniping. It is open world content, first come first serve. if you miss out on one spawn, there is always the next.

I haven't done the hunt on Primal in a while, but it was a mixed bag at the time. The general consensus leans towards 5 minutes from the pop time. It's fair and people should expect to miss it if the queue is more than 50 to hop over. Occasionally, there's an idiot lurking about about and an effort is made to reset.

Except SE will ban players for intentionally resetting marks already engaged if it's reported. They will not ban someone for pulling.

Again, it's problematic drama created by players trying to control how others can play the game.

If you feel someone attacked before they should have, the solution is easy. Don't attack. You're under no onus to attack simply because you're present. Let them solo it a few minutes to give others a chance to arrive. Any competent max level tank will have no issues staying alive by themselves for that length of time.

[Eisi]

[QUOTE=Jojoya;6132959]
And that is what is leading to the current problems with the hunt - the rewards.

Many of us do enjoy the actual hunt for its sake, not for the rewards. But the massive piles of rewards that are relevant to end game make the Hunt far too lucrative for most players to pass up. Significantly reduce or change the rewards, and those who don't like the content would stop taking/QUOTE]

To be clear, I do it for the mounts, the endgame tomestones are just a nice added benefit. Would you want to see the mount rewards gone as well? I think this is the driving force for most hunters.

Also I'm not being facetious, what is it that you find fun about hunting that makes it rewarding on its own? I am genuinely curious.

[Eisi]

SE has never intended for 200 players let alone 500 players to attend a specific S rank kill.

Did they say what they actually intended? What's stopping them from enforcing it? Cause what you describe happens all the time and is to be expected when you make hunts open world ffa content.

I think the development of community driven organized hunting is awesome. Would recommend every new hunter to join in!

[FireMage]

They obviously don't prevent players from logging in but they do prevent players trying to do other content from entering zones on occasion. While most players will find the delay a momentary inconvenience at worst, gatherers can miss out on timed windows if they try to teleport and are locked out due to congestion. It's especially bothersome for FSH since some of their big fish windows are extremely rare and short in duration.

I'll take Things That Don't Happen for 400

[Heroman3003]

Did they say what they actually intended? What's stopping them from enforcing it? Cause what you describe happens all the time and is to be expected when you make hunts open world ffa content.

I think the development of community driven organized hunting is awesome. Would recommend every new hunter to join in!

Because there is no way to enforce, or any NEED to enforce FFA-style content. Thats the point of it being FFA. If people choose to organize? Fine, their choice. If people choose to just go for it on their own? Also fine, it is FFA.

The only annoying thing about hunts is sheer insane amount you need to get for achievements, compared to their actual respawn timer/windows.

[Jojoya]

And that is what is leading to the current problems with the hunt - the rewards.

Many of us do enjoy the actual hunt for its sake, not for the rewards. But the massive piles of rewards that are relevant to end game make the Hunt far too lucrative for most players to pass up. Significantly reduce or change the rewards, and those who don't like the content would stop taking

To be clear, I do it for the mounts, the endgame tomestones are just a nice added benefit. Would you want to see the mount rewards gone as well? I think this is the driving force for most hunters.

Also I'm not being facetious, what is it that you find fun about hunting that makes it rewarding on its own? I am genuinely curious.

I've been conducting and part time spawning for over 4 years now. I still don't have my Centurio Tiger because I rarely attend S ranks I don't help spawn (I'm WAAAAYYYYY past 10k Rank A kills). At my current pace, I might have it by the end of this expansion. Or I might not and I'll end up with it sometime after the start of 7.0.

It doesn't bother me. Those achievements are expected to be done over the long term, not over a few months. As long as i keep participating in the Hunt, I will have them eventually. Because they're long term achievements, there would be no reason to remove them as rewards.

What some players need to learn is that they're not intended to get everything immediately. Get all the rewards now and you have nothing left to look forward to. I see so many people rush through trying to get those mounts and are they happy once they have them? Not really. They still feel like they're lacking something. What did they accomplish by rushing to get those achievements in that case?

I've got things to look forward to because I'm not trying to rush the content. I'll take the time to help spawn, which prevents me from attending other spawns happening while I'm out there killing 100 Weepers on the moon. I'll take the time to map for other spawners instead of attending the spawns occurring while I'm mapping. But eventually my kill total will reach that 2k S ranks and I'll have my Tiger. It will be a true achievement for me because I'll be able to look back at all the things I did to make it happen instead of riding on the coattails of others who put in the real work.

[Deveryn]

No I made that comment about Canadane. Plus I was doing it for comedic effect. So actually you style yourself a victim .

But as you wish, I'mma go full frontal on your polite Duskwight ass, bring it on, baby!!

Maybe direct the comment at the intended target (you quoted me, not them), but that would be un-troll-like. I wasn't taking anything at face value, I just wanted you to admit your dumb mistake.

[Jojoya]

Did they say what they actually intended? What's stopping them from enforcing it? Cause what you describe happens all the time and is to be expected when you make hunts open world ffa content.

I think the development of community driven organized hunting is awesome. Would recommend every new hunter to join in!

They've been at most vague about what they did intend but they've been specific at times about what wasn't intended. The organization of the hunt community to the extent it currently is has been one of those things mentioned as not intended.

I agree that the organization is awesome but it comes with its own set of problems and there are players within the community that need to be more realistic about what those problems mean. (writing this just after reading a short rant from someone in a hunt Discord about "hunt clout stealing", my eyes are still rolling).

I'll take Things That Don't Happen for 400

Except those things have happened. They've just never happened to you, It's happened to me when I've been out gathering and a S rank spawns or train passes through the same zone I want to get into.

On the other hand, I don't nerdrage about it. Same as hunts, if I miss this window there will be another window for the same node about a half hour later.

But it definitely can interfere with the big fish windows. I don't blame those who are upset when by the time the system lets them into the zone and they can travel to the fishing hole, the window is closed. Even if the window is known in advance, you can't predict if someone's going to run a train or spawn a S rank in the zone at that same time.

[KageTokage]

I do feel like the hunt reward system could use some tweaking because the current system promotes laziness when the people who actively seek out/spawn the hunts are privy to no additional reward coupled with the fact that if you're partied you only have to tap the hunt once to get full credit.

At both A/S ranks alike I tend to see numerous people who just tag the hunt to get credit then go run off into a corner...which at times leads to the hunt resetting itself if it decides to target those people. It's arguably a good thing to have less people actively attacking a hunt during prime time so others have more time to show up, but I still see people doing this even in the dead hours of the morning/night where barely anyone shows up, which just makes the hunt take a frustratingly time to kill while still conferring the risk of it resetting itself.