The Ancients still deserved better, after everything

[WlyemR]

They did have the drive to do better though, that’s literally their whole thing. You’re acting as if they’re nothing but a hive mind when there’s nothing at all that suggests that. We’re literally shown how much of a debate oriented society they are. That’s exactly what Elidibus left Zodiark to do, mediate both sides of the conflict. Presumably he had no chance to as Venat decided to take agency over the lives of millions if not billions without their consent and shatter them. Imo a better gamble would’ve been….idk….trusting in her own people for once, telling them the truth, and working with them to find a better way. The sundered world had what….6 people that were the only reason they made it out? Every other sundered was either giving in to despair or fighting each other lol.Not to mention how much outside help they needed, i’m not exactly sure the drive to do better was entirely….fair. Also, what injustice of life are you talking about exactly?

Everyone is acting as if Venat went straight for the "Sunder" option. We are shown she didn't. She begged, pleaded, for them to see that there was no going back. The world was irrevocably changed. She did all she could to get them to see that the, as the one Ancient put it, "perfect paradise" they once had was unobtainable. Zodiark's intervention did save them in the short term, but in the long term, there would be an endless, repeated cycle of sacrifice and conflict. The adherents of Zodiark made it clear that they would do whatever it took to restore the old world, up to and including the murder of countless new lives. Everyone who puts the Ancients on a pedestal seem to forget that.

[redheadturk]

Everyone is acting as if Venat went straight for the "Sunder" option. We are shown she didn't. She begged, pleaded, for them to see that there was no going back. The world was irrevocably changed. She did all she could to get them to see that the, as the one Ancient put it, "perfect paradise" they once had was unobtainable. Zodiark's intervention did save them in the short term, but in the long term, there would be an endless, repeated cycle of sacrifice and conflict. The adherents of Zodiark made it clear that they would do whatever it took to restore the old world, up to and including the murder of countless new lives. Everyone who puts the Ancients on a pedestal seem to forget that.

They were traumatized. Expecting traumatized people to be reasonable when you're telling them "You have to leave your loved ones in limbo inside a giant primal and rebuild by hand instead of sacrificing non sapient creations because they may become sapient one day, sorry." is frickin' ridiculous. I for one agree with and support the third sacrifice.

[TaleraRistain]

They were traumatized. Expecting traumatized people to be reasonable when you're telling them "You have to leave your loved ones in limbo inside a giant primal and rebuild by hand instead of sacrificing non sapient creations because they may become sapient one day, sorry." is frickin' ridiculous. I for one agree with and support the third sacrifice.

Where has the game or other media stated the third sacrifice was going to be non sapient creations?

I posted a bit from one of the stories earlier. There was a contingent of their society that thought they should leave the world to the newly minted souls instead of trying to get those sacrificed back.

If these were no more than the creations their society made and unmade on a whim, then why would there be any dissent or a belief they should leave the world in the hands of this new life?

Unless it was sapient and it wasn't just plants or animals. That seems to me the sort of thing that could cause a schism in their remaining population.

[anhaato]

Everyone is acting as if Venat went straight for the "Sunder" option. We are shown she didn't. She begged, pleaded, for them to see that there was no going back.

She begged, pleaded, hid the truth, came up with excuses, went on a vacuous political tirade that offered no solution, straight up lied to her followers about the purpose of Hydaelyn, shoved her beliefs down their throats, and ultimately punished everyone for wanting life to be good again. Then, as if murdering the entire world wasn't enough, she let the few that escaped go on to kill half of the shards knowing that was exactly what they would do. She didn't trust her people for a moment, she gave up on them and hubristically decided to become their god. She had her own personal idea of the right way, and decided that every life destroyed in the process was expendable and justified by the ends. Zodiark and the sacrifices could've quite easily been nipped in the bud if she just trusted them to come up with a different way to put an end to the final days because SHE KNEW WHAT WAS CAUSING IT! And we know manipulating dynamis was not an issue like she pretended it was because they created Meteion to begin with.

The world was irrevocably changed. She did all she could to get them to see that the, as the one Ancient put it, "perfect paradise" they once had was unobtainable. Zodiark's intervention did save them in the short term, but in the long term, there would be an endless, repeated cycle of sacrifice and conflict.

12,000 years and counting of effective protection is nowhere near "short term," also here we go again with the blood god shit, that's how I know you weren't paying attention. Three sacrifices, all amounted to less death than the sundering. Also, no, she quite openly believed that their paradise was attainable and that attaining it was a bad thing. The devs themselves said that was her primary motivation.

The adherents of Zodiark made it clear that they would do whatever it took to restore the old world, up to and including the murder of countless new lives. Everyone who puts the Ancients on a pedestal seem to forget that.

Nothing to say to this that wasn't already covered by this post here:

I put together the sources on this a while ago here. The TLDR short of it is there was nothing indicating they were sacrificing babies as such, because the story does not elaborate. Here's a theory on what may have been the case.