FFXI vs FFXIV Difficulty

[Tibian]

I am pleased with the current difficulty of many things in XIV.

The monster ranking system in XI is an antiquated system that does not work in XIV. Even Tanaka said before the game launched that fighting several monsters gives a better feeling of heroism and adventure than fighting one mob over and over again. I find that his view on this is one of the incredibly RARE things I agree with. Fighting a single mob in the same spot over and over again, as in XI, is just mindless.

As Clair stated, leveling speed does not equal difficulty. Many XI fanatics cannot get this through their incredibly thick skulls. I have no idea why, but it simply doesn't mesh with their brains. We should be encouraging SE to make challenging content that doesn't involve sitting in the same camp, killing one mob at a time, over, and over, and over, and over, and over, simply because it is what you did in XI.

We also don't need a level cap increase. We don't need it in the next patch, we certainly don't need it before 2.0, and still even after 2.0 it should not happen. SE needs to focus on character progression content. Grinding, simply to grind, is not content. It's just monotony filled time wasting.

If a monster is my level I shouldn't, unless being real skilled, be able to take on 3-6.

If you're at level 12, like your profile states, you really have just started to experience content outside of the "beginner" realm. In fact, you're still in it. I certainly don't try to engage 3 mobs on higher level levequests at the same time. I certainly cannot solo 5 level 50 mobs. If you could, you wouldn't see people trying to party for Natalan, or the new job quests, or literally anything.

If you wan't a difficulty increase, nothing is stopping you from killing monsters HIGHER than your level, so you get that same punishingly difficult and masochistic filled XI experience that you so desperately desire and want to impose on every other player.

Stop white knighting XI just because you cannot let it go.

[Noblewar]

Leveling speed =/= "difficulty". They are separate, so the number of 50s people have is irrelevant.

Partying is a joke however. I took a bit of a break from this game when P2P started and then came back a few weeks ago to finish leveling my THM in a group. I have never been so bored leveling in an MMO in my life. I needed that break to really see how pathetic the situation has become.
Exp rate? Fantastic and even a bit too fast. Well gee whiz you might be asking, if the exp gain is almost too fast what issues could I be having with leveling in a party that's making me bored, you might ask?

Because I only have to use Thunder > Thundara and the monster is nearly dead due to pathetic HP values.
Where is my enmity management? Where's the risk reward game going on? Pull extra hate and have to deal with the consequences of possibly dying? Some tension? It can't be done when monsters lose 80% HP in two nearly instant cast spells.

I had four (FOUR) separate Gladiators during my time leveling talk in the party saying they felt like they were playing the job wrongly, badly or just felt useless coming from other MMOs. And there's nothing they could have done about that.
Use more skills? Get better gear? No, the monster dies in two spells so they can't do anything and are having no fun. The damage dealing classes are having no fun getting in one attack on the monster, and I'm having no fun pressing two buttons with no other engagement necessary. I'm not in any sort of risk or making decisions based on my threat value. MP wasn't an issue because we spent more time running to monsters than actually fighting them.

Never been so bored in an MMO in my life. Soloing which I hate to death was more fun because I might actually need to worry about MP management or crowd control spells.

And before some slack jawed yokel pops in saying "Well if you increase their HP the exp rate will go down!"
Monster A - 1000HP gives 500 exp on kill
Monster B - 3000HP gives 1500 exp on kill
Result: I get to take more than one action on a monster so I don't fall asleep and still have the same exp rate, hurray!

Thanks for explaining it for me.

Its just as someone said, in FFXIV people are leveling everything because its easy not because its a challenge. In FFXI it was a challenge to level everything.

The problem with MMO's is that people want to solo them. If you don't believe that at least 90% of whats in an MMO should be done in a party then you really don't want an MMO. SOLO play should be an option for when you cant find a group to party or something but it should not be the main focus to any MMO game.

There is no party base due to lack of difficulty. The difference between a party and soloing right now is that you have 6-7 other people soloing a monster giving you free exp.

I'm not saying the grind is the only way to determine a games difficulty but the game as a whole is lacking difficulty hard! Not only can you get to 50 in two weeks but you can "finish" everything there is to do at 50 in another two weeks.

Part of what keeps people playing an MMO is the accomplishment on getting what they want. If they get everything they want in a month the game will start filling up with a lot of complains about how there isn't enough end game. Can you believe that? People already complaining about there not being enough end game! You know why? Because they obtained everything so easily already that they don't have to keep on trying to get it.

[Platinumstorm]

The game will not succeed in gaining new players if players are bound to groups to do everything ala the FFXI mechanisms. Furthermore, if every mob needs a group to kill, ala FFXI, then it's going to encourage the reproduction of the much maligned static groups where players pull the mob.... over.. and.. over..... and................ oh my, did I just fall asleep and accidentally hit the unsubscribe button at the same time? Even just thinking about static groups made me get drowsy.

