Dear Square Enix, do something with GCD healing please.

[JanVanding]

But no one is saying that. It was said earlier we want choices and internconnectedness. Red mage was a great example of a job where abilities interact. Why can’t healers have something like that? Whm does a bit with Lilies but they didn’t expand on it which makes no sense.

Look how both dancer red mage and yes bard even though bard lost some connectivity w their dots these classes show how depth can be had between the spells skills abilities

Healers want that too especially sense they won’t give us more than a spam dmg button

I read the thread, people aren't wanting choice, they want a heal bot with OGCDs as utility and to put more dps on the dps jobs so we can just healbot.

That isn't "choice" that's saying "I don't like having to do damage, I just want to heal so everyone should have to"

WHM/SCH/SGE/AST believe it or not all play very differently while at surface level they are the same, their kits, the depth behind them and the potential ceilings are all very different.

Sure there's absolutely no difference if all you do is run Syrcus all day, but when you start moving into harder content when the Macro game comes into play, the nuances of each kit begin to really stand out.

Would I like more to do? Sure, but I certainly don't want to be forced into ancient MMO healer playstyle, that relic belongs in the past.

[Semirhage]

That isn't "choice" that's saying "I don't like having to do damage, I just want to heal so everyone should have to"

What? There's like one person in the thread saying that. Everyone else wants actual kit interactivity. Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare Glare is hideous game design. Not because healers dealing damage is a bad thing, but because pressing one button over and over again is boring as snot. Why doesn't Glare proc anything? Why doesn't Dia charge something up? Because the healing kits are largely boring, disconnected sets of flat potency skills that have nothing to do with one another.

I'm not hating on Glare because I want to be a Curebot, I'm hating on Glare because spending 80% of your time spamming one spell in some of the hardest content in the game is atrocious design, and healers deserve more to manage than just that.

[QooEr]

I read the thread, people aren't wanting choice, they want a heal bot with OGCDs as utility and to put more dps on the dps jobs so we can just healbot.

That isn't "choice" that's saying "I don't like having to do damage, I just want to heal so everyone should have to"

WHM/SCH/SGE/AST believe it or not all play very differently while at surface level they are the same, their kits, the depth behind them and the potential ceilings are all very different.

Sure there's absolutely no difference if all you do is run Syrcus all day, but when you start moving into harder content when the Macro game comes into play, the nuances of each kit begin to really stand out.

Would I like more to do? Sure, but I certainly don't want to be forced into ancient MMO healer playstyle, that relic belongs in the past.

OP never mentioned any of that. OP said gcd heals should refund the lost dps so that healing doesnt feel like a complete waste of a gcd on a class that is ostensibly called a healer. it was some other random guy that started saying healers should heal xd when in reality op just meant that healers shouldnt be actively avoiding to heal at all costs. big difference.

now i dont think just making gcd heals not-awful-to-use is enough to fix the dumpster fire that is healer design in this game, but it would at the very least make it so more of our kit sees use.

[Navnav]

This is just completely wrong though and not at all how healers in FFXIV work. No matter how much Yoshida says this, the fights say otherwise - the game is not tuned for "just do some DPS where you can!" but instead for healers contributing as much DPS as possible. These fights are tuned around healer DPS. To see that this is the case, all we need to look at is the top E8S speedkill.

https://www.fflogs.com/reports/qCnHW...pe=damage-done
This is the E8S Rank 1 Speedkill. The rDPS requirement for enrage is 90725 and this group logged 104357 rDPS. If you subtract the healers, 104357 - 20662, you end up with 83695 which is 7000 rDPS behind the enrage requirement for the fight. And these are the TOP players for the fight.

If the content was tuned around not requiring healer DPS or just having healers "DPS where they can", it wouldn't be impossible, if not close to impossible to clear even if you had 4 of the best DPS players and 2 of the best tank DPS on the planet. This is the core problem, healers are in fact not "meant to heal." The design encounters that they're sticking with demand that we DPS, and using our GCD healing is always a DPS penalty not just to ourselves, but to our entire party's potential clear.

