Petition to Remove Classes & Just Have Jobs

[darkstarpoet1]

I think the issue right now is that the classes themselves don't always lend themselves to much for variaty in the "Job" section in the future. Gladiator has tank skills, what good what that be for a dark knight? But what sense would it be for it to branch of something strange like Lancer?

I think the class system will only serve to stifle the introduction of new jobs and their abillities.

We will see how they work with it in the future, but I'm personally looking forward to them nixing the class system eventually when the Job system is fleshed out enough. Wether this will happen or not I am not certain but I feel as it stands now the system obviously needs some tweaks and I'm looking forward to what those tweaks end up being.

well the bottleneck the classes have now is dev created with the class updates we had a few patches back. it could have easily been thm with the nukes/dot's and cnj with the heals/debuffs, but the dev team thought they were being coy with making the classes nothing more than the job. if they wanted each class to have multiple jobs in the future the classes should have had at least had multiple things they could do.

there is nothing else in a party a thm is going to do in a party situation other than nuke so they limited the thm to only being able to branch into that one job. this goes directly to the fault of the dev staff. if they had let each class do multiple things, but more limited in them then the job could have been the better version of that class to specialize in.

the problem is people asked for more limits on the characters so the dev staff double limited them. they limited the classes and made them the one job they turned into and then did the same thing again when they added jobs. they only needed to limit one or the other and not both. they didn't leave any room for the second class in the future. a thm is a black mage in all but name and 5 abilities.

[AceofRains]

I think the issue right now is that the classes themselves don't always lend themselves to much for variaty in the "Job" section in the future. Gladiator has tank skills, what good what that be for a dark knight? But what sense would it be for it to branch of something strange like Lancer?

I think the class system will only serve to stifle the introduction of new jobs and their abillities.

We will see how they work with it in the future, but I'm personally looking forward to them nixing the class system eventually when the Job system is fleshed out enough. Wether this will happen or not I am not certain but I feel as it stands now the system obviously needs some tweaks and I'm looking forward to what those tweaks end up being.

Actually theres complete variety. I was able to come up with 33 Jobs as per 11 classes (7+4 new), that STILL make sense. Although my word document got deleted :O so I have no proof of this.

As for this whole DRK talk...
Lancer has already been geared for this.

Many jobs have already been geared, i dont even know if SE is aware of it either.

Take CNJ for instance. Can heal or Magic DD. If you gave that a pet you've essentially created a summoner. (this is a really muddy example) White Mage merely captializes on CNJ healing potential.

Even better is on CNJ you have Stone and Aero. Geomancer is a class that could easily branch from CNJ, as it deals in Terrain and Weather.

Mind Blown yet?

Samurai is one that actually makes best sense as a lancer as well
TP build is something im sure fans are expecting to see, something that is already a Lancer concept.

Gladiator could only seem to make tanks, it is what it is. So work with what you got.

Templar is one I came up with that uses multiple enfeebles to outlive its target.

Lots of people have been requesting necromancer, I dont see a better time to do this than to gives summonable undead to a thm. Also, THM would be the ONLY class that has access to ALL elements (execpt water yet, but im sure that will be transferable) an elementalist job comes to mind. Black Mage already is meant for being CC with higest magic damage. The point of an elementalist is to damage by elemental exploitation, which does alot of damage.

But those are just a few ideas. Most of you are proabably skeptic, but in all honesty it is what it is.

[RedAffinity]

As of right now I'd like just Jobs. I think it's a lot more simple, focused and clean that way. But Class/Job definitely leaves for a LOT of possibilities and I'm confident they'll balance and develop each system better throughout the patches and as they increase level caps.

[Colino]

I really need to start up that "Petition to remove Petition threads" petition.

[Slug]

I do agree that it would be better to eventually remove classes and just have the jobs, but that can't happen any time soon. The jobs we have now have zero customization. You have 2 classes to pull "sub" abilities from, and only 5 at that. It most cases (BLM for example) there is only 2 or 3 abilities from your pre-determined sub jobs that you could find a purpose for using.

