Endwalker is the most controversial expansion

[anhaato]

People bring up Twitter and Reddit as bastions of positivity as if any criticism of the story didn’t make you a target for harassment on both sites for several months. I’m sure a large portion of the fanbase feels neither here nor there about the state of the game, but you can’t actively stamp out differing opinions and then claim they don’t exist. Exhibit A, everyone in here trying to insult or discredit the opinions of those who dislike the current state of the game.

[aveyond-dreams]

Twitter in particular is also where some of the most vicious arguments and drama surrounding this game have taken place, all while those same individuals casually retweet fanart of...Alphinaud in a dress? Apparently that was a thing that popped up in FFXIV's suggested tweets as a topic. Why are these people being listened to over those of us who just want a good story and good gameplay?

[OhNooo]

Exhibit A, everyone in here trying to insult or discredit the opinions of those who dislike the current state of the game.

To be fair you have to have very high IQ to understand Endwalker...

[Ranaku]

You are acting like there are 2 options, you love everything about the game or you hate everything about the game. There is a vast majority of space in between those two opinions that I imagine the entire player base resides in. Just because I find aspects of the game unenjoyable doesn't mean that there aren't other things I like. The reason you don't see many posts about people liking things in the game is because it accomplishes nothing to praise it. The thing is fine, nothing to report about it. If there is something you don't like or think can be improved then you provide that feedback to the devs so they can hopefully see it, discuss it, and either deny it or come up with a plan to implement it.

I'm glad that you adore everything about the game and really enjoy playing it. It doesn't mean the game is perfect though, and I think most of us providing feedback or complaining in your eyes just want the game to be the best it can be.

I am tho in no way against feedback. And even i don't like everything about the game, heck i would love a glam log and my feet still look like bricks cause we obviously can't have toes in the game and why are our characters born with sandals on our feets?

My problem is that most of the players providing "feedback" are thinking just cause some mad people come together in a thread means the whole world is outraged about something. Up to the point where players like in this one make statements like "Why is EW so controversial" when it is actually well received by players and critics alike. Heck it got scores on sites like metacritic other games can just dream about.

Feedback is great, screaming about a doomsday and how FFXIV is now like WoW is not great. It is projecting your own feelings about the game on the general community. But neither me nor them can really know how the entire community feels about this so my problem is with people using rhetoric like they speak for the entire community.

While i admit to use some of the same rhetoric by saying that most people are actually fine with the game, this is actually supported by official critics the game got and scores by private players plus the fact that the game isn't seeing a huge decline in its playerbase. Which tells me that if people would be really so unhappy they would leave but they are not leaving. So it is again just people crying about the latest hot takes again.

tl:dr:

XYZ will destroy XIV!!! Players are outraged!!! = Bad

I am unhappy with XYZ and would like to see it changed = Good

[anhaato]

To be fair you have to have very high IQ to understand Endwalker...

I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in Anime Club and have over 3000 hours watched. I’m trained in online warfare and I’m the top troll in the entire Official Forums.

[aveyond-dreams]

plus the fact that the game isn't seeing a huge decline in its playerbase.

Watch what happens when FFXVI releases and those of us who are the single-player RPG fans this game (allegedly) tries to cater to decide our time is better spent in Valisthea with Clive and his revenge story than slurping tea with the Scions.

[Anura]

Where did Endwalker dare to do anything 'different to the norm', exactly? It embraced so many of the dullest tropes in existence such as 'rules for thee, but not for me', 'genocide is okay when a pretty lady does it' and 'character is dead but literally minutes later is brought back to life'. All alongside plenty of flashy and very impressive backdrops that, ultimately, amounted to very little of consequence.

The fall of Dalamud ended up leaving deeper scars upon the land than the so called second coming of the literal apocalypse. The only lasting consequences in Endwalker are, conveniently, inflicted upon antagonists and very minor throwaway characters of little relevance in the grand scheme of things.

I never said it did. My point is clearly about art being objective or not. Everything is perceived differently throughout history. Even Tchaikovsky was shunned by fellow russians. These days, he is one of the most glorified musicians of the period. An opinion shared by russians, from a different time. What changed? His pieces or how people look at it? I liked the story, you didn't. We're cool. Spouting nonsense about how there's an "objective" view of a form of expression is ludicrous, however.