You know something, I'm not completely against healers doing some damage during an enrage timer, but the whole fight isn't that is it? You are talking about speed kills also, not about simply kills, which is the big thing, just being able to take down the boss. You are forcing a point of view solely how a few wish to clear it on farm. There are much more players out there that will just be going in their to simply just kill it and learn it. Eitherway, I think this whole enrage timer argument needs to just die. You would think the enrage timer is 20 minutes of a 20 minutes fight.

I'm also not saying that healers need to ONLY heal. On WoW for instance I love throwing out some lava bursts on my shaman and contributing with some dps. But that is because I actually have to heal, so enjoy when I can dps, but i DO dps. In this game all your GCDs are spent on damaging abilities which to me is not necessarily what is required from the player or from square but from the community. If the healers would have simply done less damage, they would have cleared the fight still anyway.

Remove the oGCD healing, and leave each healer with only a few, and force them to cast heals, however make their damaging abilities hit harder, and give a couple of oGCD damage abilities. The way damage intake works in this game you don't even need oGCD heals. The GCD heals only approach would force players to now really think about their mana. It will simply be the best change.

[elioaiko]

Lol taking away healing oGCDs and forcing GCD healing is terrible design as well. You want to GCD heal more by...just spamming Cure 2 and Medica 2? Unless they change the entire combat system, GCD healing will never be important. It's not completely unused, just minimized.

And imagine reacting to mechanics with several ticks of damage with just GCD healing. For one doing E12S final cycles with back to back damage with just GCD healing will run you out of MP so fast. OGCDs when played smartly reduces your need to heal reactively and let's you actually contribute to what's the best mitigation of the game–killing the boss faster.

[ThorneDynasty]

Silly argument. If they can change healers to heal more, they can change the encounter design damage required or change the DPSers output. This is a design philosophy discussion. Frankly, as a healer in several MMOs, FFXIV's healer model is among my least favorite, because I'd rather be healing as much if not more than DPSing. However, Square has made it pretty apparently they think we'd rather be another DPS with a bad DPS rotation that throws the occasional heal.

You'd need way more changes than just tweaking numbers for this to work at all. No matter how easy you make the DPS checks you just don't have anything else to do as a healer between damage spikes. Just like how you can't just boost incoming damage to add more healing, because any significant boost will just kill players outright without any chance to heal (more often that it already does).

You'd have to rescript everything which I don't believe is even slightly realistic at this point. The "but i'm healer not DPS" attitude is a big obstacle to doing the reasonable thing and admitting how the game is designed and that the healer jobs don't make sense in its context.

[IruruCece]

On WoW for instance

If you love WoW so much, go play a healer there.

[RinaShinomiya]

Lol taking away healing oGCDs and forcing GCD healing is terrible design as well. You want to GCD heal more by...just spamming Cure 2 and Medica 2? Unless they change the entire combat system, GCD healing will never be important. It's not completely unused, just minimized.

And imagine reacting to mechanics with several ticks of damage with just GCD healing. For one doing E12S final cycles with back to back damage with just GCD healing will run you out of MP so fast. OGCDs when played smartly reduces your need to heal reactively and let's you actually contribute to what's the best mitigation of the game–killing the boss faster.

Again, this thread is asking for mechanics that makes GCD healing DPS Neutral. "Killing boss faster" is a irrelevant argument here because nobody is asking to just remove oGCD heals and call it a day. Similarly i mentioned MP recovery should be tied to our toolkit rather than be a separate button. See my WHM example. Not only are lily heals MP neutral but they'd apply a mini lucid dreaming effect. The only thing missing from WHM already being where i want it to be is misery being DPS neutral and more of its kit being tied to that system.

[Icecylee]

Yeah the excess of oGCD heals combined with the super low incoming damage is a huge problem. I've talked about this a lot with other people, but the way the system accidentally wound up punishing you for wanting to spend your GCDs really is the biggest thing preventing the healing role from being enjoyable. It's also why the worse the healer's player or their party is, the less they mind the horribly outdated kits. After a certain point those cooldowns don't matter (or they forget they're there/under-utilize them) and they start having to react to things frantically. But for even halfway decent players, that never really happens, and it's frustrating, because you're sitting there largely just spamming the same GCD over and over without thinking about anything at all. Especially as someone that used to main WHM back in ARR, but can't stand it (or the role in general) these days.

