Patch Notes 6.1

[Manofpassion]

6.1 Changes:
Math checked using a hacked together rotation sheet, which just for full disclosure ends on a Midare entering a 9minute burst window with 65 Kenki and 1 Meditation banked. Dumping the potency of that 65 all at once at the end(a flat 702 potency) makes the number 8923.839.

The autocrit rotation is identical except it turns all that extra Kenki previously wasted spent on Kaiten into more scattered Shintens. This means that instead of ending with 65 Kenki banked, it has a full 100 Kenki banked. Dumping this full 100 Kenki potency at the end(a flat 1000 potency) makes the new number 8920.721.

If we ignore that Kenki potency dump at the end it's 8891.179 vs 8871.439 just for reference. We're basically at parity with before.

According to the balance. So Sam gets small nerf to dps, and doesn't synergise with dancer, sch, or dragoon anymore. Overall, these changes just make Sams perform worse in certain teams. Ironic since this is a team game.

[Quor]

6.1 Changes:
Math checked using a hacked together rotation sheet, which just for full disclosure ends on a Midare entering a 9minute burst window with 65 Kenki and 1 Meditation banked. Dumping the potency of that 65 all at once at the end(a flat 702 potency) makes the number 8923.839.

The autocrit rotation is identical except it turns all that extra Kenki previously wasted spent on Kaiten into more scattered Shintens. This means that instead of ending with 65 Kenki banked, it has a full 100 Kenki banked. Dumping this full 100 Kenki potency at the end(a flat 1000 potency) makes the new number 8920.721.

If we ignore that Kenki potency dump at the end it's 8891.179 vs 8871.439 just for reference. We're basically at parity with before.

According to the balance. So Sam gets small nerf to dps, and doesn't synergise with dancer, sch, or dragoon anymore. Overall, these changes just make Sams perform worse in certain teams. Ironic since this is a team game.

Did the Balance factor in the multiplicative nature of buffs? Because the numbers I've seen put the new Midare/Ogi auto-crit damage at barely on par with raid-buffed non-crit Kaiten+Midare/Ogi damage, and far less than Kaiten+Midare/Ogi crit damage.

Maths here:

Not only did they go through with removing Hissatsu: Kaiten, they also nerfed the damage of Midare Setsugekka and Ogi Namikiri. Holy shit.

Including the extra 200 potency from the 20 kenki we don't spend on Kaiten (assuming it's spend on Shinten instead), this is a SLIGHT potency increase on non-Kaeshi Midare Setsugekka, from an average 1138.5 potency to 1160 in BiS raid gear with 25% crit chance and 60% crit magnitude. But including Kaeshi, which did not require 20 kenki for a Kaiten cast, it's a nerf from an average 2277 potency to 2120. That's a 7.5% nerf to one of our biggest burst window GCD combos.

Ogi Namikiri, which is always used with its Kaeshi counterpart, is a nerf from an average 3105 to 2760. That's 12.5%!

This gap only widens under any sort of crit raid buff, as these skills no longer benefit from them. The extra 20% crit chance from Devilment, for example, would buff the average Ogi/Kaeshi combo to 3429 potency, 24% more than the one in 6.1.

A guaranteed crit Midare Setsugekka in 6.1 is going to do less damage than a basic, non-crit Kaiten-buffed Midare from 6.0. It's almost like they don't understand why SAM is fun.

[Manofpassion]

Did the Balance factor in the multiplicative nature of buffs? Because the numbers I've seen put the new Midare/Ogi auto-crit damage at barely on par with raid-buffed non-crit Kaiten+Midare/Ogi damage, and far less than Kaiten+Midare/Ogi crit damage.

Maths here:

For the one posted in the previous message, no raid buffs are factored in. However, the balance did another comparison, factoring in certain buffs.

What this does affect highly are crit-based comps - Using the same examples as before with the following buffs enabled:
Devilment (7.2s first usage)
Technical Finish (6.5s first usage)
Standard Finish (affects all GCDs)
Dragon Sight (5.2s first usage)
Battle Litany (7s first usage)
Chain Strategem (7.7s first usage)

The comparison changes to 10533.939 vs 10212.023, a 3% nerf compared to a 3 DPS nerf (these numbers include the Kenki potency dump)

So old Sam performs significantly better with crit buffs, but I think we all knew that already.

[Quor]

For the one posted in the previous message, no raid buffs are factored in. However, the balance did another comparison, factoring in certain buffs.

