Kaiten

[RyuuZero]

I'll keep calmly stating that the devs should have made iki and ogi the same button. As of 6.08, I have no issue with button bloat. While I may advocate for a cleaner setup in the hope that they consider alternatives to whatever excuse they may give us, it's all so we don't end up losing actions like we did with Seigan and Kaiten.

(again, I wrote a Macro for those Needs...)
The Reason why Ogi Namikiri isn't the same Button as Ikishoten is so they can (and will) add a Single Target Ogi in the future, it happened before!
lvl70 Guren = AoE
lvl72 Senei = Single Target
lvl80 Shoha = Single Target
lvl82 Mumyo Shoha = AoE
lvl90 Ogi Namikiri = AoE
lvl92 Ogi ??? = Single Target

the Question is what will happen at lvl100 .. there I rather would have the Dragoon Approach of slight changes and buffed Skills, like 5 Mediation Stacks but therefor making those skills stronger, but again, when you start merging single target skills with AoE you lose the control over your actions by providing for less situations, which is a Pillar of Understanding when it comes to Samurai (and I'm talking irl, which is why the Samurai in FFXIV up until 6.08 was so great!)

But the Problem isn't the amount of Options the Samurai has to spend Kenki, the Problem of Samurai right now is that Kenki doesn't interact with the Character anymore, outside of providing Bonus Attacks, which is Lame! I mean I even Ninja has Bunshin at least.. even if it feels kinda horrible with 90s OCD but still..

To be fair, most of the SAM skills that folks have suggested merging are a lot more frequent in use than anything DRG has, aside from geirskogul.

I still think the transforming shinten and kyuten is the bare minimum they could do to cleaning up the bar while also improving meditation stacks to have a fuller kit than just being tacked on.

Shinten and Kyuten are Skills for 2 seperate Situations! How often do I have to say it!? If this would be Dynasty Warriors XIV Online or rather Samurai Warriors XIV Online, Hell I would agree but this is Final Fantasy XIV and here we have Single Target and AoE Sitations to take care of, if you do not want this, play Dragoon, but merging Single Target and AoE Skills like suggested again would turn the Samurai into a Dragoon with a Katana.. maybe a quick Dragoon with a Katana but still. Or should I have to tell you all to stop using Kyuten in Single Target or stop using Shinten in AoE?.. please don't tell me you play Samurai like that ._.

[RyuuZero]

the very VERY least thing they could do to "improve" Samurai in the laziest way possible would be to tune down the Kenki cost of Shinten and Kyuten to 20, at least then we wouldn't have to sit on 20 Kenki anymore.

[Mortex]

yeah but what do you wanna do? argue on the forums for the next 2 years or use the Player-made solution, which is not a 3rd Party Mod btw ^^

Like the buff timer on the party list. ? I mean let’s ban people using third party tools for the most simple of things. I’m gonna bet they gonna implement that in near time, because it should be there since ages.

Think about the irony player helping themselves with band aids, getting a ban and some time later square implements the features they got a ban for. Top class meme

[RyuuZero]

Like the buff timer on the party list. ? I mean let’s ban people using third party tools for the most simple of things. I’m gonna bet they gonna implement that in near time, because it should be there since ages.

Think about the irony player helping themselves with band aids, getting a ban and some time later square implements the features they got a ban for. Top class meme

well I most only if necessary use combat macros to line up cool downs better, but I'd argue that the buff timer is already in the game.. but only if a FC Buff is running out in under an hour or.. I can be wrong though, I'm still miffed that they took us the ability to place Landmarkers incombat (maybe as punishment?).. but giving us the Ability to save Landmarks later :/.. they should've rather ban the cheating group for a week or month and let us be able to do both now^^

[Mortex]

well I most only if necessary use combat macros to line up cool downs better, but I'd argue that the buff timer is already in the game.. but only if a FC Buff is running out in under an hour or.. I can be wrong though, I'm still miffed that they took us the ability to place Landmarkers incombat (maybe as punishment?).. but giving us the Ability to save Landmarks later :/.. they should've rather ban the cheating group for a week or month and let us be able to do both now^^

The buff timer is visible if you separately click on the specific player and sadly not in the party list at all. Baseline visibility for buff or other timer is so mega bad. It’s really fun if you actually wanna use a astro card in a dungeon on a dps that already has a card and you have no at all how long it is already on him. Why do people getting banned for a quality of life change that should be in the game since 2 expansion.

