We interrupt your current server woes to talk about casting

[Estellios]

what sucks is the huge recast timers for Burst. 15 minutes is way too long. What's the point of getting black mage if you cant use it's specific abilities without waiting a quarter of an hour? (I'm assuming freeze and other ancient magic are similar)

Convert is kind of a big deal, its essentially fixing the biggest problem with THM in endgame stuff.

[Nyx]

Convert is kind of a big deal, its essentially fixing the biggest problem with THM in endgame stuff.

That's true, I hope that the recast timer on that isn't as long as Burst though!

[syntaxlies]

Convert is kind of a big deal, its essentially fixing the biggest problem with THM in endgame stuff.

Thm generally fail in moogle from MP management. Yesterday one of Our LS parsed with the archers at around 55k on thm making me a believer.

Anyways, i hope convert doesn't have a crazy long cooldown. Even 5 mins would be acceptable imo.

[fusional]

Thm generally fail in moogle from MP management. Yesterday one of Our LS parsed with the archers at around 55k on thm making me a believer.

Anyways, i hope convert doesn't have a crazy long cooldown. Even 5 mins would be acceptable imo.

a thm, played correctly, can indeed contribute to moogle fights. however, i must nitpick about a couple things.

cite dps, not total damage.

1. total damage doesn't matter because primals regen and/or heal themselves, so the longer the fight drags on the higher EVERYONE'S total damage.

2. a good thm is able to do about 60-65 dps at the end of a start-to-finish moogle parse, and that sounds about like what your THM was doing- but that's still much much lower than what a good archer should be doing. you should be expecting your archers to finish at 75-85 dps.

in a 14 minute moogle fight i might do 82 dps, which means i'll end with nearly 70k damage. however, in an 8 minute speed run i might do 85 dps, which means i'll end with about 41k damage. if you're in the mode of thought that 55k is good, you'll look at my 85 dps speed run parse and think it's low? again- dps is the only figure that really matters. or if you MUST list total damage, at least include the battle time so people can do the math themselves.

anyway, 10-20 dps is still a pretty major gap.

that said- with archer switching to BRD role and doling out MP regen songs, and BLM getting convert... this is probably a moot discussion, as BLM should be able to do much better DPS than THM (and we assume more dps than BRD since BRD won't be focused on damage).

[Tonkra]

that said- with archer switching to BRD role and doling out MP regen songs, and BLM getting convert... this is probably a moot discussion, as BLM should be able to do much better DPS than THM (and we assume more dps than BRD since BRD won't be focused on damage).

the question is will people switch to the jobs within these primal fights?
because they are unable to equip for example "Sentinel" which is by many people called a "must" in these fights. BLM wont have more defense or HP than THM nor any of the jobs will have an overpowered "protection skill" for the group. so the BLM will knocked out after the special attack from each primal without sentinel?

i think so or so its a pitty that you need one skill of a class as a must to be alive after an attack.
they need to reduce the effect of sentinel havely and on the other side reduce a bit of the special attack damage from the primes. otherwise i see bad times for ne new jobs.

or am i wrong? hum.

[fusional]

the question is will people switch to the jobs within these primal fights?
because they are unable to equip for example "Sentinel" which is by many people called a "must" in these fights. BLM wont have more defense or HP than THM nor any of the jobs will have an overpowered "protection skill" for the group. so the BLM will knocked out after the special attack from each primal without sentinel?

i think so or so its a pitty that you need one skill of a class as a must to be alive after an attack.
they need to reduce the effect of sentinel havely and on the other side reduce a bit of the special attack damage from the primes. otherwise i see bad times for ne new jobs.

or am i wrong? hum.

well, sentinel definitely isn't necessary for moogle. in fact, it's almost encouraged not to use it. for one, if you kill all the moogles in phase 1 (which you should be) the moogle memento damage is pretty tiny. second, it increases enmity from actions done while in effect (very bad for moogle). and finally, one of your tank's best tools for grabbing some snap aggro at the start of phase two is aoe curing the party.

ifrit is a trickier thing, though. if everyone is in their job roles, like you said, there's really no way to reduce group damage from hellfire. all you can do is knock down at least 2 nails, make sure everyone is topped off, and make sure everyone has prot and stoneskin. and then hope for the best. i'm 100% sure it's still possible with an all jobs party, but i wouldn't be surprised if most people still choose to ask at least 1 or 2 people to stick to classes because it's safer.

we'll have to see how it works out.

