So apparently Dragon Kick spam Monk rotation is a thing and it's disgusting

[Shurrikhan]

i really dont care, i just want an excuse to use six sided start. it could be the most comboluted rotation that missalign all the skills and buff..... dont care, i just want cool animations. having the same animation for bootshine since level 1 even when is buffed with leaden fist.... thats a travesty.

Wouldn't the simple solution then be to add upgrade skills at some point for some animation variance or for the empowering procs to adjust their affected skills animations... not to prune more thoughtful skills in favor of fluff and purposely fettered rotations?

[Kolsykol]

So, lose an actual thoughtful, albeit situational, skill and replace it with pure fluff?

Also, that would cripple optimal drift, alternate SkS tiers, and virtually all other alterations from which the majority of Monk's skill ceiling arises.

Hard pass.

Not sure what you mean with cripple Optimal Drift?
Altho it'd definitely make an already cramped window even more cramped, I've made my distate of wasted Chakras known before this would only add to that.
I feel like the even windows are already kinda pushing the limit as it is for how fast we can go, I'd rather not have another recurring ogcd there.

I am thinkin of all the weird situations you could end up in beyond that too and yeah.
I am not particularly fond of the idea of having to make even more decisions than I am already making, SSS as a ogcd like that would be very strange and sweaty as hell.

[Shurrikhan]

Not sure what you mean with cripple Optimal Drift?
Altho it'd definitely make an already cramped window even more cramped...

Optimal drift has nothing to do with animation locks. It's a reordering of certain skills away from their normal priority/timing scheme, for benefits down the line.
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Arisme's suggestion was to make SSS an oGCD each time you cycle through all 6 ST rotational weaponskills. That's worth an extra 92 ppgcd if you can stick to just those 6 forms.

Aside from the obvious net balance issues, this induces further internal balance problems that badly worsen flexibility and contradict basic tenets of MNK play (well before ever getting to issues of constraining adjustments as done for Optimal Drift, making otherwise full use of Solar windows, etc.).

6s of Demolish, for instance, is worth only 140 potency. The 3 GCDs worth of oGCD-SSS contribution, bottlenecked by Demolish (if one were to instead delay the proc's readiness by 3 GCDs by using another Snap instead of replacing Demolish early) would cost one 275 potency, thus making Demolish's apparent duration... a trap.

More simply put, you'd have one 6-step rotation (Twin-Demo-Dragon-True-Snap-Boot) and only that rotation, ever, outside of Lunar cycles, which could themselves include notable potency loss by delaying SSS procs for 3-6 GCDs (costing you 275-550 potency).

Tl;dr: It's a really, really bad idea. And even if the generating procedure were sensible, such as by having every weaponskill contribute to SSS procs regardless, it'd still just siphon more thoughtful play and remove a situational skill in favor of hit-immediately-upon-availability oGCD fluff -- an extra-TFC-but-without-RNG-or-any-interactions).

[VentVanitas]

At that point MNK would just be a less amusing DRG. There are far more graceful methods of giving SSS a way to fit into the rotation without having to sacrifice its use as a tool so we can have the best of both worlds.

[Hezhi]

SSS is a cool ability but it would have a lot more use cases if the devs didn't cater to MUH MELEE UPTIME players and didn't design every single fight around being able to DPS the boss like a target dummy even though downtime optimization is a huge part of what makes playing melee interesting. It's not an issue with SSS it's an issue with boss design being too streamlined.

[Kolsykol]

Optimal drift has nothing to do with animation locks. It's a reordering of certain skills away from their normal priority/timing scheme, for benefits down the line.
________________________

Arisme's suggestion was to make SSS an oGCD each time you cycle through all 6 ST rotational weaponskills. That's worth an extra 92 ppgcd if you can stick to just those 6 forms.

Aside from the obvious net balance issues, this induces further internal balance problems that badly worsen flexibility and contradict basic tenets of MNK play (well before ever getting to issues of constraining adjustments as done for Optimal Drift, making otherwise full use of Solar windows, etc.).

6s of Demolish, for instance, is worth only 140 potency. The 3 GCDs worth of oGCD-SSS contribution, bottlenecked by Demolish (if one were to instead delay the proc's readiness by 3 GCDs by using another Snap instead of replacing Demolish early) would cost one 275 potency, thus making Demolish's apparent duration... a trap.

More simply put, you'd have one 6-step rotation (Twin-Demo-Dragon-True-Snap-Boot) and only that rotation, ever, outside of Lunar cycles, which could themselves include notable potency loss by delaying SSS procs for 3-6 GCDs (costing you 275-550 potency).

Tl;dr: It's a really, really bad idea. And even if the generating procedure were sensible, such as by having every weaponskill contribute to SSS procs regardless, it'd still just siphon more thoughtful play and remove a situational skill in favor of hit-immediately-upon-availability oGCD fluff -- an extra-TFC-but-without-RNG-or-any-interactions).

Oh right, I misunderstood what Arisme was saying then.
I thought they meant ALL Weaponskills would build up to it.

It makes sense what you meant then and why it'd screw up Optimal Drift.

At that point MNK would just be a less amusing DRG. There are far more graceful methods of giving SSS a way to fit into the rotation without having to sacrifice its use as a tool so we can have the best of both worlds.

Anatman could make SSS an ogcd if you charged it for long enough.

[VentVanitas]

Personally I'm not big on the idea of tacking more downtime features onto Anatman because that skill's existence was always fundamentally unnecessary (even when Greased Lightning was still a thing) and putting more onto it doesn't really solve the major issue with it being that SE doesn't design many fights for it to be used at length anyway.

That doesn't mean I want to see it deleted though, I just don't think channel skills really belong on MNK.

[Kolsykol]

Personally I'm not big on the idea of tacking more downtime features onto Anatman because that skill's existence was always fundamentally unnecessary (even when Greased Lightning was still a thing) and putting more onto it doesn't really solve the major issue with it being that SE doesn't design many fights for it to be used at length anyway.

That doesn't mean I want to see it deleted though, I just don't think channel skills really belong on MNK.

Not really wrong, at least it'd make Anatman feel a little bit more useful tho and be able to fit SSS in at times too.
There's definitely parts where it would work like in the dive phase in P3S.

If it worked outside of combat too you could charge it up for the opener too maybe.
But yeah I do agree that I am not a fan of channeled skills on MNK either.

[Shurrikhan]

Anatman could make SSS an ogcd if you charged it for long enough.

If Anatman itself were worthwhile and taken back off the GCD, that too would provide synergy with SSS.

[Kolsykol]

If Anatman itself were worthwhile and taken back off the GCD, that too would provide synergy with SSS.

Tbh tho I think Anatman should just be redesigned entirely lol.
I think it's the only skill I'd legit have no reaction to if it was removed.

I think a unique and cool thing would be if Anatman was a button you just pressed and it charged in the background even with moving and using Weaponskills, and then when it finished charging it unlocked an empowered ogcd SSS or a new skill entirely.
MNK already revolves a lot around managing timings, it'd be cool if they expanded on that.

I kinda do like the concept of MNK's channeling their inner power to unleash strong attacks, I just don't like standing there charging it while doing nothing.