Healers need an overhaul

[currentlemon]

While on the one hand I agree with the general sentiment, you can't expect them to overhaul healer design for what is arguably the smallest portion of the playerbase by a large margin.

While this was partially true in ShB in my opinion, I believe the mid-level players and even some low level players are starting to take notice of the issue. Not in Extreme, Savage, and Ultimate fights, but in Dungeons. Given how two Tank Jobs have incredible self-sustain, which is not a bad thing on PAPER, Healers have been healing a LOT less. While dungeon pulls still pose some amount of threat, they can still be done without healers depending on the players' chosen job. Dungeon bosses are even worse as the damage output is just LOW. So far, I was able to clear two dungeon bosses with no issues after the healer died. I remember on the first time I cleared a boss w/ no healer, the WHM player my party had was very upset that I was able to clear the final boss of Ktisis Hyperboreia without him.

Let's not forgot that high level/veteran players have been running dungeons without healers since 5.0.

[Akiudo]

Let's not forgot that high level/veteran players have been running dungeons without healers since 5.0.

to be fair, you can just as well do no tank runs, or no dps runs or god knows what. dungeons in general just aren't hard, "running without x" is more a thing people do for fun rather than because its optimal.

While this was partially true in ShB in my opinion, I believe the mid-level players and even some low level players are starting to take notice of the issue. Not in Extreme, Savage, and Ultimate fights, but in Dungeons. Given how two Tank Jobs have incredible self-sustain, which is not a bad thing, Healers have been healing a LOT less.

on that however i have to wonder, you say its not a bad thing, but really, why isn't it ? people look at the fact that even in a complete random group warrior/paladin can basically solo the dungeon if they take enough time and complain that there isn't enough to do for a healer and put this on the healer design instead of saying "holy **** nerf this absurd tank self sustain". there may be a lot wrong with heals aswell as fight design, not gonna go there, but how about putting tanks having so damn much self healing that a totally average player not overgearing the dungeon can sustain themselves infinitely as faulty tank design instead of a healer problem.

[currentlemon]

snip

I apologize, I should have elaborated more. I don't believe tank self-sustain can be a bad thing. On Paper, it can be good and alleviates a lot of stress for healers. Again, On Paper!

Because the damage output in the game is too low (i.e. dungeons), the tank-self sustain can be seen as too high, forcing healers to dps more, or in other words, spamming 1111111 again and again.

[Akiudo]

snip

the reason why i believe tank self sustain being to high (and that being a tank rather than a healer problem) is that

a)if they upped the damage to a level where paladin/warrior actually needed a healer than healing gunbreaker (and even more so dark knight) would be an absolute pain and the second you got a tank that can't hold enmity for whatever reason the mobs would just mow through the rest of the group like they where made of paper mache, this would than not result in "healers having to heal more" but in "the group wiping a lot faster if the tank is bad"

b)it does not even translate all that well into savage, i.e. no tank really needs extra healing in savage most of the time, which indeed does point to damage being to low, it however also means that what makes certain tanks totally broken in dungeons does not even serve any bigger purpose when looking at harder content.