Ardbert's Party vs the Scions Analysis

[Rulakir]

Another good thing about FFIV is that the main character was forced to atone for supporting a misguided cause. I think it would be pretty interesting to see the protagonists in this game go through such an ordeal - though the most obvious route to having that play out was, unfortunately, deliberately 'subverted' during Endwalker.

Self proclaimed heroes who somehow always end up on the winning side don't really resonate much with me.

This is a primary reason I came to no longer like the Scions. No consequences for them has been an issue since SB, but I felt like EW shone a spotlight upon all of their flaws from their homogeneity, to their redundancy, to their immortality. Add in the blatant hypocrisy in terms of their values, the lack of reflection upon it, how they're supposedly the poster children for overcoming suffering and despair when they've led the most privileged lives of most of the characters we've encountered (with only a couple of exceptions), and I don't see what purpose they serve. They're just comfort characters who are always right and never lose, that's not interesting or compelling to me and, worse, it's extremely off-putting now after how ethically questionable EW was.

[Atelier-Bagur]

This is a primary reason I came to no longer like the Scions. No consequences for them has been an issue since SB, but I felt like EW shone a spotlight upon all of their flaws from their homogeneity, to their redundancy, to their immortality. Add in the blatant hypocrisy in terms of their values, the lack of reflection upon it, how they're supposedly the poster children for overcoming suffering and despair when they've led the most privileged lives of most of the characters we've encountered (with only a couple of exceptions), and I don't see what purpose they serve. They're just comfort characters who are always right and never lose, that's not interesting or compelling to me and, worse, it's extremely off-putting now after how ethically questionable EW was.

Pray tell, how the Scions are being blatant hypocrites in their values in EW. Are we even playing the same game here

[aveyond-dreams]

Pray tell, how the Scions are being blatant hypocrites in their values in EW. Are we even playing the same game here

The story of Endwalker imparted the lesson that suffering is the key to resilience and that no matter the strife you have to move on. However, the Scions don't go through that much strife over the course of the MSQ - especially when compared to parties like Ardbert's. They constantly have the consequences of their actions handwaved away with increasing speed and this is compromising the impact of the message.

[CrownySuccubus]

The story of Endwalker imparted the lesson that suffering is the key to resilience and that no matter the strife you have to move on. However, the Scions don't go through that much strife over the course of the MSQ - especially when compared to parties like Ardbert's. They constantly have the consequences of their actions handwaved away with increasing speed and this is compromising the impact of the message.

To repeat some of what I said before:

I can feel the same sympathy for the Scions, who try to help people in need, as a social or medical worker. People IRL can and do develop PTSD and other psychological traumas from being exposed to suffering, underprivileged and dying people. Even if those people themselves come from wealthy or privileged lifestyles and get to go home to warm meals, a loving family, and a comfortable bed, I would find it disrespectful and diminishing to say that the pain they feel from that secondhand exposure means nothing. A nurse that watches her patient slowly die in front of her with no way to stop it, in my opinion, doesn't get to be talked-down-to about suffering, no matter how big her bank account is. That's to say nothing of the fact that the Scions do put their lives at risk on an almost constant basis -- it's easy to forget because this is fiction and all, but near-death experiences aren't exactly something a human being can experience even once in a lifetime and just walk away from unaffected.

While it appears that we both agree on the argument of "X character didn't suffer enough" is that this is fundamentally a stupid way to justify a heroic character's motives. But where we appear to differ here is that whilemy argument is, "it doesn't matter how much you suffered, any amount is enough", your argument appears to be "therefore, the Scions should have suffered a lot more". Clearly, I disagree with the latter standpoint, because I think the argument of "hasn't suffered enough" is stupid in and of itself, and thus it doesn't matter how much more suffering you add to any specific character(s) to facilitate that narrative. The problem with Suffering Olympics is that there's always a way to make something worse. If someone watched their family die, someone else could have watched their family be tortured to death. If someone is starving, someone else can be starving AND have leprosy. If someone has a combination of all the above, someone else can have all of the above, AND have one arm, one leg, one eye and dementia.

There's no end to that rabbit hole once you start going down it.

[Atelier-Bagur]

The story of Endwalker imparted the lesson that suffering is the key to resilience and that no matter the strife you have to move on. However, the Scions don't go through that much strife over the course of the MSQ - especially when compared to parties like Ardbert's. They constantly have the consequences of their actions handwaved away with increasing speed and this is compromising the impact of the message.

They dont go through much strife over the story? Alright lets jot what we got eh?

The twins- lost their grandfather, years of dealing with a stubborn father that practically broke the family, Alphinaud having put into his place majorly with the failure of the Crystal Braves, Alisaie who worked her ass off helping the infected people in Ahm Araeng, dealing with the loss of friends. They basically put themselves a lot on their shoulders for the sake of helping others, and they both constantly had to deal with the dangers, trials and tribulations alongside with us.

Thancred- Lost Minfillia, who was like a daughter to him, had to deal with having his aether severely weakened but still pushed keeping up with the group, having to both take care and deal with Ryne whom gave him such a confliction of emotions, almost died fighting Ranjiit.

Urianger - Lost Moenbryda which still affected him all the way up to EW, kinda like the twins he kept himself burdened with trying to do what he felt was right even if it meant going behind the Scions back.

Yda/Lyse - Loss of Papalymo, her sis, and her lost identity with trying to help and reconnect with the people of Ala Mhigo

Y'shtola - Lost her eyesight (which to be fair wasnt a complete loss since she looks fine with just seeing aether, and its not really a big deal ) but she always kept putting herself in harm's way to protect others, as we've seen how much we memed in her "dying" so much in this story lol.

The hell are you even getting at of them not "facing the consequences of their actions?" Nobody cares if you dislike or hate characters in this game, but at least come up with more grounded reasons rather than these vague bs takes. Or dont really, you can also just be honest and say "I just dont care for them" which you HAVE, but you're also pretending like there's tangible reasons for them being "bad characters". Own up to your opinions.