DPS/Healers pulling in dungeons

[Tsukino]

I have opinions about what I like and what I think is more fun to do like everyone else, but over the years I've settled more on being annoyed that people don't use the chat than any other problems. There are four people in a dungeon party, you should all decide what to do together, and the chat system is right there for you to figure that out in a few seconds rather than making each other mad for no reason. Whether you run ahead and pull extra mobs as a damage dealer or sit there as a tank letting those people die, the moment you decide to use your actions to force others to do what you want instead of just asking them, you're the jerk.

I do think it's worth considering that tank is always the preferred role for basically every "adventurer in need" bonus though. I'm glad to benefit from these bonuses, but it's very possible that what people are saying here and other places, or the ways they've been interacting with them in game is not contributing overall to people wanting to do it.

[Ronduwil]

DPS and healers pulling isn't really a big deal.

It's not going to wipe the party, but it's rude and inconsiderate. Maybe this is changing, too, but back in the day it was understood that as the player who was taking all the hits, the tank had the right to set the pace. Maybe with the modern day go go go mentality that has transformed the traditional dungeon crawl into a dungeon sprint this no longer holds true, but I'm sure there are still traditionalists like me who prefer to extend the courtesy of being the pace setter to the tank.

[Raige]

Look at all these people with control issue.

[Dxzstar]

I'm kinda in the middle here. As a tank, I feel I am pretty aggressively grabbing packs. I'm usually pretty smart about popping sprint although I admit I don't always use my gapclosers and I almost always pull W2W except for some specific packs I don't trust random healers to heal me through. Usually I just don't leave DPS the space to pull ahead of me. I'm almost as aggressive as a DPS. If you have sprint on, I have sprint on. If you use your gap closer, I am gonna use my gap closer. And I am usually gonna throw my attacks out as soon as I see your animation go off. The only time this changes is when I am playing BLM which if you're a little slow I may sprint ahead so I can get off a hard cast while you pull them but I almost never take aggro from the tank.

That being said, I'm chill if a DPS or healer gets some aggro. I'll come pick up the trash for you. If you bring it to me you are even more of a king. Now, with THAT said, man, I have a grudge against SAM's. For some reason they are the only ones who have ever gone far enough to agitate me on the matter. My only problem is sometimes I pull light on the first pull to see how my healer handles it. If they don't measure up to snuff I take it *slightly* slower. The formula falls apart because if I play it this way I promise you that sam is gonna run ahead and grab everything like a rabbid dog and my healer is gonna have a breakdown. In most higher level dungeons it's fine because I'm usually playing WAR or PLD and I'll heal myself AND you (or I'll die idk sometimes my brain is off). But seriously it's sometimes a pain in the neck to have to dps and heal just because you couldn't keep the anime music in the back of your head from taking over. It was funny the first couple times but it's gotten weirdly consistent.

[EnigmaticDodo]

It's not going to wipe the party, but it's rude and inconsiderate. Maybe this is changing, too, but back in the day it was understood that as the player who was taking all the hits, the tank had the right to set the pace. Maybe with the modern day go go go mentality that has transformed the traditional dungeon crawl into a dungeon sprint this no longer holds true, but I'm sure there are still traditionalists like me who prefer to extend the courtesy of being the pace setter to the tank.

The tanks role is to take aggro. If a monster is attacking someone, regardless of if they pulled it or not, you do your role. They removed any semblance of having to work for your aggro, dungeons have been undertuned, you have exceptionally strong cooldowns (as do your allies). Not pulling everything is almost akin to trolling at this point of the game, imo, because of all the strength every single job has and the ease of the game.

Sorry my take differs. We can still have a discussion!

[Deveryn]

I have my system. I know when I need to pop sprint. It's not at the start of any particular area because it's going to be down before I get to the last set of mobs. (I've passed people doing this without using sprint when I DPS.)

The problem boils down to a lack of patience. Let the tank grab their aggro and you can go to town on everything. The more you interfere with that, the more difficult it is to get aggro back.

Tanks have their problems too and also need to learn some patience. Running to the wall blocking the next area when mobs are nearly dead isn't helping anything. It's especially annoying as a melee class to suddenly have things out of range.

[EnigmaticDodo]

I have my system. I know when I need to pop sprint. It's not at the start of any particular area because it's going to be down before I get to the last set of mobs. (I've passed people doing this without using sprint when I DPS.)

The problem boils down to a lack of patience. Let the tank grab their aggro and you can go to town on everything. The more you interfere with that, the more difficult it is to get aggro back.

Tanks have their problems too and also need to learn some patience. Running to the wall blocking the next area when mobs are nearly dead isn't helping anything. It's especially annoying as a melee class to suddenly have things out of range.

What difficulty is there in getting aggro back? You hit the enemies once or twice with an aoe and you've got them. People also, in my experience, tend to stand on top of the tank when they pull ahead, even further removing any perceived difficulty.

Maybe this is just a personality thing. Tanking is genuinely the easiest role in the game, even in high end content. I don't personally understand how anyone can say any aspect is difficult. (Core concepts are HOLD AGGRO, MITIGATE, SWAP IF NEEDED. Revolutionary...)

Sorry if this is tinged with a bit of tude. I hope we can still have a discussion.

[Saraide]

What difficulty is there in getting aggro back? You hit the enemies once or twice with an aoe and you've got them. People also, in my experience, tend to stand on top of the tank when they pull ahead, even further removing any perceived difficulty.

Maybe this is just a personality thing. Tanking is genuinely the easiest role in the game, even in high end content. I don't personally understand how anyone can say any aspect is difficult. (Core concepts are HOLD AGGRO, MITIGATE, SWAP IF NEEDED. Revolutionary...)

Sorry if this is tinged with a bit of tude. I hope we can still have a discussion.

It takes effort to not get aggro. If a dps stacks up with you, you have to go out of way to not get aggro on the mobs they pulled.

[Keddera_StormMoon]

These both sound like player error on the part of the tank- poor mitigation usage and poor enemy positioning respectively. It's completely possible to manage both of those pulls if the tank knows what they are doing.

That being said, if you're going to talk about being tolerant of newer, less experienced tanks who want to go slow, what about newer, less experienced tanks who want to try to pull w2w? The only way they're going to learn is with practice. Don't they deserve just as much patience and respect from the rest of the team?

The difference is I don't actively give a huge puller shit when they do it. I grit my teeth and back them up because that's my job. I don't tell them to slow down. This is the only place you're going to see me point out that I think some of these huge pulls are counterproductive when done with randoms.

Unlike a newbie who has mobs pulled for them before their ready.

Context is everything.

Big difference.

[Saraide]

The difference is I don't actively give a huge puller shit when they do it. I grit my teeth and back them up because that's my job. I don't tell them to slow down. This is the only place you're going to see me point out that I think some of these huge pulls are counterproductive when done with randoms.

Unlike a newbie who has mobs pulled for them before their ready.

Context is everything.

Big difference.

There is no difference in how to handle 3 mobs or 30 mobs as tank, you still just aoe and mitigate.