[SaberMaxwell]

A macro is inherently a DPS loss when used the way being suggested; it's genuinely better to fumble with extra keybinds because the actions can queue. I think the point is that there isn't a perception of button bloat on SAM, but since the changes made (removal of kaiten) were made with the explanation of button bloat, people are going to look at things like iki/ogi and the single target / aoe shared cooldowns.

If button bloat is an issue, these are more of an issue than kaiten ever was.

[xAFROx]

(again, I wrote a Macro for those Needs...)
The Reason why Ogi Namikiri isn't the same Button as Ikishoten is so they can (and will) add a Single Target Ogi in the future, it happened before!
lvl70 Guren = AoE
lvl72 Senei = Single Target
lvl80 Shoha = Single Target
lvl82 Mumyo Shoha = AoE
lvl90 Ogi Namikiri = AoE
lvl92 Ogi ??? = Single Target

the Question is what will happen at lvl100 .. there I rather would have the Dragoon Approach of slight changes and buffed Skills, like 5 Mediation Stacks but therefor making those skills stronger, but again, when you start merging single target skills with AoE you lose the control over your actions by providing for less situations, which is a Pillar of Understanding when it comes to Samurai (and I'm talking irl, which is why the Samurai in FFXIV up until 6.08 was so great!)

But the Problem isn't the amount of Options the Samurai has to spend Kenki, the Problem of Samurai right now is that Kenki doesn't interact with the Character anymore, outside of providing Bonus Attacks, which is Lame! I mean I even Ninja has Bunshin at least.. even if it feels kinda horrible with 90s OCD but still..




Shinten and Kyuten are Skills for 2 seperate Situations! How often do I have to say it!? If this would be Dynasty Warriors XIV Online or rather Samurai Warriors XIV Online, Hell I would agree but this is Final Fantasy XIV and here we have Single Target and AoE Sitations to take care of, if you do not want this, play Dragoon, but merging Single Target and AoE Skills like suggested again would turn the Samurai into a Dragoon with a Katana.. maybe a quick Dragoon with a Katana but still. Or should I have to tell you all to stop using Kyuten in Single Target or stop using Shinten in AoE?.. please don't tell me you play Samurai like that ._.

You are really hung up on this whole "situational use" thing. Aside from shinten and kyuten, the others are both long cooldowns and Share a cooldown among each other. In the grand scheme of function, keeping them as they are or merging them does nothing.

And again, I stress to you... I'm advocating for having Shinten and Kyuten evolve based on status procs. You know... like WAR. Shinten turns into Senei, Kyuten turns into Guren.

But as far as the argument is concerned, the game offers little to any situation. Start of trash pulls in dungeon, Guren. Boss fight, senei. Main challenging content, senei all the way. The fact they share a cooldown means it's not actually as situational as it really is.

But again, I don't personally want them merged. But they can be placed elsewhere to help clean up the bar if the devs really think there's a problem with how many actions exist.

You don't need to keep having an aneurysm whenever someone suggests something you don't agree with. I'm halfway certain none of our suggestions are even going to be considered since no one can agree on anything, clearly.

[LeonKeyh]

Am I seriously the only one who sees the Problem when merging those Skills together? It would religate the entire resource to a single situation! and that's not what Samurai do.. it is what Dragoons is all about
Shoha + Mumyo Shoha = Geirskogul
Senei + Guren = Nastrond
Samurai prepare for Battle, Dragoons jump in and wreak havoc.

