Let's redefine "damage taxes"

[Zsolen]

If you're a casual and don't raid, then you probably have a pretty fantastic game. You wouldn't care about damage, you'd play the job you like. You may dislike stuff they've done like removing Kaiten and voice your concerns. As a balance stand point, removing Kaiten doesn't matter as long SAM still performs as it used to. Same goes for the rework of SMN & MNK. MNK is blessed because they perform really well. SMN is cursed because they really killed any creativity to optimize. A casual wouldn't care about that. All he sees is how cool he is to be the Ultima Weapon.

I've seen really bad players and some are my rl friends. I can't stress enough I know a Bard main who doesn't cast a single song. You think he really cares about his damage? He is having fun but he's smart enough to understand his opinion isn't needed in OF because he has no desire for that kind of stuff.

That's a lie. Just because people don't want to or have time to play savage, it doesn't mean they don't care about damage in the content they do. You basically lumped everyone that doesn't play savage into one category of ability and willingness to put in their best efforts.

What you said was beyond elitist, and I actually detest using that word.

I also would not call multi-season ranked pvpers casual. I know many people that raid and pvp, and pretty much everyone agrees ranked pvp is more stressful.

[Aikaal]

That's a lie. Just because people don't want to or have time to play savage, it doesn't mean they don't care about damage in the content they do. You basically lumped everyone that doesn't play savage into one category of ability and willingness to put in their best efforts.

What you said was beyond elitist, and I actually detest using that word.

I also would not call multi-season ranked pvpers casual. I know many people that raid and pvp, and pretty much everyone agrees ranked pvp is more stressful.

That's not being elite, that's being objective. You can usually categorize people. For example you can have people and have them be considered Casual/Hardcore & Toxic/Friendly

You can have an Hardcore player who is friendly. You can have a toxic casual. Those conditions are usually rarer.

So you can definitely have a friendly casual that really cares about damage on content he doesn't do. By content, you have Ultimates, Savage, Extreme/Raid, Relic, PvP and so on. I can tell you with a certitude that a player who doesn't do ultimate or savage usually most of them won't care if their job underperform. Even among hardcores, players usually pick what they like to play. It's not because Machinist is bottom of the barrel that it'll prevent players from playing Machinist.

So yeah, there is a chance one player who is extremely good at the game and likes damage and actually know what he's talking about will go on OF and give his input. Normally he'll make a lot of sense and it'll work just fine. However, if you have a player who comes in here and have no idea what he's talking about. Someone, iunno, I'll put Firemage Li as an example, then people will background check him because he doesn't make sense. It's not being an elite. It's being, "Who is this dude who clearly have a unique way of thinking that nobody agrees on. What kind of God player is he?" Well, if you background check, he's a 1 trick RDM player since Stormblood. He only plays and favors outwardly RDM so when he says something like... lemme pick a quote that he said.

RDM shouldn't be at the bottom, MCH and SMN should. RDM should be in the middle of the pack, along with RPR. The gap should be ~5%, not 1% and definitely not the ~11% we have now. You just don't understand how balance works

The part where he said the gap between best and lowest being 5% does make sense. But him saying SMN & MCH should be the worst DPS is biased and inaccurate. In the past, Red Mages have been victims of doing less damage than Summoners. Summoners have never been so close to Red Mages than this tier. That's not because RDM gained damage. To be honest; I play Red Mage but I also play all casters. I'm subbing WHM for a friend's group on P8S.I've got a melee background from Stormblood. I main DRG in PvP but PvP has nothing to do with PvE. The only thing you won't see me is play ranged physical and tank. Right now I don't play Melee because I refuse to promote Melee Fantasy XIV.

So yeah, in general, I'll categorize people from their background but I also know when someone is wrongly categorized.

You have terrible Mentor players.
You have outstanding sprouts.
You have toxic casuals.
You have friendly hardcore.

