It is not possible to play without doing dps as healer? every day i find someone...

[ty_taurus]

Ok. You presume to speak for others about what you think they should want from the game and get upset that someone else speaks for you. Alright.



But, again, the person you had responded to told you why she liked Protect: for the small group bonding moment at the start. Interpreting other peoples' comments as a jumping-off point to find common ground has to start with actually listening to other people. You can't just assume everyone likes what you like and go from there. You especially can't do it when they've already directly counter-indicated it.

Speaking for myself, I like long-duration buffs because 1) I like buffs for flavor, 2) in other games I've played they could be shared with strangers to be friendly, and 3) they shift some of the prepwork and reduce the overall cognitive load during combat. I have repeatedly said as much.

And yet somehow in interpreting what "our community" wants for healers, you arrive at "I don't believe old Protect had really anything to do with old healer engagement. It's more the idea of having more forms of mitigation and utility rather than the button that, in a perfect world, you press once and never again.", a summation which completely reverses and obliterates my stated position and substitutes your own desires in place of it.

If I seem to be irritated with you, it's because I'm irritated with you.



You feel it's important for you to speak for everyone so that on the off-chance a developer listens to the forum, they'll listen to you and not, say, someone who enjoys buffs because they offer a little bit of group bonding or because they reduce combat APM slightly.

Look, at the end of the day, I did not tell anyone how they're supposed to feel or how they feel. I didn't tell the person whom I was originally commenting on that she isn't allowed to liked Protect. All I said was, when people wax poetic about old mechanics like protect, I do not genuinely believe those tools are what actually let to their positive experience whether they were aware of that or not. That is not me putting words in other peoples' mouths. That is me giving my opinion on what I believe is going on in those conversations. It's no different than me saying something like I don't believe most people who eat at McDonalds are doing it because they enjoy the food. I think they do it because it's fast, convenient, and cheap. I cannot speak for literally every McDonalds consumer, I'm just giving my opinion on why I think people choose McDonalds over other options.

i.e. I don't think when most people wax poetic about protect, that it was actually protect that they enjoyed. I think it was everything else about healer gameplay they enjoyed and protect just happened to be there too.

I will say, it doesn't seem like anyone's agreeing with your stance on the matter, so take that with a grain of salt, I suppose.

[Absurdity]

Would you suggest that, as a 'set-and-forget' ability, Eos/Selene should be deleted despite how much people love her and replaced with an automatic SCH regen pulse? It'd be 99% identical apart from the aesthetic and the single button press, so you'd be on board with it, right?

Short answer: Yes.


Long answer: Since they removed the only useful features from the fairy with ShB, the ability to use any fairy ability at any time regardless of your own GCD, the ability to put barriers on your fairy and deploy from it and the ability to force Embrace on a target of your choosing, I would absolutely be fine with getting rid of it.

These features atleast gave the fairy it's own unique interactions, now you're literally just getting "aesthetics" in exchange for bad gameplay and heals that only do 75% of what the tooltip says.



The fairy is now nothing more than an oGCD but clunkier, even after the slight improvements to it's AI in EW. You could turn every ability into an oGCD for the Scholar and it would improve the gameplay.

As for Embrace, you could just make it Kardia but instead of needing to dps for the heal it would be an infinite regen, on a target of your choosing, that heals for 135 cure potency (or 180 potency since we finally stop paying a fairy tax) every 3 seconds.

[Rilifane]

Short answer: Yes.


Long answer: Since they removed the only useful features from the fairy with ShB, the ability to use any fairy ability at any time regardless of your own GCD, the ability to put barriers on your fairy and deploy from it and the ability to force Embrace on a target of your choosing, I would absolutely be fine with getting rid of it.

These features atleast gave the fairy it's own unique interactions, now you're literally just getting "aesthetics" in exchange for bad gameplay and heals that only do 75% of what the tooltip says.



The fairy is now nothing more than an oGCD but clunkier, even after the slight improvements to it's AI in EW. You could turn every ability into an oGCD for the Scholar and it would improve the gameplay.