YES. You've finally realized you're the only one that has a problem with merging redundant skills lol. Nearly _EVERY_ other job has skills like the ones that we're describing (used in both single and multi-target situations). Let's go down the list (Just going to name the first one that comes to mind for brevity, but most of these jobs have multiples):

Paladin: Confiteor
Warrior: Primal Rend
Dark Knight: Shadowbringer
Gunbreaker: Double Down

White Mage: Assize
Scholar: First one without one!
Astrologian: Earthly Star
Sage: Phlegma

Monk: Rising Phoenix
Dragoon: Dragon Fire Dive
Ninja: Phantom Kamaitachi
Samurai: Ogi Namikiri
Reaper: Communio

Bard: Apex/Blast Arrow
Machinist: Chainsaw
Dancer: Technical Finish

Black Mage: Foul
Summoner: Deathflare
Red Mage: Combo finishers


There is NO reason to have AE AND single target versions that are exactly the same. It's just having buttons for the sake of having buttons.

Like the buff timer on the party list. ? I mean let’s ban people using third party tools for the most simple of things. I’m gonna bet they gonna implement that in near time, because it should be there since ages.

Think about the irony player helping themselves with band aids, getting a ban and some time later square implements the features they got a ban for. Top class meme

They were forced into it. These streamers have had these tools for how long and never got banned. The problem was 5chan was angry at the DSR race and decided to mass report the streamers. If you have rules, someone breaks those rules, and someone else reports the person breaking those rules, you HAVE to do something about it, otherwise those rules mean nothing. This is the "downside" of the blanket "no third party tools" rule.

I think they could do a MUCH better job at describing "Third Party Tools" (e.g. "An application that INTERACTS with the game controlling it or giving the player information that they wouldn't normally have."), but I understand why they don't want to "play lawyer" with the community.

[Rilifane]

BLM is another outlier though.
Foul gets replaced by Xeno for single target once you reach 80 and is only ever used over Xeno for cleave damage at 2+ targets. It could be merged with Xeno since Foul also gets traited to being an instant so it's a bit in the same boat as SAM's skill. It doesn't use a single skill in aoe and single target, they're completely split once reaching 80 and it's only Foul before that. Even Freeze as a recovery tool on boss fights when you dropped Eno died as it now requires to be in UI in the first place.
Not that BLM lacks real estate on its hotbars but I wouldn't mind if they merged Foul and Xeno. I think the aoe/ single target split is a bit outdated in general and since SE isn't big on designing add fights, even the "But more class depths!" argument falls flat and all it does is take up hotbar space for more interesting skills - or at least they could add some procs/ synergies that occasionally make you use aoe skills in single target.
But as they are right now, they don't really add anything. You have your single target 123 and your aoe 123 with a couple of "use on cooldown" skills.

[Mortex]

BLM is another outlier though.
Foul gets replaced by Xeno for single target once you reach 80 and is only ever used over Xeno for cleave damage at 2+ targets. It could be merged with Xeno since Foul also gets traited to being an instant so it's a bit in the same boat as SAM's skill. It doesn't use a single skill in aoe and single target, they're completely split once reaching 80 and it's only Foul before that. Even Freeze as a recovery tool on boss fights when you dropped Eno died as it now requires to be in UI in the first place.
Not that BLM lacks real estate on its hotbars but I wouldn't mind if they merged Foul and Xeno. I think the aoe/ single target split is a bit outdated in general and since SE isn't big on designing add fights, even the "But more class depths!" argument falls flat and all it does is take up hotbar space for more interesting skills - or at least they could add some procs/ synergies that occasionally make you use aoe skills in single target.
But as they are right now, they don't really add anything. You have your single target 123 and your aoe 123 with a couple of "use on cooldown" skills.

I do think making the fire IV rotation a aoe would be actually not that bad. It’s a insane looking cast that has umph behind it. The aoe rotation is expect flare pretty whatever and you could still use flare before fire IV