I know part of it is that they want to make the role more approachable, but tbqh I thing the massively bloated kits and then a whole lot of nothing for downtime to reward investment in the role do the exact opposite. It looks scary and overwhelming as first; look at all these varied healing buttons! I can't believe the game is going to make me use them all! Except that's not the case at all. On the flip side I do think there *are* ways to make classes that are still simple, but have have some light interactivity to them and opening up some space for just... the slightest... bit more downtime options without making them overwhelming to easy to *stop* doing if you suddenly find yourself needing to heal right away.

I've been kicking around a few idea for a while, particularly aiming for them to be something a friend that Mostly Thinks Healing's Fine As Is (because his group is not, uh, terribly good) and wound up with something like this...

potencies are all bullshit but there to give some relative values. Also this was designed with healers having a way bigger focus on playstyle differences, with WHM being the direct, pure healer so that a regen healer could be more fleshed out elsewhere.

HEALS
LILY SYSTEM: If you have a lily charge when you cast a GCD heal, it consumes the stack and makes the spell cost 0MP and norishes the blood lily. Get 1 lily every 20s. Max of 3 lilies and 3 blood lilies.

GCD
Cure. 500 MP. 1.5C. 400~ potency. Upgrades to become esuna as well with a later trait. Upgrades to become instant cast later with a trait.
Cure 2. 800 MP. 1.5C. 800~ potency. Upgrades to grant you swiftcast with a later trait.
Medica. 600 MP. 1.5C. 300~ potency aoe.
Solas. 900 MP. 1.5C. 1200~ potency aoe smart heal (spreads healing out between the targets as needed).
Raise. 2000 MP. 8C. 20%~ revive. gets a trait later that grants the target a 50% incoming healing buff for 10s.

oGCD
Benediction. 999s Recast. 300~1500 potency ST heal. Power increases the lower the target's HP is. Cooldown is reset anytime Banish or Holy is cast.
Temperance. 60s Recast. Increase your healing power by 30% for 10s,
Divine Seal. 60s Recast. Increase incoming heals on the target by 20% for 10s.
Asylum. 60s Recast. You next three GCDs will gain an additional effect which smart heals a single target within range for 300 potency.
Protect. 60s Recast. Grants the target 10% damage reduction for 10s. Additionally, anytime the target is hit, they're healed for 100 potency.

NUKES
ELEMENTAL WRATH: Your GCD nukes fill this meter by varying amounts. It's a gauge that goes from 0-100.

Stone. 400 MP. 1.5C. 300~ potency. Gives +10 Elemental Wrath (EW)
Aero. 500MP. Instant. 100~ potency, then a 50 potency dot for 21s. Gives +20 EW.
Water. 500MP. 1.5C. 30s Cooldown, 2 stacks. 400~ potency. Gives +30 EW

Quake. 400 MP. Instant. 120~ potency aoe. Gives +10 EW.
Tornado. 500MP. Instant. 60~ potency, then 30~ potency for 21s. Gives +20 EW. Overwrites the aero dot.
Flood. 500MP. 1.5C. 30s Cooldown, 2 stacks. 250~ potency aoe. Givies +30 EW. Shares a recats timer with Water.

Banish. 0MP. Instant. 500~ potency. Resets your Benediction cooldown, and restores 500 MP. Consumes 100 EW
Holy. 0MP. Instant. 300~ potency AoE. Stuns all targets for 5s. Resets your Benediction cooldown. Consumes 100 EW

Misery. 0MP. Instants. 1200~ potency to a single target, and 60% less for nearby targets. Consumed 3 blood lilies

[Visanis]

Archmage in Warhammer Online had a High Magic mechanic that buffed your damage spells for casting heals and vice versa.

They could add something similar to the heals of this game so it's not as much of a sin to cast a GCD heal. Like casting a healing GCD in combat (so you can't prepull buff) buffs the next 1 spam damage GCD by 50-75% (things could get messy if it buffed things like dots and misery, so it's probably best it's locked to the generic nuke) so it's not an absolute loss but still not neutral.

Anything that gives you some form of an incentive to use at least some of the other half of your kit .