As for Embrace, you could just make it Kardia but instead of needing to dps for the heal it would be an infinite regen, on a target of your choosing, that heals for 135 cure potency (or 180 potency since we finally stop paying a fairy tax) every 3 seconds.

Have to disagree there that it would only be an improvement.
Fairy placement offers a unique advantage during light party/ pair/ spread mechanics that you wouldn't have if all heals were centered on the SCH. Things like placing Seraph mid during arrows on p2s, FoF on p3s and CC on p4s is so much better than other tools, same for light party splits on p5s.

[Aurelle_Deresnels]

Hoooowever on the topic itself:


I have a similar problem with my left hand. Playing a DD and keeping the GCD rolling is difficult for me. I played for years with no issue and had to stop almost a year ago. But the hand is not getting any better and I miss the game and my friends, so I started to play again and hope I can get along as a healer.

I actually have written some macros which will hopefully help me out with the Glare spam. Of course I know macros are bad for dpsing, but maybe not in the case of a damaged hand.

I hope some of the suggestions given earlier in this thread work for you! You may want a chat macro to explain your disability; most players will be happy with any genuine effort, even if that means macros in your case.

Have to disagree there that it would only be an improvement.
Fairy placement offers a unique advantage during light party/ pair/ spread mechanics that you wouldn't have if all heals were centered on the SCH. Things like placing Seraph mid during arrows on p2s, FoF on p3s and CC on p4s is so much better than other tools, same for light party splits on p5s.

I agree; fairy placement is unique and fun.

Further, some people enjoy working with a pet that has its own GCD, which now pretty much requires playing SCH. (No matter how much CBU3 may dislike the idea, players will have that concept from other games, and will gravitate to matching jobs in FFXIV.) And let's please not repeat the absolute agony of removing the pet GCD from SMN, which resulted in this disaster: "[SE has] created phantom limb syndrome for a class in a video game. God I hate 6.0 SMN."

[Ruuma]

Have to disagree there that it would only be an improvement.
Fairy placement offers a unique advantage during light party/ pair/ spread mechanics that you wouldn't have if all heals were centered on the SCH. Things like placing Seraph mid during arrows on p2s, FoF on p3s and CC on p4s is so much better than other tools, same for light party splits on p5s.

The only reason you have to place your fairy is because skills are tied to it. If you don't you will either miss some players, or the use will be delayed because of movement (that will also miss some players). Placing a fairy is more like circumventing a flaw than a great feature in itself. I myself ran into situations that the fairy was too far away, placed in the middle, that I wish it were right at my side to use some skills in emergencies.

You're virtually the only job with this uniqueness, other players already gather around close enough that there is no point for you to not do the same. You have to place your fairy to prevent it from move away from others and not miss your mark with your own set of skills. There is also no point of you standing too far from your party just to place your fairy in the middle of the others and heal/buff them from apart, cause you will not receive their buffs/mits/bubbles/heals. You will also have to move in anyway to use the rest of your kit that is not tied to the fairy. If you consider people gathered around a boss, and your fairy right at your side, you will probably reach everyone else around with fairy skills, no need for placement. If not, that is because your fairy moves around you with a (expected) delay and distance, staying a little bit off than you expected.

Again, fairy placement is only needed to avoid skills not reaching their desired targets because of how the pet works in itself. It is not a great thing, it is just a way to avoid problems the system in itself brings to the table. Since EW, I would rather have fairies to be instances, just like SMN lesser summons, with Seraph being the big "Bahamut of SCH" in some way. SE could bring variety to both Eos and Selene "instances", removing the nuisance that is managing pet placement.

[T-Owl]

Ok. You presume to speak for others about what you think they should want from the game and get upset that someone else speaks for you. Alright.



But, again, the person you had responded to told you why she liked Protect: for the small group bonding moment at the start. Interpreting other peoples' comments as a jumping-off point to find common ground has to start with actually listening to other people. You can't just assume everyone likes what you like and go from there. You especially can't do it when they've already directly counter-indicated it.

Speaking for myself, I like long-duration buffs because 1) I like buffs for flavor, 2) in other games I've played they could be shared with strangers to be friendly, and 3) they shift some of the prepwork and reduce the overall cognitive load during combat. I have repeatedly said as much.