It was never that deep. You accuse me of rambling when in fact it's exactly what you're doing. If we're going to diminish every argument to asking questions about culture since the dawn of times we're never gonna get to the point - it's pure sophistry. Let's focus on what we have now, which is not good. Oh and by the way, it's us who revived those shunned artists and musicians still, it was us who decided they were good in the end, so I don't see why would you bring that up. Unless you're trying to say that EW's story is a hidden gem and people are just too dumb and don't get it. If you are - please do not reply.

Please make an objective comparison between Samba and Heavy Metal to me. Which one is better? Or maybe you could tell me which is better between Les Miserábles and The Three Musketeers. Or maybe you could point to the better author between von Goethe and John Milton. As of now, you haven't made a single argument in favour of objective art. You're pointing fingers and nothing else. Prove to me that art is objective and leave the "it comes with experience" out of it, it proves nothing. Come, be objective.

[Amenara]

I am tho in no way against feedback. And even i don't like everything about the game, heck i would love a glam log and my feet still look like bricks cause we obviously can't have toes in the game and why are our characters born with sandals on our feets?

My problem is that most of the players providing "feedback" are thinking just cause some mad people come together in a thread means the whole world is outraged about something. Up to the point where players like in this one make statements like "Why is EW so controversial" when it is actually well received by players and critics alike. Heck it got scores on sites like metacritic other games can just dream about.

Feedback is great, screaming about a doomsday and how FFXIV is now like WoW and that it is just bad is not great. It is projecting your own feelings about the game on the general community. But neither me nor them can really know how the entire community feels about this so my problem is with people using rhetoric like they speak for the entire community.

While i admit to use some of the same rhetoric by saying that most people are actually fine with the game, this is actually supported by official critics the game got and scores by private players plus the fact that the game isn't seeing a huge decline in its playerbase. Which tells me that if people would be really so unhappy they would leave but they are not leaving. So it is again just people crying about the latest hot takes again.

tl:dr:

XYZ will destroy XIV!!! Players are outraged!!! = Bad

I am unhappy with XYZ and would like to see it changed = Good

I would disagree with the argument the game isn't seeing a huge decline in its player base when I remember how amazingly terrible queues were in December, granted I think that was just the hype of the expansion, not an indication of the game's content.

I agree there is some doom and gloom about the game in the forums, I consider myself a doomer about the game because I am losing faith in the Dev's ability to put out a quality product, however I think most of the wow comparisons are along the lines of "we remember cataclysm in wow and are starting to see the signs in FF14 and want to avoid them" moreso then the expansion is unsalvagable, it's the worst game ever, etc.

As for topics like "Why is EW controversial" it is like youtube videos, you come up with clickbaity titles to get views. I am more likely to click a topic with a clickbait title then I am one with a vanilla title. It is just how the human brain works. If you read through all the comments in a lot of the threads instead of focusing on the individuals that might be exaggerating or be hyperbolic on purpose to give a point you will probably find more meaningful discussion and reasonable takes that you might agree with.

[Ranaku]

Watch what happens when FFXVI releases and those of us who are the single-player RPG fans this game (allegedly) tries to cater to decide our time is better spent in Valisthea with Clive and his revenge story than slurping tea with the Scions.

If that is the case then this is also great, i like it when players show how they feel through actions. If they all leave for FFXVI then this will show the devs that something is wrong with XIV. But maybe people will play both games or maybe FFXVI will just be a flop, we can't know that but i am in no way against any of the possible outcomes. I will play both XIV and XVI when it comes out so either way i am happy with what is to come.

I would disagree with the argument the game isn't seeing a huge decline in its player base when I remember how amazingly terrible queues were in December, granted I think that was just the hype of the expansion, not an indication of the game's content.

That is actually something all games, every single one, has to deal with. The first weeks/months will always be the ones where the game just skyrockets and then plunges down again. Many players also just play to get BIS for the coming raids and don't care about other content so they go after they have everything just in hibernation.

Which is also a topic where i would like to see change in the game, something that gives hardcore players more reason to stay active (not borrowed power and upgrade systems tho). The deepdungeons were a nice concept giving players something to explore. I would also like to see really hard dungeons again, something that makes healers sweat their mp. ^^' But either way, as a filthy casual i am fine with any content that comes out.

[TaleraRistain]

Watch what happens when FFXVI releases and those of us who are the single-player RPG fans this game (allegedly) tries to cater to decide our time is better spent in Valisthea with Clive and his revenge story than slurping tea with the Scions.

I'm one of them. I plan to split my time between both. Some others will go play that and then come back. Some will hold off on it for a bit and then play it later. We're a large genre with a lot of different preferences.