Hildibrand for relic? Really?

[Rolder50]

Hildibrand is..... a thing, yeah. But you know what the real sin is?

The new relics being an ARR-style grind. Once upon a time, the near entire community loathed this manner of relic acquisition process. Wonder what changed?

Oh, right. Endwalker happened and suddenly no matter what, Yoshi-P became an infallible god overnight and literally nothing ever went wrong with FFXIV ever again.

Huh? The new relics is just "Spend 1500 uncapped tomestones" which doesn't seem like an ARR style grind at all. If anything it's too little.

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

Oh, right. Endwalker happened and suddenly no matter what, Yoshi-P became an infallible god overnight and literally nothing ever went wrong with FFXIV ever again.

You mean Arr.
This invisible God-Complex that seems to be attached to him started in Arr, where he Saved the game from being completely Tanked by the Original 1.0

[SilverObi]

Hildibrand is..... a thing, yeah. But you know what the real sin is?

The new relics being an ARR-style grind. Once upon a time, the near entire community loathed this manner of relic acquisition process. Wonder what changed?

Oh, right. Endwalker happened and suddenly no matter what, Yoshi-P became an infallible god overnight and literally nothing ever went wrong with FFXIV ever again.

I mean it sounds like any style of content, there's tons who liked it and tons who hated it. After two expansion of exploration content being tied to relics it's not surprising people find the older format refreshing or at least different.

[Atelier-Bagur]

Huh? The new relics is just "Spend 1500 uncapped tomestones" which doesn't seem like an ARR style grind at all. If anything it's too little.

need you be reminded, last relic chain in ShB started the exact same way with having 1000 tomestones to buy 4 Thavnairian powders for the base weapon (the first one you get was actually a freebie).

[Akiudo]

I mean it sounds like any style of content, there's tons who liked it and tons who hated it. After two expansion of exploration content being tied to relics it's not surprising people find the older format refreshing or at least different.

it's not just that, "the old style" of relic aquisition was in large part loathed for its sheer scale and time investment needed. the newer relic questlines simply go by a lot quicker if you compare them to a realm reborn.

lots of people don't really see this because they didn't play back than, or not all that active, but just think about the fact that the "book step" of the arr relics wasn't seen as particularly bad when it came out. like no, no one thought that was easy but it also really wasn't any worse than the steps that came after. (it's just that they never found a proper way to nerf the books [and even there they nerfed the amount of mobs you need to kill AND raised the fate spawn rate for corresponding fates], so now they stick out hard compared to the rest).

ARR Relic style (doing fates, dungeons, spending tomestones and maybe some gil) is totally fine every once in a while as long as i only need to do 200 fates for a single step and not 2000 (and yes, i counted, that was for ONE step)

[Nezerius]

Hildibrand is..... a thing, yeah. But you know what the real sin is?

The new relics being an ARR-style grind. Once upon a time, the near entire community loathed this manner of relic acquisition process. Wonder what changed?

Oh, right. Endwalker happened and suddenly no matter what, Yoshi-P became an infallible god overnight and literally nothing ever went wrong with FFXIV ever again.

You mean Stormblood happened. More specifically Pagos (but also Anemos to a lesser extent). Pagos was absolutely disliked on its release. Mainly for its slower spawn rate of NMs, and the fact that it put a higher emphasis on getting a chain bonus up to 30 without breaking it (which was almost carpal tunnel inducing). Anemos was generally regarded as boring. Most people quickly ended up on NM trains, where the majority of the train wasn't even able to help spawn NMs.

The general opinion regarding both of these zones, is that players disliked being forced into them as the only option to progress their relics. Players preferred having multiple options to progress their relic, rather than an instanced zone with a singular goal.
This is exactly why ShB's Resistance weapons didn't have their progress exclusively tied to the Bozjan Southern Front/Zadnor. But even with this system, there was a portion of the playerbase who disliked the fact that they were forced to complete Castrum Lacus Litore.

So they gave players what they were asking for during SB/ShB.

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

You mean Stormblood happened. More specifically Pagos (but also Anemos to a lesser extent). Pagos was absolutely disliked on its release. Mainly for its slower spawn rate of NMs, and the fact that it put a higher emphasis on getting a chain bonus up to 30 without breaking it (which was almost carpal tunnel inducing). Anemos was generally regarded as boring. Most people quickly ended up on NM trains, where the majority of the train wasn't even able to help spawn NMs.

The general opinion regarding both of these zones, is that players disliked being forced into them as the only option to progress their relics. Players preferred having multiple options to progress their relic, rather than an instanced zone with a singular goal.
This is exactly why ShB's Resistance weapons didn't have their progress exclusively tied to the Bozjan Southern Front/Zadnor. But even with this system, there was a portion of the playerbase who disliked the fact that they were forced to complete Castrum Lacus Litore.

So they gave players what they were asking for during SB/ShB.

In other words....no matter what, they cant win.
-They do something: People complain
-They try a new thing: People complain
-They try something completely new taking in feedback: People complain, saying how its locked to 1 system and its slow
-They retry it, taking in feedback allowing more paths to goal: People complain, say they liked old way
-Do something else: People complain it should be like last time

No matter what, they cant win.

[hagare]

In other words....no matter what, they cant win.

DING DING DING! WE HAVE A WINNER!

[Midareyukki]

No matter what, they cant win.

tbf I wanna say something like how they went about it the worst way.

They did tie the relic in Eureka to its story and progression, and people didn't like it. Because in Heavensward and such you had other methods of grinding for the materials you needed. There were optimal ways to do it, but if you couldn't access them, you had alternatives. Eureka had no such thing.
Bozja at least did have that. But then they tied the relic's progression steps to having cleared CLL despite having told people they wouldn't do that. The relics in general went about "fine", though still with a really obvious and repetitive grind. The problem was more so that they said they wouldn't lock the relic's progression to the story, and then they lock it behind Castrum. That's why people complained at the time. Here's the thing tho: I don't know if Yoshida said for sure that he wouldn't do it. All I know is that people perceived it that way from their comments, and felt like he had lied.

But even if they hadn't, someone would have complained.

Just like they are right now.

There's nothing different than Bozja's first step anyway in this one. It's just not done with Poetics, which if anything it helps keep current content alive, rather than try to keep past content alive. Yet people are going ballistic about it. Why? There's a precedent for this, you know what's coming. You want mind-numbing grinds? Calm down then, you'll get your 100 runs of Sil'dih Subterrane soon enough. The first step is always the easiest one. "Because they're repeating themselves"? I mean, considering how well-received the first Resistance Weapon was, why wouldn't they? Do you want to start out cranking up a light farm?

[Rufalus]

As a matter of taste, I would have to say ShB had the best weapon series because Matsuno was guest writer and they spent a lot of resources on that content. Had that cool Cid's memory Bozja Citadel solo instance, the Varis fight, a few raids and a couple of quite dull field ops instances, but the duels there were an interesting twist. Actually the CEs in those dull zones were very cool too if they popped, like Belias and Shemhazai. Matsuno's Ivalice stuff is some of my favorite stuff in the whole FF series.