In this case, Firemage Li has cleared P8S yesterday. That's a decent pace for mediumcore. He does savage and have cleared some Ultimates. But we don't value what he says simply because all his takes are bad. He's opinionated over facts, he's biased toward Red Mage and let me tell you, there's a lot he can personally do to improve as a Red Mage. What I'm doing looks and sound harsh because it is. However, people like him need to be checked quickly. I guess he did forget that Manafication is 110s and it shouldn,t be delayed in the fight because you get an extra one at the end. 1 extra Manafication is an entire melee combo, the only reason you have damage on RDM.

[Kabooa]

That's not being elite, that's being objective. You can usually categorize people. For example you can have people and have them be considered Casual/Hardcore & Toxic/Friendly.

One should also keep in mind being good at a game doesn't mean one is good at balancing or designing it.

Likewise the inverse can be true.

We have to consider the merit of suggestions and ideas despite the source - The source is just a handy indicator of perspective.

[Aikaal]

One should also keep in mind being good at a game doesn't mean one is good at balancing or designing it.

Likewise the inverse can be true.

We have to consider the merit of suggestions and ideas despite the source - The source is just a handy indicator of perspective.

Oh right, that's true. Forgot to mention that. That, again, when someone is really good at the game he's usually more suitable to provide better points on stuff like balancing but this isn't an absolute truth either. You'll rarely see someone from the bottom of their heart will request a nerf if their job is too op lol. I can't really blame Monk players however, they were really strong and kept getting buffs they didn't ask for.

[Mithron]

Oh right, that's true. Forgot to mention that. That, again, when someone is really good at the game he's usually more suitable to provide better points on stuff like balancing but this isn't an absolute truth either. You'll rarely see someone from the bottom of their heart will request a nerf if their job is too op lol. I can't really blame Monk players however, they were really strong and kept getting buffs they didn't ask for.

As a PLD/DRK main, I want DRK's damage to be more inline with the rest of the tanks so there's minimal disparity, while also DRK having more utility and healing for trading less damage. For all accounts and puproses, that's a nerf, but that's the job fantasy of DRK for me. PLD/DRKs are the high utility low DPS tanks, WAR/GNB are the low utility high DPS tanks, but I want to see minimal differences in DPS disparity and the mitigation never being required, just comfy.

[Zsolen]

That's not being elite, that's being objective. You can usually categorize people. For example you can have people and have them be considered Casual/Hardcore & Toxic/Friendly

You can have an Hardcore player who is friendly. You can have a toxic casual. Those conditions are usually rarer.

So you can definitely have a friendly casual that really cares about damage on content he doesn't do. By content, you have Ultimates, Savage, Extreme/Raid, Relic, PvP and so on. I can tell you with a certitude that a player who doesn't do ultimate or savage usually most of them won't care if their job underperform. Even among hardcores, players usually pick what they like to play. It's not because Machinist is bottom of the barrel that it'll prevent players from playing Machinist.

So yeah, there is a chance one player who is extremely good at the game and likes damage and actually know what he's talking about will go on OF and give his input. Normally he'll make a lot of sense and it'll work just fine. However, if you have a player who comes in here and have no idea what he's talking about. Someone, iunno, I'll put Firemage Li as an example, then people will background check him because he doesn't make sense. It's not being an elite. It's being, "Who is this dude who clearly have a unique way of thinking that nobody agrees on. What kind of God player is he?" Well, if you background check, he's a 1 trick RDM player since Stormblood. He only plays and favors outwardly RDM so when he says something like... lemme pick a quote that he said.

Why are you talking about friendliness?

You shouldn't classify people with all kinds of capabilities and focus as just like your BRD friend until they prove otherwise. Casual does not equal bad. There are people that get carried in savage. There are even people that pay to get carried in content or have someone play for them. People clearing by certain points seems to be an indicator to you. Why? If they aren't talking about world first, what does it matter what week they clear?

Who cares what that RDM thinks. He continues to say dumb things.

Let's put it this way. Do you think the announcer Al Michaels, a man that has announced professional football games (and other sports) for decades, knows less about football than a player in their sophomore season in the NFL? According to you that young player would know a lot more, because Michaels never played a down in the NFL. Michaels didn't experience it like the player has.