Tedium from waiting to form a group just so you can gain a little bit of experience isn't fun.

Standing around aimlessly waiting for mana regeneration isn't fun, either.

A better way to improve combat in the game is adding intricacy to the classes.

I'm all about difficulty, mind you, but difficulty needs to be in appropriate places to foster a good game environment.

[Sephrick]

Its just as someone said, in FFXIV people are leveling everything because its easy not because its a challenge. In FFXI it was a challenge to level everything.

No it wasn't. It just took longer. That doesn't mean it was any more challenging.

The only challenge in XI was being the one to have claim over content -- whether it be an ideal exp camp, an HNM or a Dynamis zone.

[Raistlin]

the problem here is that leveling to max HAVE to be longer, because is needed that every one focus on their character main class, Is not a way that casual players can level up every class in the game coz you can level up from 1 to 50 in 2 days (first day PL to 40, next day stronghold party to 50.)

I know people loves free things, but is not about what u want, is about what we need to this game be a sucess. Leveling is an important part of an MMO, the time u need to use to leveling a class to max level make you think about what class you like to play most. fast leveling broke totally the RPG terms in mmoRPG.

[Rydin]

I do agree that leveling is really fast these days....
Yoshi said (I don't feel like finding the quote, so take it or not..) a person playing casually, 5-10 hours a week should be able to cap a class in 6-8 weeks or something in that area... If I am mistaken, it is something close to that number
thats like 50 hours or so to cap a class...
I'd like to see it take more but that doesn't mean its wrong... I would just prefer it the other way....

Comparing it to FFXI though... You really can't compare FFXIV's 50 with FFXI's 75....

[Platinumstorm]

the problem here is that leveling to max HAVE to be longer, because is needed that every one focus on their character main class, Is not a way that casual players can level up every class in the game coz you can level up from 1 to 50 in 2 days (first day PL to 40, next day stronghold party to 50.)

I know people loves free things, but is not about what u want, is about what we need to this game be a sucess. Leveling is an important part of an MMO, the time u need to use to leveling a class to max level make you think about what class you like to play most. fast leveling broke totally the RPG terms in mmoRPG.

Leveling is a mechanic in games to make the player feel like they're progressing and in an MMO aligns them with content specific to what their level is. The most important part of the MMO is making sure there is content to enjoy the leveling; not repeatedly boring yourself with the same kind of mob over and over [and I realize you didn't say that].

The game needs dungeons, multiple stories, things like that so the leveling is a great journey and not just looked at arbitrarily. That's what's really going to bring success to FFXIV, not a speed being too fast or too slow to leveling.

[Rydin]

I think perhaps Yoshi isn't making it easy for the sake of being easy....
Maybe he feels the end should justify the means

Consider this:
If every game publication.. every review site... every gamer friend of yours, every blog... If every one said a certain game had endgame that was so epic...so insanely good that it deserved universal praise... The cutscenes looked better than real life... the voice acting was Oscar worthy... the end boss was super tough rewarding and amazing... the fight mechanics were so next gen... the strategy required would make the Pentagon cringe... It was like Navy seals, wrapped in Jedi, sprinkled with Sephiroth's ashes...

but..

It took 6 months of leveling 6-8 hours a day to even get to do this fight....

People might complain about the amount of time needed... but they'd do it.. damn it even the most casual players would be out grinding their hearts out...

And thats the thing... maybe Yoshi knows there isn't much to see right now at end game... so giving players this epic, long arduous tedious journey is not the best call right now

[Platinumstorm]

I think perhaps Yoshi isn't making it easy for the sake of being easy....
Maybe he feels the end should justify the means

Consider this:
If every game publication.. every review site... every gamer friend of yours, every blog... If every one said a certain game had endgame that was so epic...so insanely good that it deserved universal praise... The cutscenes looked better than real life... the voice acting was Oscar worthy... the end boss was super tough rewarding and amazing... the fight mechanics were so next gen... the strategy required would make the Pentagon cringe... It was like Navy seals, wrapped in Jedi, sprinkled with Sephiroth's ashes...

but..

It took 6 months of leveling 6-8 hours a day to even get to do this fight....

People might complain about the amount of time needed... but they'd do it.. damn it even the most casual players would be out grinding their hearts out...

And thats the thing... maybe Yoshi knows there isn't much to see right now at end game... so giving players this epic, long arduous tedious journey is not the best call right now

I wouldn't. I want the entire process to be entertaining, not just the end phase.

[Rydin]

I wouldn't. I want the entire process to be entertaining, not just the end phase.

well yea... thats the most ideal scenario... enjoying it from start to finish
I was just posing a hypothetical question to prove a point....