2hr Abilites (Yes Please!)? or (No Thanks!)?

[Akumu]

It's more of a what was decent instead of what was cheap.

About 70% of the Maat fights revolved around 2hr abilities. About 50% of the CoP relied on 2hr one point or another. Most Zigart fights were also first relied on 2hrs. Most BC's were walked in expecting to have a 2hr in your sleeves.

Once again I guess it was just different servers with different tactics. Most fights didn't rely heavily on a 2hr except from a very small list of jobs. Others may have been used just for a bit extra but still wasn't part of the main battle plan. I'll just agree to disagree with you.

edit: My stand is still if we had a "2hr" it needs to be worth the wait. Most In XI were rarely needed or factored into a main battle plan.

[Sojiro]

Again, Characterizing 2 hours ability would sure *contribute* to class uniqueness, so whining about the lack of uniqueness and then antagonizing something that contributes to that is quite droll.

The high cooldown actually contributes to class uniqueness as well. Why? For balancing reasons, the higher the cooldown, the more powerful and cool the abilities can be. The more powerful, the more characterizing potential they have.

Why stop there then? Since we're stating the amount of time before you can use the ability again adds more "uniqueness to the class" lets make them ever more powerful and be used every 6 hours....12 hours....a day. Guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

[Abriael]

Why stop there then? Since we're stating the amount of time before you can use the ability again adds more "uniqueness to the class" lets make them ever more powerful and be used every 6 hours....12 hours....a day. Guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

I never said I would be against an higher cooldown. Obviously SE thought 2 hours was a nice balance with the power of those abilities, and I agree.

It's a simple concept. The more powerful the more characterizing, the more powerful, the more it needs to be situational. An high cooldown is the perfect way to make a skill situational.

[Nephera]

I never said I would be against an higher cooldown. Obviously SE thought 2 hours was a nice balance with the power of those abilities, and I agree.

It's a simple concept. The more powerful the more characterizing, the more powerful, the more it needs to be situational. An high cooldown is the perfect way to make a skill situational.

A big problem is that they then have to design with 2 hour abilities in mind and you can either let them dominate the fight or gate people from doing content based if they're on cooldown or not.

[Shosasosa]

No. 2hr abilities(most) were for the most part useless. All were extremely underpowered for an ability that is on a 2hr cooldown. To actually have an ability thats on a 2hr cooldown and be worth it most would then say "Its too overpowered!"


edit: They also lasted about 20 seconds? 30 at most for some jobs. It was a horrible way to implement an ability overall. In the end they just were used for brief fun every 2hrs.

Hmm i think Astral Flow lasted 3 minutes and most others lasted 1 minute go back and play 11

[Verecund]

A big problem is that they then have to design with 2 hour abilities in mind and you can either let them dominate the fight or gate people from doing content based if they're on cooldown or not.

Finally, someone said it ^ ^

[kukurumei]

A big problem is that they then have to design with 2 hour abilities in mind and you can either let them dominate the fight or gate people from doing content based if they're on cooldown or not.

But at the same time it's a perfect way to mix the casual, semi casual, and hardcore.

A 2h cooldown made it for the impossible, possible. Like a get out of RAGE medicine.

A player who logs in and gets into a bad situation, or go fighting a nasty BCNM will not feel threaten to be playing. Where a hardcore who plays the whole day can't use it every content he/she is burning through.

It's not totally perfect, but the 2hr did work pretty well, in bridging people who goes "see you tomorrow" and those that go the distance.

Later in the game, you could always pay for a COR 2hr to reset your 2hr, if you desperately needed it...

But in any event, Developers who write quests, missions, and boss battles can magically not have to tweak their monsters to counter those 2hr abilities.

People who had it going in were either well prepared or in luck. People who didn't have it had to take on the extra challenge, or try later (thus prolonging the need for new content).

It was a very sly developer's trick.

A heck of a lot more elegant then surplus wouldn't you say?

edit: My stand is still if we had a "2hr" it needs to be worth the wait. Most In XI were rarely needed or factored into a main battle plan.

The main battle plan is...to win. Rarely factored in the main battle plan is pure BS. whatever helped you win, was always factored in. Always.

That's like saying, I'm drunk up the rear, but i'll be ok, let's go in. It doesn't matter if your strategy does or doesn't need someone to be at 100%, winning and losing is the whole point.

I have never seen a party walk into a challenging BC where they're not fingering their 2hr ability. I rather have an invincible if someone DCs, the healer is lagging, the DD went "oops I missed that SATA" or even if nothing is wrong, I rather have that buffer of assurance: I'm going to win.

2hrs are always wanted. That's the point, it's your ace up the sleeve. Winning or loosing, I rather be winning.

It's like the old Fenrir prime strategies. No matter what people came with, the risk involved with his Howling moon was always risky. Everyone always fingered their 2hrs.
Most general strategies for his fight turned into

1: Preparation, if howling moon was too nasty, invincible+ benediction
2: point of no return: If howling moon killed the tank or key members, bumrush. Manafonts, chainspell stuns, the works
3: Prevention: soul voice dark carol, chain spell stuns, etc.

there were always sound strategies like pin point stun, running cancel, kite cancel, etc. But It was always good to have those 2hrs ready.

[Nephera]

People who had it going in were either well prepared or in luck. People who didn't have it had to take on the extra challenge, or try later (thus prolonging the need for new content).

It mostly ended up being try later, XI players were notorious for excluding people from groups for not being 100%.

It was a very sly developer's trick.

Yes it is, XI used a lot of those little tricks to make the game take a very very long time to play. We're not really at the point where we want to be slowing people down to experience all the wonders of punching yet more goats though.

and the other problem with developers tricks is eventually people will realize you're doing them and they don't take very kindly to your continued use of them.

Which is why I imagined they lessened the experience curve and took out deleveling/experience loss.


edit: or the tricks just make people hate the game (See: castlevania 2)

A heck of a lot more elegant then surplus wouldn't you say?

Yes, surplus could have been easily achieved by doing the OTHER trick of "rested" xp without upsetting nearly as many people.

[PeppinoTuna]

Being invincible for 30 seconds wasn't useful? Doing 5 minutes worth of attacks in 30 seconds wasn't useful? Completely healing your entire party wasn't useful?

Ya, man! I'd really like to see something cool for Puglists. I'm all for a 2hour ability with things like in the above post, but I'd be more interested if it was a 30 minute cooldown and not 2 hours. 1 hour at the most, 30 minutes preferred.

[Kaedan]

Abilities akin to what 2 hour abilities did? Yes, please!

Having them on a 2 hour cooldown? NO THANKS!

As others have said, 30 minutes would be fine... hell, even 1 hour would be acceptable. But not 2 hours.