What this does affect highly are crit-based comps - Using the same examples as before with the following buffs enabled:
Devilment (7.2s first usage)
Technical Finish (6.5s first usage)
Standard Finish (affects all GCDs)
Dragon Sight (5.2s first usage)
Battle Litany (7s first usage)
Chain Strategem (7.7s first usage)

The comparison changes to 10533.939 vs 10212.023, a 3% nerf compared to a 3 DPS nerf (these numbers include the Kenki potency dump)

So old Sam performs significantly better with crit buffs, but I think we all knew that already.

Figured as much. Thanks. Disappointing to see but somehow not all that surprising.

[DaemonInazuma]

I'm going to laugh if the guy that "reworked" SAM is like a new hire and this was his first task.

Yoshi-P-"Ok son, we need to make SAM a bit more accessible. Let's see what you got."

New Guy-"Yes sir! I won't let you down."

Fails completely. Insert Yoshi-P angry face.

All jokes aside, They are going to walk this back like they walked back Hagakure's removal. They did a poll recently of the Japanese community for FF14 and like 5% polled play SAM. I imagine it is the same or more in NA and EU. The forums are blowing up as well as reddit and even streamers. Too much bad press for a game that has been overwhelmingly praised for its openness and communication with the dev team.

As a previous post mentioned, Yoshi was reading the chat and seemed visibly distressed and made mention to try it and they will be reading the forums. Luckily, they have a few patches to undo this, but I hate it for the guys doing ultimate in 6.11.

[Manofpassion]

I wouldn't get too optimistic, this is square Enix we're talking about. I think Sam's auto crits will be removed, but kaiten is gone forever.

For ninja, I don't know what they can do to appease the nin players. They obviously have it out for anything that isn't a 2 minute raid buff, but there's not much they can really do to make nin players happy other than reverting trick. They'll probably do something like improve gust slash potency by 10 and call it a day

[Quor]

I'm going to laugh if the guy that "reworked" SAM is like a new hire and this was his first task.

Yoshi-P-"Ok son, we need to make SAM a bit more accessible. Let's see what you got."

New Guy-"Yes sir! I won't let you down."

Fails completely. Insert Yoshi-P angry face.

All jokes aside, They are going to walk this back. They did a poll recently of the Japanese community for FF14 and like 5% polled play SAM. I imagine it is the same or more in NA and EU. The forums are blowing up as well as reddit and even streamers. Too much bad press for a game that has been overwhelmingly praised for its openness and communication with the dev team.

As a previous post mentioned, Yoshi was reading the chat and seemed visibly distressed and made mention to try it and they will be reading the forums. Luckily, they have a few patches to undo this, but I hate it for the guys doing ultimate in 6.11.

You joke, but I swear to god I got the same feeling, that the guy in charge of the SAM change was some rookie to job balancing who just looked at a bunch of spreadsheets, did a little napkin math to "balance the numbers" and then submitted his changes before skipping off to have a beer with the mates, wholly satisfied that he had solved the problem. It just absolutely reeks of inexperience and cluelessness.

[DaemonInazuma]

You joke, but I swear to god I got the same feeling, that the guy in charge of the SAM change was some rookie to job balancing who just looked at a bunch of spreadsheets, did a little napkin math to "balance the numbers" and then submitted his changes before skipping off to have a beer with the mates, wholly satisfied that he had solved the problem. It just absolutely reeks of inexperience and cluelessness.

I mean I've been with FF14 since ARR launched so I've seen my fair share of job balancing. These SAM changes are pretty rough, but tanks in SB might have been the worst to me. I completely quit tanking due to that stance dancing BS and people telling you which one to be in when they ain't never tanked in the game. Once they changed tanks in SHB, I finally started tanking again because it was less aggravating.

I always to try to strive for compromise when it comes to job balancing. I want the jobs to be interesting and maybe a little complex, but I would lean more to accessibility than complexity. I play on controller and I refuse to play AST because it is too hard lol. I understand where the devs are coming from with the Kaiten change because they see it as another Dark Arts which the community flamed for it being constantly pressed before other GCDs.

However, where Dark Arts was annoying, Kaiten is like pumping a shotgun as some others have put it. To me, Third Eye,Hagakure,Kaiten, and the Iaijutsu attacks are SAM"s identity and taking any one away makes the job feel lackluster.