And yet somehow in interpreting what "our community" wants for healers, you arrive at "I don't believe old Protect had really anything to do with old healer engagement. It's more the idea of having more forms of mitigation and utility rather than the button that, in a perfect world, you press once and never again.", a summation which completely reverses and obliterates my stated position and substitutes your own desires in place of it.

If I seem to be irritated with you, it's because I'm irritated with you.

If I can say something, buffs are certainly nice flavor abilities, but if we are honest and stop to indulge in Sylphie Fantasies of your team mates being your nakama now that you cast protect on them, when in reality in most cases random players will be indifferent to their healer at best or actively resent them in the case of them not pulling their weight in damage and letting themselves be carried because they are a cute little healer that can only nuture never harm tihihi, the only buffs with flavor in this game are group dps cooldowns. The only proper long duration buff in this game had been protect, which was just a default skill that forced everyone in the party to wait at the start of a dungeon until the healer bothers to cast it. Buffs in game like oldschool mmos like old WoW were nice because each class had their own, so it wasn't something you had by default but something optional that dependet on your party, which could be either useful or not, with Paladin in particular offering unique buffs depending on your role. You also had the element of open world gameplay back in the day, where you would level up or at max level do daylies in the world. Here again, outside of doing hunts or treasure maps, which you usually do coordinated through linkshell or party finder, there isn't usually much to do in the open world. Fates aren't that rewarding when you level up and outside of running from point a to point b, there isn't much to do in the open world.

[Aurelle_Deresnels]

The only reason you have to place your fairy is because skills are tied to it. If you don't you will either miss some players, or the use will be delayed because of movement (that will also miss some players). Placing a fairy is more like circumventing a flaw than a great feature in itself. I myself ran into situations that the fairy was too far away, placed in the middle, that I wish it were right at my side to use some skills in emergencies.

You're virtually the only job with this uniqueness, other players already gather around close enough that there is no point for you to not do the same. You have to place your fairy to prevent it from move away from others and not miss your mark with your own set of skills. There is also no point of you standing too far from your party just to place your fairy in the middle of the others and heal/buff them from apart, cause you will not receive their buffs/mits/bubbles/heals. You will also have to move in anyway to use the rest of your kit that is not tied to the fairy. If you consider people gathered around a boss, and your fairy right at your side, you will probably reach everyone else around with fairy skills, no need for placement. If not, that is because your fairy moves around you with a (expected) delay and distance, staying a little bit off than you expected.

Again, fairy placement is only needed to avoid skills not reaching their desired targets because of how the pet works in itself. It is not a great thing, it is just a way to avoid problems the system in itself brings to the table. Since EW, I would rather have fairies to be instances, just like SMN lesser summons, with Seraph being the big "Bahamut of SCH" in some way. SE could bring variety to both Eos and Selene "instances", removing the nuisance that is managing pet placement.

If you desire a pet-free shield healer, play SGE. Each and every role, healer subtype, and DPS subtype has at least one no-pet option.

Further, there are plenty of situations where the party is forced to split up and the fairy can float where no one else can stand. Large chunks of E3 and P7 knock the middle of the floor out in Normal and Savage, combined with heal checks in Savage. And Savage likes to make healers heal while not in range of the whole party; not only with those platforms, but also mechanics like P4S Curtain Call and P5S poison + Venom Squall forcing healers to the edges of the arena during heavy damage.

You're missing the point: some people like having skills and a GCD tied to an entity that can be elsewhere, like being in two places at once, like having two GCDs to manage... in other words, like having pets. If you personally don't, that's fine, but that's no reason to attack the option for the people who do.

[Rilifane]

The only reason you have to place your fairy is because skills are tied to it. If you don't you will either miss some players, or the use will be delayed because of movement (that will also miss some players). Placing a fairy is more like circumventing a flaw than a great feature in itself. I myself ran into situations that the fairy was too far away, placed in the middle, that I wish it were right at my side to use some skills in emergencies.

