WHM LB still charges too fast.

[SnowVix]

- MNK which is either 12K unguardable damage + stun or 24K + stun, both accompanied by an atrocious animation delay that can easily get you killed.

If you're using Meteodrive without Pressure Pointing first, you're playing PvP monk wrong

[Nanne]

AST seems slightly stronger in higher rated CC matches and I lately see more SGE and AST than WHM. The WHM LB loses a lot of its power once people started to spread out more instead walking in a big pile of 5 for no reason Imp is the strongest part of WHM

[geminipestdeath]

As a Bard with the slowest LB gen for a mediocre 10% damage buff to party that depends on line of sight (and them even being alive) - yeah, nah, White Mage's LB charges ridiculously fast. I've been considering going White Mage because it just seems like a better Bard all around with healing to boot. It'd be nice to be able to deal ranged damage without having to depend on being far away from the target to boot.

[Gserpent]

WHM literally gets its LB every engagement. It charges WAY TOO FAST for how much utility it has. This isn't a change that should be waiting for a next big patch, its something that needs to be hotfixed immediately. Either significantly reduce the charge time or remove the stun from it.

WHM has almost nothing besides sheep and its LB. You do realize that, right? Cure 2 heals for a lot but it has a cast time (meaning it can and will be LOS'd by the person you are trying to heal as they try not to die to people attacking them.) Seraph Strike requires you to put yourself in a vulnerable position, and they nerfed Misery's damage for some stupid reason. Aquaveil would be fantastic in a game that didn't have low tickrate servers... but we do, and as a result it tends to be very cumbersome to use. It should probably be treated like BRD's Paean, and provide an anti-CC buff along with the bubble, and keep the bonus to the bubble potency if it dispels an effect on cast.

WHM LB is fine. Pay attention to enemy party list, and don't stack up when the WHM has LB or is about to get it, or plan to Guard as you see them moving into position to fire the laser.

Honestly, WHM is kind of bad at high skill level right now because of the nerfs it got. It already struggled to compete and relied heavily on the 3 sec stun to try and guarantee a kill on a specific target (high skill players, as a rule of thumb, do not stack up and let you blast half the team with your laser unless you had a DRK, SMN, etc to set it up for you) and its DPS is the weakest of any healer's. AST and SCH have powerful buffs, and SGE is pretty much just a caster DPS with a few healing abilities mixed in.

[Gserpent]

AST seems slightly stronger in higher rated CC matches and I lately see more SGE and AST than WHM. The WHM LB loses a lot of its power once people started to spread out more instead walking in a big pile of 5 for no reason Imp is the strongest part of WHM

AST SCH are dramatically better than WHM at high skill. Both classes substantially shift the numbers in favor of your team with buffs and debuffs and both classes have an extremely strong LB. 120 sec sounds like a lot, but it's really not, especially since it accelerates based on activity. In high skill games, it's very common to get LB long before the fight in mid is really concluded.

WHM's only impactful ability outside of their LB is imping people, and while it's quite good... I wouldn't take it over the kits that AST SCH have. Hell, AST throwing a 3 sec Bind on someone is often a kill - if you cleanse the Bind you'll probably live, but now you can't cleanse the stun about to hit you a few seconds later. If you don't cleanse the Bind, you're going to die (you can also Guard, but no Guard later means you can be burst down.) SCH is a pretty strong counter to any tank reliant on self-healing for sustain (which is all of them, except GNB since they're typically in DPS junction) with Mummification, and is generally just really great at bleeding MP from the enemy team and wearing them down.

Seraph Strike is pretty good, but AST has the best single-target healing in the game with double casting (moderate heal plus weak regen followed by moderate heal plus weak shield, and they can do it back to back if they really need to focus on keeping someone alive) and SCH can constantly spread 4k or 6k shields to their entire party on a lower cooldown than Seraph Strike's Protect buff. And spreading Biolytic among enemy DPS is pretty much the same as 10% vuln down buff.

SGE is really more of a DPS than a healer/support, so they're not really interchangeable here. But their DPS is quite a lot higher than any other healer's. People whined about WHM being able to do 18k+13k+6.6k in their LB combo, but SGE can just casually Phlegma Phlegma Pneuma for 10k+10k+12k plus Haima buff on a 30 sec rotation (15 sec per Phlegma charge and 30 sec for Pneuma) so... yeah...

[Tobias_Azuryon]

WHM has almost nothing besides sheep and its LB.

Citation Needed.

Cure 2 heals for a lot but it has a cast time (meaning it can and will be LOS'd by the person you are trying to heal as they try not to die to people attacking them.)

Aside from Fire Map I've literally never had this problem.

Seraph Strike requires you to put yourself in a vulnerable position

And as a risk/reward system acting as it should, gives you AOE PROTECT and then an instant cast AOE heal. If it didn't put you in a vulnerable position it'd be stupidly busted (more than it already kinda is).

they nerfed Misery's damage for some stupid reason.

