Yoshi-P: "If you want more engaging content, go play Ultimate"

[Liam_Harper]

Sadly, I think it goes beyond even that and the devs actively want a role where casual players can essentially get away with very little contribution. Hence the constant mention of healer DPS being optional outside of week 1 prog and Ultimate. They want better players to carry the load. Hell, Yoshida has come right out and admitted that when nobody was queuing for Castrum in Bozja. And later added they want to explore more large scale content like that because it allows better players to "help" less experienced ones.

Their concern seems to be that if they were to give healers even tank rotations, it'd immediately become the expected norm especially at the Savage level. Which it would. The fact they view that as a bad thing speaks volumes.

Unfortunately very true. I wouldn't even mind helping the less experienced players if they actually wanted help. If someone genuinely wanted to improve I'd happily set aside my free time and run over anything they wanted. If I see someone in a group doing their best and asking questions I'll be patient with any number of mistakes. But Yoshida's attitude that I'm meant to set aside my free time to carry people who don't particularly like me much and don't care about contributing is baffling. Especially when there's no reward and content I enjoy is butchered to accommodate carrying those players more easily. For me, it's a lose-lose deal.

As that type of player likes to say, "they don't pay my sub". They can carry themselves.

I don't really want the game to be all about who does the most damage wins the fight and the dev team doesn't want that reality either.

No one is saying to turn Normal mode content into tight dps checks. They're saying to give healers more to do than 1 button. The only place this would cause potential difficulty is Savage or Ultimate, since all other content doesn't require any healer dps. Thus, healers likely have 1 button dps because of Savage and Ultimate and how the devs want bad players to be able to clear it.

I'm sorry, but if a player couldn't handle more than 1 button to deal damage as a healer and didn't want to learn, they have no place in Savage or Ultimate. It's meant to be designed for the players who want a challenge. This developer mentality of butchering an entire role just to try and hand hardcore content over to the entire playerbase is crazy.

[ForteNightshade]

Unfortunately very true. I wouldn't even mind helping the less experienced players if they actually wanted help. If someone genuinely wanted to improve I'd happily set aside my free time and run over anything they wanted. If I see someone in a group doing their best and asking questions I'll be patient with any number of mistakes. But Yoshida's attitude that I'm meant to set aside my free time to carry people who don't particularly like me much and don't care about contributing is baffling. Especially when there's no reward and content I enjoy is butchered to accommodate carrying those players more easily. For me, it's a lose-lose deal.

As that type of player likes to say, "they don't pay my sub". They can carry themselves.

I want to believe Yoshida genuinely feels these players want to try instead of it being a PR statement. Unfortunately, that only showcases his naivety. A lot of people asking for "help" are, in fact, expecting a carry even through their actions alone. A perfect example is a friend of a friend who's been trying to teach her now to play SMN. She keeps arguing with him that "mechanics are more important!" as justification for literally stopping her rotation to perform them. I helped them last night in P1S going on Sage, a job I have never taken into Savage, and was only 800ish rDPS offer her. And I have less gear. This exact attitude is what Yoshida seems to willfully ignore. I'd be a lot more willing to "deal with it" if healing was fun. To be fair, I did enjoy it... but only because it was my first crack on Sage in Savage. I also sat there baffled at how little healing I actually did. Granted, I knew from my static the healing was a complete joke but feeling it out myself made it standout even more.

No one is saying to turn Normal mode content into tight dps checks. They're saying to give healers more to do than 1 button. The only place this would cause potential difficulty is Savage or Ultimate, since all other content doesn't require any healer dps. Thus, healers likely have 1 button dps because of Savage and Ultimate and how the devs want bad players to be able to clear it.

I'm sorry, but if a player couldn't handle more than 1 button to deal damage as a healer and didn't want to learn, they have no place in Savage or Ultimate. It's meant to be designed for the players who want a challenge. This developer mentality of butchering an entire role just to try and hand hardcore content over to the entire playerbase is crazy.

What irks me about Normal mode content and its ilk is this would be the perfect spot to introduce mechanics at reduced level. Alas, they make them utterly pointless. Take E4N, for example. They finally put a tank swap debuff in Normal but then made Titan's autos so laughably weak nobody ever bothers swapping. For a more recent example, Nald'thal's tank buster soak doesn't actually do anywhere near lethal damage if you solo it. I had a Warrior the other night ask if they could try. They lived with just Vengeance and Bloodwhetting. This doesn't teach players anything because if it isn't threatening, why bother? Hell, it's why I don't bother disengaging on normal mode bosses and just eat the invul stacks. Why should I care? They won't kill me.

[Deceptus]

What irks me about Normal mode content and its ilk is this would be the perfect spot to introduce mechanics at reduced level. Alas, they make them utterly pointless. Take E4N, for example. They finally put a tank swap debuff in Normal but then made Titan's autos so laughably weak nobody ever bothers swapping. For a more recent example, Nald'thal's tank buster soak doesn't actually do anywhere near lethal damage if you solo it. I had a Warrior the other night ask if they could try. They lived with just Vengeance and Bloodwhetting. This doesn't teach players anything because if it isn't threatening, why bother? Hell, it's why I don't bother disengaging on normal mode bosses and just eat the invul stacks. Why should I care? They won't kill me.

100% agree. Normal mode is the absolute best place to introduce new things because the repercussions of failure are minimal.

Pagl'than is my go to example. Lunar Bahamut, supposed to be this big scary threat.

His "tankbuster" doesn't even come out until 75% of the fight (if you even ever see it you've done poor dps) and then it barely scratches the tank.

All the aoe that goes out barely does 20% of a DPS health.

Normal mode boss damage is completely irrelevant. The only reason trash does any damage is because we have developed a culture where you pull to the wall to pose any iota of challenge.

[ASkellington]

100% agree. Normal mode is the absolute best place to introduce new things because the repercussions of failure are minimal.

Pagl'than is my go to example. Lunar Bahamut, supposed to be this big scary threat.

His "tankbuster" doesn't even come out until 75% of the fight (if you even ever see it you've done poor dps) and then it barely scratches the tank.

All the aoe that goes out barely does 20% of a DPS health.

Normal mode boss damage is completely irrelevant. The only reason trash does any damage is because we have developed a culture where you pull to the wall to pose any iota of challenge.

Don't even have to go all the way back to Pagl though I'm surprised it actually is that bad.

Smileton? I think is one of the 90 experts? Yeah the second boss is a friggin joke. I have video footage of that boss and specifically that boss for a reason:

Did you know that boss has a tank buster? I didn't! Cause majority of the time my group kills the thing before it goes off!!!! The boss opens with an AoE that you ALSO only see once on my usual runs.

...WHAT?