You're virtually the only job with this uniqueness, other players already gather around close enough that there is no point for you to not do the same. You have to place your fairy to prevent it from move away from others and not miss your mark with your own set of skills. There is also no point of you standing too far from your party just to place your fairy in the middle of the others and heal/buff them from apart, cause you will not receive their buffs/mits/bubbles/heals. You will also have to move in anyway to use the rest of your kit that is not tied to the fairy. If you consider people gathered around a boss, and your fairy right at your side, you will probably reach everyone else around with fairy skills, no need for placement. If not, that is because your fairy moves around you with a (expected) delay and distance, staying a little bit off than you expected.

Again, fairy placement is only needed to avoid skills not reaching their desired targets because of how the pet works in itself. It is not a great thing, it is just a way to avoid problems the system in itself brings to the table. Since EW, I would rather have fairies to be instances, just like SMN lesser summons, with Seraph being the big "Bahamut of SCH" in some way. SE could bring variety to both Eos and Selene "instances", removing the nuisance that is managing pet placement.

I think you missed something here. You seem to think I'm standing in Narnia, missing heals and buffs and compensating my lack of proper positioning with the fairy. I know quite well how the fairy works.
You clearly do savage yourself so you should be aware that there are indeed mechanics that require the party to be split further than 15y from each other. Every skill that is centered on me will not reach them because I cannot go closer without killing someone. Fairy skills will. I gave several examples of where it's an advantage, either because it's simply impossible to reach someone or because it is possible but very risky. Several mechanics in UwU also come to mind where you can't move into heal range of the party or you'd nuke them.
I also never said I'm not using other skills or deliberately staying out and miss buffs. But being able to both heal across a distance you yourself are unable to bridge with your own positioning and having skills that are centered around yourself instead of only the latter is an advantage.

Placing the fairy is partly necessary to avoid delays from movement when using fairy skills on the run but it is also an advantage whenever a mechanic forces players out of range from each other. Using the latter to your advantage without missing people with fairy skills if you placed it mid and forget it there obviously requires some awareness of where the party is in relation to the fairy but saying it's only a downside is a very narrow view.

[flowerfairy]

Further, some people enjoy working with a pet that has its own GCD, which now pretty much requires playing SCH. (No matter how much CBU3 may dislike the idea, players will have that concept from other games, and will gravitate to matching jobs in FFXIV.) And let's please not repeat the absolute agony of removing the pet GCD from SMN, which resulted in this disaster: "[SE has] created phantom limb syndrome for a class in a video game. God I hate 6.0 SMN."

I joined in Shadowbringers and the main appeal of SCH for me was the fairy. I want to control it more so bad, playing around with your own GCD and the pet's GCD sounds so much fun. Aetherpact feels awful to use when you have to use your other cooldowns, and its feels okayish in the niche situations it's used. I don't know why they couldn't at least leave Embrace to be something you can still control the target of.

AoE Esuna would be a really cool and interesting form of utility if SE ever actually had fights debuff us, but there tend to be less fights that inflict debuffs than there are patches per expansion, so while it's a good concept, it doesn't really work in this world where SE's combat designers don't believe in cleansable debuffs. I'd say maybe giving Eos more healing power and Selene something like Expedient so that you have the choice of healing power or utility could be more balanced.

YES. Expedient 100% should've been a Selene move. I want fairies and the fey gauge to be reworked so Aetherpact is like a mini-Rouse for 10 seconds and Fey Blessing is 120s super good oGCD that costs a lot of gauge, like Eos has AoE Excog from PVP and Selene has Expedient. Give Eos regen, magic defense and Selene shield, GCD heal buff. And also a 60s oGCD that switches Eos/Selene so you don't have to waste damage summoning them.

The only reason you have to place your fairy is because skills are tied to it. If you don't you will either miss some players, or the use will be delayed because of movement (that will also miss some players). Placing a fairy is more like circumventing a flaw than a great feature in itself. I myself ran into situations that the fairy was too far away, placed in the middle, that I wish it were right at my side to use some skills in emergencies.

