We Need to Start Expecting Mid-Level Sprouts to Play Better

[Supersnow845]

This isn't your game, and you don't get to set arbitrary goals for anyone, and this thread should have ended on page 1.

This also isn’t your game and you don’t get to drag the party down by not understanding the fundamentals of your job

[DaddyHrothgar]

This isn't your game, and you don't get to set arbitrary goals for anyone, and this thread should have ended on page 1.

Some one wants a free carry in dungeons.

[hagare]

I mean that comes back to the idea of how much should you need to sugarcoat explanations of absolutely fundamental topics

If someone is spamming cure 1 there is only so many nice ways to tell them that they have no idea how to to play the game

Is my post you quoted, I never once said that I would say in game they suck at healing, at most I said they have no idea how to play the game which if you are cure 1 spamming in kistis hyperboa I stand by

Sureeeeeeeeeee.
I guess that's why you posted what you posted.

[technole]

This isn't your game, and you don't get to set arbitrary goals for anyone, and this thread should have ended on page 1.

Your comment should have ended at, this isn't your game.

[UkcsAlias]

If someone is spamming cure 1 there is only so many nice ways to tell them that they have no idea how to to play the game

The problem is at multiple parts here.

- If you can still easily beat the content, it essentialy didnt matter much that you spammed cure 1. You have beaten it quickly which is still the most important measurement. (and before you think. but you could have used cure 2. plenty of times you could have used panic heals to enable more dps. but you saved these instead. while a smaller dps loss, its still a loss. and therefor a similar argument)
- For any other class, abilities were either useless from the start, or they improved. Cure 1 never improved far enough to be worth it. Its an ability that becomes useless later on. This fails a very basic design aspect in which every tool you have should have its use. (even though sleep is generaly useless, it still has its feature to be able to reduce aggro by disabling a target from the fight for a moment. which is mostly just for msq though)
- Freecure promotes cure 1 usage above cure 2 usage. It gives players false information on the proper playstyle.
- Other abilities also upgrade on the WHM, yet cure 1 doesnt, which again is an indication that its usefull on its own.

Cure 1 is an abomination in its current style. And while some suggest removing it, i personaly would still prefer to see a diffirent upgrade to it. Just so there is diffirences in casting the 2 (and therefor have variety in casting there. otherwise cure 2 just becomes the new stone, but then for healing).

(also, i never use cure 1 when cure 2 is available)

[Mikey_R]

This isn't your game, and you don't get to set arbitrary goals for anyone, and this thread should have ended on page 1.

It was the tank's goal to do W2W pulls, this comes with the expectation that they will use mitigation or let their HP get deleted. Tank didn't use mitigation, however, luckily, in this case, the healer was able to keep them up, after blowing everything they had.

Now, imagine a different scenario. The tank W2W pulls, doesn't use mitigation however this time the healer is not good enough to keep the tank alive and the tank dies. Whose fault is it then? If the tank had used mitigation, they might have stayed alive, which would have avoided this whole fiasco to begin with. It is almost like, if you play as a team, the game gets better for everyone. I know I know, it is a hard concept to grasp, but trust me, I get more satisfaction knowing I am making my teams life easier, than being stubborn and only caring about myself.

[Supersnow845]

Sureeeeeeeeeee.
I guess that's why you posted what you posted.

Yep, I posted what I posted, maybe next time read the post you quote before you just pretend like I said something completely different, almost as much as that other poster who apparently read the same post and said I was going on screaming tirades at innocent sprouts

[Merrigan]

This isn't your game, and you don't get to set arbitrary goals for anyone, and this thread should have ended on page 1.

It is not the game of individuals, but of a community. And as it belongs to no one as such (... Except SE, but you get the point), it is necessary to find compromises.

The goal in dungeons should be "do your best to make this particular group work". If a healer kindly asks you to speed up the pace as a tank, do so; in exchange, don't pull in the tank's place if it makes him uncomfortable. You can see that you are not very useful in dps because you are accompanied by level 90 players who dismantle everything? Take the initiative to take the keys to pick up and go open doors, or switch on the elements needed for certain mechanics.

A lot of people are toxic not by insulting; not by giving advice in a dry way; but because it is visible through their gameplay that they are playing as if they are with bots. And yes, this reproach also concerns those who claim to "go at their own pace" without any consideration for others. And this is true whether their pace is particularly slow or particularly fast.

[Supersnow845]

The problem is at multiple parts here.

- If you can still easily beat the content, it essentialy didnt matter much that you spammed cure 1. You have beaten it quickly which is still the most important measurement. (and before you think. but you could have used cure 2. plenty of times you could have used panic heals to enable more dps. but you saved these instead. while a smaller dps loss, its still a loss. and therefor a similar argument)
- For any other class, abilities were either useless from the start, or they improved. Cure 1 never improved far enough to be worth it. Its an ability that becomes useless later on. This fails a very basic design aspect in which every tool you have should have its use. (even though sleep is generaly useless, it still has its feature to be able to reduce aggro by disabling a target from the fight for a moment. which is mostly just for msq though)
- Freecure promotes cure 1 usage above cure 2 usage. It gives players false information on the proper playstyle.
- Other abilities also upgrade on the WHM, yet cure 1 doesnt, which again is an indication that its usefull on its own.

Cure 1 is an abomination in its current style. And while some suggest removing it, i personaly would still prefer to see a diffirent upgrade to it. Just so there is diffirences in casting the 2 (and therefor have variety in casting there. otherwise cure 2 just becomes the new stone, but then for healing).

(also, i never use cure 1 when cure 2 is available)

I don’t deny cure 1 is badly designed but that isn’t really the problem here, the problem is if you can sit in a high level dungeon and see every skill you have access to as a WHM and still think cure 1 spam is the correct way to engage with the content then it’s not cure 1’s bad design that is the problem here

[Boblawblah]

Are we talking about normal content here OP? or Savage, Extreme, Ultimate? Because if that OP was directed towards normal difficulty, I'm just kind of shocked. Has ANYONE failed a normal trial or dungeon in years? At worst, you'll have it last an extra 5 minutes if someone is awful. Just finish it and move on. I'm not quite sure what all the hand wringing going on in this thread is all about, normal difficulty in this game at ANY level doesn't require four competent players to finish it, just four players willing to keep trucking through.

I think you'll be happier if you just let the normal players do their thing and ignore bad players. Although from your signature, it seems pretty clear that you enjoy getting a rise out of people, so i have to wonder who really instigated the scenario you've told us about.