I would love to see changes made down the road that allows you to really change your jobs role via sub job selection. Until something comes around that lets you change the feel of the jobs, the class system has to stay in place to fill that void. A bard is sometimes going to want DD abilities, a BLM will at times require cure and stoneskin, 2 teir armoury system will remain until they decide on how to customize jobs and balance such a system.

[syntaxlies]

I do agree that it would be better to eventually remove classes and just have the jobs, but that can't happen any time soon. The jobs we have now have zero customization. You have 2 classes to pull "sub" abilities from, and only 5 at that. It most cases (BLM for example) there is only 2 or 3 abilities from your pre-determined sub jobs that you could find a purpose for using.

I would love to see changes made down the road that allows you to really change your jobs role via sub job selection. Until something comes around that lets you change the feel of the jobs, the class system has to stay in place to fill that void. A bard is sometimes going to want DD abilities, a BLM will at times require cure and stoneskin, 2 teir armoury system will remain until they decide on how to customize jobs and balance such a system.

you do realize that if they removed classes they could give each job 5 more skills to make up for the 5 they would lose.

id love to get aoe drain back fyi

[darkstarpoet1]

go ahead and admit it. what people want is not jobs. what people want are exactly what classes were, but with just the name of the job on there. it's funny to listen to these same posters that kept defending jobs and how they would define the roles better and now that they are in they just want to remove classes and make the job the exact thing the classes were.

it's time for some to admit to themselves alot of their problem with gladiator had nothing to do with the class itself, but they were just mad that gladiator wasn't called paladin. the problem was not cross classing nor was it the fact of how it played, but nothing more than they didn't like it's name.

[Matsume]

I'm beginning to wonder if you actually play the game or just post on the forums...

Sh's just trying to catch up to Reinhardts Gold Medals

[syntaxlies]

go ahead and admit it. what people want is not jobs. what people want are exactly what classes were, but with just the name of the job on there. it's funny to listen to these same posters that kept defending jobs and how they would define the roles better and now that they are in they just want to remove classes and make the job the exact thing the classes were.

it's time for some to admit to themselves a lot of their problem with gladiator had nothing to do with the class itself, but they were just mad that gladiator wasn't called paladin. the problem was not cross classing nor was it the fact of how it played, but nothing more than they didn't like it's name.

Im sure your right that some people felt that way, but I don't. Classes can be useful but Id prefer they just remove them and focus on jobs alone. Also Id be fine with removing all cross class skills in favor of more skills that we can choose from like before. I understand what we have now is quality over quantity and to maintain that I wouldn't want them to add to many skills, but it was nice to have certain skills you could equip for certain fights.

I don't feel like there is a need for class quest and job quest and since some class lore is messed up now maybe they will scrap it in 2.0. It pulls a lot of resources to make both when you really only need one. I know that jobs are "party play" but if you remove classes and cross class skills and give the jobs a handful of new skills it would be much easier to achieve proper balance.

[darkstarpoet1]

Im sure your right that some people felt that way, but I don't. Classes can be useful but Id prefer they just remove them and focus on jobs alone. Also Id be fine with removing all cross class skills in favor of more skills that we can choose from like before. I understand what we have now is quality over quantity and to maintain that I wouldn't want them to add to many skills, but it was nice to have certain skills you could equip for certain fights.

I don't feel like there is a need for class quest and job quest and since some class lore is messed up now maybe they will scrap it in 2.0. It pulls a lot of resources to make both when you really only need one. I know that jobs are "party play" but if you remove classes and cross class skills and give the jobs a handful of new skills it would be much easier to achieve proper balance.

nah i'm not saying all by any stretch. i've just seen alot of posts in this thread saying remove classes and allow jobs more versatility cross classing skills. that's exactly what classes are. it seems more like they just want thm's to be named black mage and function exactly like thm did before. it makes me wonder if a bunch of people that begged for jobs only did so because they didn't like the names for the classes.

i'm not quite sure i agree with you on quality over quantity though. right now a black mage has a total of 20 skills. 20% of those skills are just a different version of lightning. it seems lazy and not of high quality design. it feels very lazy to make a combo for a black mage that is lightning>lightning>lightning. it feels lazy, not very well thought out, and very little effort put into it.