PVP PLD Cheese Problem

[zabu]

That's the intended effect of PLD by design. It's how PLD plays in CC as well. Cover is meant to take all CC to the PLD. Otherwise, why would you pick PLD when it just has the lowest DPS of all the tanks?

That being said, you can still easily counter them with CC or even NIN LB. After all, they have little to no damage at all. Just bully them after they capture the flag and make their points gained useless. They can't contest against anyone if they're always beaten up and your team gets Battle High faster. Battle High is what ends up winning the game in the end.

It's pretty much a skill issue at that point if you keep on getting beaten up by the PLD cheese and can't win objectives. PLD cheese is really easy to beat as long as you have team members that hard focus them once you identify who they are. The main key point is that you can't let them play to their strengths (AKA let them freely capture and then run away without penalty). You either have to attack them early to break their plan ahead of time or punish them for using cover and guard early so that they have to die and respawn while your team gets higher stats from Battle High.

even though PLD has lowest DPS , it has great lead the team and push into the enemy team and crash the enemy. Damage is not everything.
How are you going to beaten 6 PLD running into the flag at the same time? Do we always have enough CC or NIN LB? Do most player even know that?! Isnt frontline casual content?
Can you even target enemy PLD when 10+ people standing under the flag?!!! I dont think our target system is that great.
As DPS, you can not even tank 48 people trying to attack people under the flag, you go in and literally die within 10 seconds before you can even do something on PLD.
Even with BH5, you cant do anything, literally tried it. BH is pretty late game stuff. Does that mean early game we can just look at PLD capture everything?

[AnotherPerson]

even though PLD has lowest DPS , it has great lead the team and push into the enemy team and crash the enemy. Damage is not everything.

That's the point. This is what makes PLD good. It has a unique niche. So it stands to reason that it shouldn't be taken away or nerfed, or they really have no niche otherwise.

How are you going to beaten 6 PLD running into the flag at the same time? Do we always have enough CC or NIN LB? Do most player even know that?! Isnt frontline casual content?
Can you even target enemy PLD when 10+ people standing under the flag?!!! I dont think our target system is that great.
As DPS, you can not even tank 48 people trying to attack people under the flag, you go in and literally die within 10 seconds before you can even do something on PLD.
Even with BH5, you cant do anything, literally tried it. BH is pretty late game stuff. Does that mean early game we can just look at PLD capture everything?

You see, that's the big issue you have. You're waiting until 6 PLD starts running towards the flag before attacking.
You have to either punish them before that happens by staggering them with CC, or you punish them right after.
Cover lasts for 10 seconds and has a 25 second cd. However, Guard has a 30 second cd and only lasts for 5 seconds.

The reason why PLD can capture using Guardian / Cover cheese is because they save Guard to cover their ally. If they don't have Guard up, they'll immediately get blown into pieces by enemy attacks.
So, why would you wait until they start running in WITH guard up? Why not just force them to guard early by blasting them ahead of time? If they can't reach the capture point with guard, they cannot defend against CC and capture the objective.


And yes, I can target enemy PLD with 10+ people standing under the flag. I can actually use my mouse or tab target until I select them. Basically every job have an attack that can be used for AoE. Lots of jobs have ranged AoEs. How else do you think Ninjas individually pick and find kills with their Limit break?
Plus, no one stands around for 10+ seconds in melee range unless they want to be killed. That's what weaving in and out of combat is supposed to be for. Why else do you have sprint?
So... again, skill issue.

[zabu]

That's the point. This is what makes PLD good. It has a unique niche. So it stands to reason that it shouldn't be taken away or nerfed, or they really have no niche otherwise.



You see, that's the big issue you have. You're waiting until 6 PLD starts running towards the flag before attacking.
You have to either punish them before that happens by staggering them with CC, or you punish them right after.
Cover lasts for 10 seconds and has a 25 second cd. However, Guard has a 30 second cd and only lasts for 5 seconds.

The reason why PLD can capture using Guardian / Cover cheese is because they save Guard to cover their ally. If they don't have Guard up, they'll immediately get blown into pieces by enemy attacks.
So, why would you wait until they start running in WITH guard up? Why not just force them to guard early by blasting them ahead of time? If they can't reach the capture point with guard, they cannot defend against CC and capture the objective.


And yes, I can target enemy PLD with 10+ people standing under the flag. I can actually use my mouse or tab target until I select them. Basically every job have an attack that can be used for AoE. Lots of jobs have ranged AoEs. How else do you think Ninjas individually pick and find kills with their Limit break?
Plus, no one stands around for 10+ seconds in melee range unless they want to be killed. That's what weaving in and out of combat is supposed to be for. Why else do you have sprint?
So... again, skill issue.

The point of HG is to push not to capture, this is literally abusive usage.
You can not expect everyone has the same mind set and skill level as you have..... This is casual content. Do not even complain skill issue in PVE then.

[AnotherPerson]

The point of HG is to push not to capture, this is literally abusive usage.
You can not expect everyone has the same mind set and skill level as you have..... This is casual content. Do not even complain skill issue in PVE then.

No, the point of Hallowed Ground is to create an opportunity by reducing the amount of incoming damage towards you and your party members. Likewise, the charge time of Hallowed Ground is equally as long to compensate on how gamechanging it can be when used at the right moment. However, it's up to the player to figure out how it can best suit their situation and needs. HG is never meant to be used solely for pushing, and it is your misconception for thinking so.

You say not everyone has the same mindset and skill level as I have, but then you go around and say it's casual content and people shouldn't complain about skill issue in PvE.
Have you thought what you said could also go against what your mindset is as well?

After all, casual content in PvP is still PvP. People who try harder in PvP naturally get better because they put in more effort to win. The same applies with PvE with skill rotations and understanding boss mechanics for casual content.
You are not required to put in more effort in PvP to play PvP. Likewise, you are not required to put in more effort in PvE to play PvE. However, it doesn't stop players from trying all sorts of ways to get better if they want to improve though.

People who can think out of the box to use PLD's Cover offensively is players taking full advantage of their toolkit in accordance to the situation at hand. It's the same concept as players utilizing SGE's LB to zone people out of capturing an objective rather than using it to defend themselves. Each strategy comes with its own risks and rewards, and the players who thought of the strategy believes the rewards outweigh the risks.

You don't have to play better and think out of the box to compete against other players who are actively strategizing more than the average player, but you shouldn't complain when others are trying harder to do better than you and you don't want to do the same. You will still get a reward for second and third place in Frontlines, regardless of how you perform.

[Teeko]

You will still get a reward for second and third place in Frontlines, regardless of how you perform.

Also, the mount achievements say hi.