[Petition] Have Naoki Yoshida Play Healer and take off the DPS Gloves for a year.

[WaxSw]

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(I'm gonna get tired of sharing the same images all the time...)
Compare this:



vs



6.0 Whm

Rn the main difference is that Whm would use 3 lilies and 1 missery every minute but aside that they're over 70% of the time the exact same job and over 90% if we only consider GCDs

Healing between the 2 is not AS copy paste but its also because they're a shield healer vs a regen healer, that argument however goes down as soon as we bring Sch to the table which has almost 1 equivalent tool for everything Sge does before lv90 to the point Sage could be considered a soft rework of Sch.

If we focus on Dps actions they're basically the same job, standard ST nuke, standard AoE nuke, dot, a dps spell tied to heals which may or may not be good and a 45s dps gain cd, thats all they have for a game where they spend over 70% of the time using them.

[kaynide]

I mean, sure, if you're only doing notes on GCDs and vs 1 target in boss raids/endgame, sure. But, most of my use is in dungeons/fates where AoE and mobility is much more important and should factor in. WHM's AoE is aweful compared to SGE.

So, while they SHOULD be the same numbers in general, the way that damage happens is quite different. The statement that it is identical to other healers I stand by being incorrect, and not a good way to describe the job to someone looking to play it. It's just simply not "same as whm".

The chart doesn't take into account Sage's mobility, nor the fact that most of Sage's abilities are instant cast, which offers a very different play experience.

And again, using cast time and recast times, you can get a 6-action AoE burst in the same amount of time you could 3 holy casts. And be running like an idiot while doing it.

[Teno]

Sage doesn't have the mobility of a bard or dancer, no way in hell lol, or at least not in the FFXIV I play. It even feels more restrictive since you have to build addersting during downtime otherwise you lose big dps, so it's really not the same at all. In fact, WHM feels more mobile since the recent Misery change and it being dps "neutral".

Plus, the dash is on a super long CD that doesn't even get full uptime because it doesn't work like that. And mobility is a non issue in dungeons and fates since you could lose half your GCDs moving around and it wouldn't matter.

Now, if Toxikon was to be oGCD and you could spam diagnosis on the move that'd be something else.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

When I first realize Holy's AoE is 8y in radius, suddenly all those 'mobilities' becomes unneeded, at least on WHMs. With that large radius I can stand right on the tip of generic dungeon pulls' AoEs to slidecast to safety when needed and still hit every pack with every Holy casts.

If they make those AoEs really threatening to me, then I guess I'll take the extra mobility. But that too, they're not even threatening most of times.

Nothing like their now abundant Rapture/Solace can fix that will lead to eventual Misery cast. Benison, the Asylum & Lilybell that you just dropped, and (to lesser extent) Assize----all these will just heal you up even if you do take those AoE damage. I've rarely made effort to move out of wall pulls AoE thanks to all of these. To facilitate this sometimes I even Regen'ed myself before starting the spam but even this is an excess majority of times.

[Nizzi]

If we're discussing healer gameplay in dungeons, return Miasma and Bane, Yoshida. I want to press more than one button like the other healers do. D:<

[Yeastyloins]

Here's a hot take:

A lot of the player base would get an enhanced DPS rotation for healers and either:

A) Die more frequently and complain
B) End up letting other people die more then complain
C) Not even do the rotation properly and complain because it is hard to do it if you have to heal dumb players
D) Not even DPS, since there is a large number of players that literally just sit there not casting a single DPS ability right now

Yall would get one and then immediately hate it.

[Nizzi]

[ASkellington]

Here's a hot take:

A lot of the player base would get an enhanced DPS rotation for healers and either:

A) Die more frequently and complain
B) End up letting other people die more then complain
C) Not even do the rotation properly and complain because it is hard to do it if you have to heal dumb players
D) Not even DPS, since there is a large number of players that literally just sit there not casting a single DPS ability right now

Yall would get one and then immediately hate it.

If a healer doesn't know how to properly handle dpsing and healing they should be dpsing less and healing more until they do.

AKA: Learn to play their job like everyone else does.

Learning when to DPS and when to heal is part of the healing job and always has been. The problem is that when you get decent to good at it you're pressing the same button over and over. For the people who are decent to good we shouldn't be limited in our dps options because of people who are new or bad. I don't see Continuation on GNB being axed. Healers can have more dps buttons.

[Yeastyloins]

If a healer doesn't know how to properly handle dpsing and healing they should be dpsing less and healing more until they do.

AKA: Learn to play their job like everyone else does.

Learning when to DPS and when to heal is part of the healing job and always has been. The problem is that when you get decent to good at it you're pressing the same button over and over. For the people who are decent to good we shouldn't be limited in our dps options because of people who are new or bad. I don't see Continuation on GNB being axed. Healers can have more dps buttons.

Again, I said a lot of the player base i.e. the playerbase that doesn't step into hard content which I should have clarified. Savage/Ultimate healers won't have an issue with it for sure, but the remainder of the playerbase? The player base that don't understand when AoE rotations will overtake single target damage based on the number of targets? The part of playerbase who don't understand how mitigation works and will pop mitigation at like 20% and then not understand why they still died? The portion of the melee playerbase that fail to hit positionals or use true north? Shield healers that put their shields on the party after damage goes out?

If anything, Damage should be significantly more deadly in normal content and damage should be constant in savage (think the damage ticks that go out during the entirety of the add phase of P3s) so healer should have to use their entire toolkit properly.

[rewd]

Here's a hot take:

A lot of the player base would get an enhanced DPS rotation for healers and either:

A) Die more frequently and complain
B) End up letting other people die more then complain
C) Not even do the rotation properly and complain because it is hard to do it if you have to heal dumb players
D) Not even DPS, since there is a large number of players that literally just sit there not casting a single DPS ability right now

Yall would get one and then immediately hate it.

Oh no, anyway.

We have a lot of tanks that don't use mitigation and plenty of DPS players that seemingly do their rotation with their eyes closed after having shuffled their hotbars around. I'm sure we can survive with healers having a skill floor and a skill ceiling too.