If you continue to dumb down the game, you will lose half your player base

[Kaurhz]

know what heres some math for u and u cant agrue with math

there are 13 action bars for controller
each action bar has 16 buttons

we can easily have 208 buttons so long as we have decent basic knowledge and common sense along with organization skill just fine. If you cant handle that its a personal issue not a button bloat issue

.
This is almost as hyperbolic as the people touting button bloat in the first place. Learn the difference between theoretically possible and pragmatic. It's always 1 extreme or another. There is a good reason the WXHB was implemented and this is to provide easy and realistic access to buttons, of which there are really 48.

[aveyond-dreams]

Who is actually using the F1-F12 buttons for anything? Shift+Key is fine but Ctrl+Key just feels awkward. Tab+ key is similar. There comes a point when adding excesses of buttons creates meaningless, convoluted strings of abilities like the addition off further Shoha skills on Samurai or cooldowns for the sake of cooldowns.

My fun comes from the fight difficulty, not battling against my keyboard or in the past, my controller which I ultimately abandoned because I was sick of button bloat.

[Nekokaori]

.
This is almost as hyperbolic as the people touting button bloat in the first place. Learn the difference between theoretically possible and pragmatic. It's always 1 extreme or another. There is a good reason the WXHB was implemented and this is to provide easy and realistic access to buttons, of which there are really 48.

i legitly emote during a battle with all my unusued buttons and i dont even have enough emotes with my buttons on the job so not rlly

[Atelier-Bagur]

It is not and never will be our responsibility as paying costumers, the consumers, to deliver a 'well-thought-out and coherent solution' for the product we're consuming.
You are dumping the responsibility for the success of a product on the costumer.

If someone comes to me and wants a tailor-made dress to achieve a specific look it is my job and my responsibility to get all the data I need, to get the right fabric, to design a pattern that works and so on. And if the costumer is unhappy with the result, it is my responsibility to work with whatever feedback they are willing and able to provide as a person without any in-depth knowledge and make it work.
It is not their job to give me a design and pattern according to their vision. They pay me for doing it.

Feedback is feedback and not a spoonfed solution.
If someone says "I want more battle content with some longevity, preferably with different difficulty levels or scaling difficulty" it is the developers' job to find ways to make it work.
Not the costumers job to deliver a fleshed-out system that only needs to be coded. If there happens to be a costumer that is extremely good with such thing and maybe even has some firsthand experience with game developing and can provide a coherent solution that could be used with minor tweaks at best as it is, that's is a bonus an deserves respect but it is not our job.
A gaming company with many, many years of experience in RPGs should be able to work with feedback like "I liked this system that other game had, maybe withou issue X and Y but I liked the core system".

see I get this analogy. But the problem with using this in relation to something like FFXIV is that the game has more than one customer with various different needs and wants for what they want to consume out of the game.

[Kaurhz]

i legitly emote during a battle with all my unusued buttons and i dont even have enough emotes with my buttons on the job so not rlly

Yes, and I'm sure you could pull off this self-same behaviour in higher-end content without shafting yourself. Organizing your emotes is entirely different to organizing skills which are distinct across all of the 19 jobs at the end-game. Here is a little maths for you, that is 3952 distinct actions, if we were to take your "208 buttons is fine, it's easy, you just need common sense and some organization skills".

Once again, learn the difference between what is possible in a theoretical world versus what is pragmatic.

[Nekokaori]

Yes, and I'm sure you could pull off this self-same behaviour in higher-end content without shafting yourself. Organizing your emotes is entirely different to organizing skills which are distinct across all of the 19 jobs at the end-game. Here is a little maths for you, that is 3952 distinct actions.

Once again, learn the difference between what is possible in a theoretical world versus what is pragmatic.

u use 4 buttons no matter at at time atleast on controller all u have to have is muscle memory and organization skills then u just hold r1 and move to that action bar lol its so simple and thoughtless u could easily have over 200 buttons so long as a good amount of them had around the same cd as most of are bad ass skills have lol and switching action bars is instant, you can legitly use a mele ability (with no cast time switch to a bar and dance before ur attack of next stage is rdy lol

[Hanayumi]

Id be ok if they simplified all jobs but only if they derply invested in some kind of skill augmentions later on that changes up how they work or something, toss some kind of variety in there SE, good lord. lol...

[Atelier-Bagur]

first off their is 0 button bloat with any job what so ever I play on controller 1 bar only 1 bar gets filled with any job if you know how to sort out and think how am i going to set up my lay out u have 0 buttton bloat in fact

we dont have enough buttons on any job

very easy and not annoying to switch between bars at all

anyone claiming button bloat is a lier and or 2 stupid to know how to set up bars

Oh honey, two can play this game. Lets see how an ACTUAL Dark Knight Controller hotbar is like. Thats right Im flexing here.




These are my 2 hotbars used for Dark Knight. Barely any skills gets copied into the other and in this case I still lack buttons for adding in all my role action skills like shirk and arms length. I have to actually remember to slot those in whenever I do fights that require tank switching or KB immunity but the case made here is that I barely have enough space to fit in the entirety of DK's skills set into 2 hotbars. Am I gonna complain about it?...No...not really, I'm currently mostly satisfied with the amount of buttons used for DK. However I wont mind removing or altering some to reduce button bloat. I refuse to have a 3rd hotbar just to comfortably slot all of my toolkit.

Bottom line is, you sir are THE LIAR, Some classes do indeed suffer from button bloat. Especially on controller. Thank you and good night.

[Zsolen]

How are you flexing, if all you are doing is saying that your abilities don't fit on two hotbars?

[Atelier-Bagur]

How are you flexing, if all you are doing is saying that your abilities don't fit on two hotbars?

Yeah...flexing at the person who's clearly lying about the lack of button bloat for controller when they dont even have their entire toolkit setup in their screenshots.