That's engaging design though. Placing and moving the fairy to optimal positions to hit teammates you can't reach makes you have to think. Turning the fairy into some ghost that follows you around is boring, and it's already half-turned into one anyways. Something I do hate though is that the fairy dies if you forget to call Heel and you walk far away, I wish it just teleported back to you instead.

[ty_taurus]

I joined in Shadowbringers and the main appeal of SCH for me was the fairy. I want to control it more so bad, playing around with your own GCD and the pet's GCD sounds so much fun. Aetherpact feels awful to use when you have to use your other cooldowns, and its feels okayish in the niche situations it's used. I don't know why they couldn't at least leave Embrace to be something you can still control the target of.



YES. Expedient 100% should've been a Selene move. I want fairies and the fey gauge to be reworked so Aetherpact is like a mini-Rouse for 10 seconds and Fey Blessing is 120s super good oGCD that costs a lot of gauge, like Eos has AoE Recitation from PVP and Selene has Expedient. Give Eos regen, magic defense and Selene shield, GCD heal buff. And also a 60s oGCD that switches Eos/Selene so you don't have to waste damage summoning them.



That's engaging design though. Placing and moving the fairy to optimal positions to hit teammates you can't reach makes you have to think. Turning the fairy into some ghost that follows you around is boring, and it's already half-turned into one anyways. Something I do hate though is that the fairy dies if you forget to call Heel and you walk far away, I wish it just teleported back to you instead.

My current thought process on SCH, in short, looks something like this:

Remove Embrace as just auto-healing and make Aetherpact something you have right away as your faerie's main source of healing. This gives you more control over who your faerie heals, and the faerie will follow whomever she's tethered to unless placed. This no longer consumes your fey gauge, and the potency is brought down to Embrace levels for balance reasons. Also, using faerie actions will not break the Aetherpact. Only manually canceling it, or the target running away from a placed faerie will break the tether.

The fey gauge instead becomes your main healing gauge, and Aetherflow is repurposed for offensive tools instead. There's no need to have two gauges that revolve around the same thing, in my mind, so splitting these two resources and enhancing both seems ideal.

Recitation changes to a GCD action that gives you 1 Aetherflow and 20 Fey Gauge on a 60 second cooldown with 2 charges that you get much earlier. In addition to specific faerie actions, you also have Feyshine and Fey Brilliance, mimicking a bit of the SMN changes while also making the transition from ACN to SCH less confusing to new players. Feyshine and Fey Brilliance change based on which faerie you have summoned. Eos enables more heal-focused actions like Indomitability while Selene enables more support actions like Eye for an Eye. These are all GCD actions that generate 1 Aetherflow and cost 20 Fey Gauge. As for separate faerie actions, Eos keeps Whispering Dawn and Fey Blessing while Selene has a new MP restoration action for you and Expedient. (The idea is MP becomes more of an actual resource and less background noise).

Your DPS actions as SCH would be:

Broil - Your standard DPS button.
Biolysis - Your instant cast DoT.
Miasmolysis - Restoring your second DoT that has a cast time.
Art of War - Your AoE, now also gives you a 5% crit buff when used for 45 seconds, making it useful in single target situations. Can still be spammed for dungeon trash.
Shadowflare - returning your DoT field that sits on a 60 second cooldown on the GCD. Also makes your next Adlo or Succor give you 1 Aetherflow.
Ruin II/Kaustra - Finally upgrading your mobility tool to something unique to SCH and not a 10 year old animation hand-me-down from SMN.

You can use Libra now to consume 1 Aetherflow which changes your DPS buttons for your next cast.

Broil becomes Fester, dealing double Broil's damage normally plus an additional 100 potency per DoT you've placed on the enemy.
Biolysis becomes Pain, a third DoT.
Miasmolysis becomes Bane for spreading your DoTs.
Art of War becomes Meltdown, an AoE of double Art of War's strength. Still grants the crit buff.
Ruin II/Kaustra becomes Rasp, dealing double Broil's damage and gives you 30 more Fey Gauge. A DPS loss over Fester but useful in a pinch if you need more healing power.
Shadowflare does not change with Aetherflow.