[Riaayo]

the question is will people switch to the jobs within these primal fights?
because they are unable to equip for example "Sentinel" which is by many people called a "must" in these fights. BLM wont have more defense or HP than THM nor any of the jobs will have an overpowered "protection skill" for the group. so the BLM will knocked out after the special attack from each primal without sentinel?

i think so or so its a pitty that you need one skill of a class as a must to be alive after an attack.
they need to reduce the effect of sentinel havely and on the other side reduce a bit of the special attack damage from the primes. otherwise i see bad times for ne new jobs.

or am i wrong? hum.

I think something that will be a much larger shock to this community is that if everyone is on a Job, Raise will only be possessed by 3 of them (Pld, Brd, Whm). This game so far has heavily crutched on the ability to battle-rez and the fact that every member of the party had one. People screaming for more punishment from death should be delighted by this update, because now several DDs dieing in a fight can really make you botch the entire encounter (unlike now where a death or two is fairly easily remedied). I worry that people will whine about it and stick to the classes just to scrape by rather than try to improve... but maybe that's part of the point. I don't intend to, for one.

well, sentinel definitely isn't necessary for moogle. in fact, it's almost encouraged not to use it. for one, if you kill all the moogles in phase 1 (which you should be) the moogle memento damage is pretty tiny. second, it increases enmity from actions done while in effect (very bad for moogle). and finally, one of your tank's best tools for grabbing some snap aggro at the start of phase two is aoe curing the party.

ifrit is a trickier thing, though. if everyone is in their job roles, like you said, there's really no way to reduce group damage from hellfire. all you can do is knock down at least 2 nails, make sure everyone is topped off, and make sure everyone has prot and stoneskin. and then hope for the best. i'm 100% sure it's still possible with an all jobs party, but i wouldn't be surprised if most people still choose to ask at least 1 or 2 people to stick to classes because it's safer.

we'll have to see how it works out.

I say kill all 4 nails. That's my goal to push for, anyway. Screw sentinel!

[Agoven]

the question is will people switch to the jobs within these primal fights?
because they are unable to equip for example "Sentinel" which is by many people called a "must" in these fights. BLM wont have more defense or HP than THM nor any of the jobs will have an overpowered "protection skill" for the group. so the BLM will knocked out after the special attack from each primal without sentinel?

i think so or so its a pitty that you need one skill of a class as a must to be alive after an attack.
they need to reduce the effect of sentinel havely and on the other side reduce a bit of the special attack damage from the primes. otherwise i see bad times for ne new jobs.

or am i wrong? hum.

Not a must at ALL. It's just a way people CHOOSE to play. A GOOD group can take down all 4 nails from Ifrit renderiing Hellfire useless. Even getting down 2 nails will make the fight a yawn.

On Moogle if you take down all the the single moogles Momento does very little damage and most people don't even bother to use sentinel.

I think you have the wrong idea if you think that SENTINEL is required. It is not. It's just how PEOPLE CHOOSE TO PLAY. It's the I want gear and I want to beat this as fast as possible mentality. Sentinel only does a damage cut...and that can be mitigated with actually FIGHTING the fight. SENTINEL is not required for any fight in the game. It's just a way to be a little lazier when the heat is on.

And I thought when they talked of jobs...future dungeons/instances may require that you be in job mode before you can enter. Yoshi-p said he wanted classes to be for solo and jobs for multiplayer play.