They "nerfed" this because it's a free damage button that when combined with the LB meant LB > Misery could just one shot people every 60seconds. That's not good design and there's a million "stupid reasons" to not let that happen again.

Aquaveil would be fantastic in a game that didn't have low tickrate servers...

Having a second tool that not only cures ailments but provides a huge shield IS affected by servers but 95% of classes don't even have this secondary option so this is a moot point. You think Divine Veil is bad, try relying ONLY on purify. Lol. Servers being bad doesn't make having a second button to remedy ailments any less good. It instantly puts you ahead of a ton of classes.

WHM LB is fine.

Oh okay I guess we were concerned for nothing.

Pay attention to enemy party list, and don't stack up when the WHM has LB or is about to get it, or plan to Guard as you see them moving into position to fire the laser.

This is a subterranean take. "Just pay attention to LB charging every 60 seconds forehead." In a mode revolving around pushing/battling a specific point and moving it you're saying "Well just play defense and watch out every 60seconds constantly and you'll be fine." I can see a DRG LB go off and plan accordingly. I can even see chiten debuff and plan accordingly. There is zero warning for the LB until you're already stunned and what are you supposed to do in over time just hang back and watch them push? Or Guard and watch yourself get nuked by the enemy team just to get lb'd after guard goes off anyways? Or to get polymorphed and then lb'd anyways? What part of this is "fine"?

Honestly, WHM is kind of bad at high skill level right now because of the nerfs it got.

That explains why I see so many AST/SGE/SCH combos at higher ranks. Wait. No I don't.

[Gserpent]

That explains why I see so many AST/SGE/SCH combos at higher ranks. Wait. No I don't.

AST and SCH are far more common at high skill than WHM, because they are more flexible and less prone to being countered by the enemy team just not being... well, bad at the game.

Do note that tier has nothing to do with skill.

[Ransu]

I rarely see AST or SCH in crystal....if anything the only time I see them is when there's two healers on a team and the other healer is ALWAYS a WHM, just like 90% of my matches that have tank/healer combos are damn near always war and whm. I'm usually thrown off when I see a DRK or a GNB.

[Cheremia]

I rarely see AST or SCH in crystal....if anything the only time I see them is when there's two healers on a team and the other healer is ALWAYS a WHM, just like 90% of my matches that have tank/healer combos are damn near always war and whm. I'm usually thrown off when I see a DRK or a GNB.

I play ast and i see a lot of sch and sages.
Sch work very well on agressive teams with their dots being extra pressure on everybody in a big radius that cannot be ignored.
Sch puts out insane smounts of damage. Its just over time so it doesn‘t seem like it.

I wish i wouldnt be punished with wars+whm combos in my team. Do they work? Sure, but whm legit does only have a lot of healing over time with lb.
Warriors can be really nice if they play disruptors but most wars play like initiators and just keep on dying a lot because war op so war can yeet into 5 people without team haha.
The few good wars i saw were always disruping group fights etc… was nice

But since that rarely happens, i like good plss so much more. There are like 4 i REALLY like, even some drks and even gnb.

Cant say the same for wars.

Also also i have a small compliation of whm not hitting people with their lb because not stacking means they cant do much.

I know its still a little fast, but the more i see whms struggle to do much OTHER thsn trying to hit as many people as possible with lb and it not working… the more fun i have with macrocosmos

I like going against whms because they CANT cancel anything ast does (even lb, many tried, even frame 1 doesnt work) so what are they gonna do? Laser me?
Oh no i died to laser+misery with under half hp!
I can do that too and so can sage without lb easily, dunno man…

What SHOULD be changed is the morph tickrate to be the same as stuns. And make it cleansable.

Btw case in point:

Censored names because dunno if allowed, was really fun and yeah, was a draw
Put lines in for a little more clarity to see who did what lol

[Gserpent]

I rarely see AST or SCH in crystal....if anything the only time I see them is when there's two healers on a team and the other healer is ALWAYS a WHM, just like 90% of my matches that have tank/healer combos are damn near always war and whm. I'm usually thrown off when I see a DRK or a GNB.

Maybe it's different on Aether? On Crystal, you are almost guaranteed to see SCH or AST in any game with healers, and WHM is honestly tied with SGE for second most common. I get more SCH AST teams (playing SCH primarily) than I do any other combo. Hell, sometimes I get 3-healer teams. If it's AST SCH WHM we might as well pack it in and AFK in spawn because we have no pressure - but if it's SGE? Baby, we got a stew going.

WHM doesn't suck. But it is *substantially* weaker against high skill players. People that know not to stack up, that keep an eye on enemy party list for buffs/LB gauge, that know not to overextend and put themselves in a position where sheep (before or after another CC effect) could result in them dying. I think that you ride WHM to easy wins as you're going through the lower tiers, where low skill players are more common, but as you get into Diamond and Crystal, you should consider flexing to the other healers as all three of them perform better against high skill players than does WHM.