Can SQ-EN draw a line in the sand w/ 3rd Parties?

[Nothv13]

I still think this is a reach. We can use phones to communicate, or any other means, really. Play Station players can use the PS VC with their fellow PS players. Using Discord or communication tools is no different from being in the same room as someone or close enough to them for you to be able to talk to each other and communicate. Communication is not the same as using a program to automate stuff for you because it's still a human being you're interacting with.

The EULA specifically mentions changes gameplay, and that is what voice chat does, it drastically changes the gameplay. For example, back in DAoC You could really see the difference in battles and even PvE between those using the brand new (at the time) teamspeak and those not. It does change it. Like I said, its so common now we just take it for granted now and don't think about what it actually does on the game side.

[Saraide]

So its Rules for Thee, not for me huh? Streamer privilege I guess. They are livestreaming a breach/rule break. They should get first a 3 day ban, then if repeat offence 1 week, and another breach, Permaban imo
Soon Addons and this Simtool will be demanded implemented into the game itself. This game has done really well long before all these new streamers came to this game, and atm the problems they bring due to unavaiable parts for servers might cause EW launch log in to be a nightmare

Please for the love of god stop with the fear mongering. The way the fights are designed makes plugins unnecessary and more importantly they wont give you any meaningful advantage over just playing well. You can do exactly the same as those streamers do. The way to not step over the line is to not harras people, that's literally the only thing you have to do when using third party tools and when not using them.

[Eien713]

The EULA specifically mentions changes gameplay, and that is what voice chat does, it drastically changes the gameplay. For example, back in DAoC You could really see the difference in battles and even PvE between those using the brand new (at the time) teamspeak and those not. It does change it. Like I said, its so common now we just take it for granted now and don't think about what it actually does on the game side.

If you're fast enough at typing, you can type in chat to alert other people to stuff (at least in normal content). Should we do something about this too? After all, it modifies gameplay too. Or are you gonna say that since it's using something built in the game, it's ok? I don't think what people here are discussing is about modifying the gameplay itself but about some people having an advantage over others and relying on something that's not a human to do part of their work for them. VC isn't harmful and anyone can use it (PS players included), unlike 3rd party programs.

[Saraide]

If you're fast enough at typing, you can type in chat to alert other people to stuff. Should we do something about this too? After all, it modifies gameplay too.

I feel like this exact logic has been talked into the ground with human shot caller vs cactbot calls right in this thread.

[Eien713]

I feel like this exact logic has been talked into the ground with human shot caller vs cactbot calls right in this thread.

The part you quoted was actually for discussing the use of Discord for communication.

[Stormfur]

In some ways I can understand certain tools being used (like to make the UI easier to read/see or something that helps accessibility). But if you let these kinds of programs be allowed, pretty soon the party finder will be "Baddie Primal Clear. Must have X Y and Z installed." to where even if you could clear Baddie Primal without those things, you'll be playing at a distinct disadvantage and noticeably so.

[Saraide]

The part you quoted was actually for discussing the use of Discord for communication.

And you dont see the similarities between 'communication via discord vs via ingame chat' and 'shotcalling done by cactbot vs done by raid leader'?

[Nothv13]

In some ways I can understand certain tools being used (like to make the UI easier to read/see or something that helps accessibility). But if you let these kinds of programs be allowed, pretty soon the party finder will be "Baddie Primal Clear. Must have X Y and Z installed." to where even if you could clear Baddie Primal without those things, you'll be playing at a distinct disadvantage and noticeably so.

This would trigger an actual violation. The violations for 3rd party things has always came down to how they are used. Forcing use is one of the things that has triggered a violation.

[Saraide]

In some ways I can understand certain tools being used (like to make the UI easier to read/see or something that helps accessibility). But if you let these kinds of programs be allowed, pretty soon the party finder will be "Baddie Primal Clear. Must have X Y and Z installed." to where even if you could clear Baddie Primal without those things, you'll be playing at a distinct disadvantage and noticeably so.

That's not how the game is designed. You dont have a significant advantage over someone playing well. All you do is take a shortcut to learning the fight. Putting some plugin requirement into PF will very likely get you a warning point right now already.

[Nothv13]

If you're fast enough at typing, you can type in chat to alert other people to stuff (at least in normal content). Should we do something about this too? After all, it modifies gameplay too. Or are you gonna say that since it's using something built in the game, it's ok? I don't think what people here are discussing is about modifying the gameplay itself but about some people having an advantage over others and relying on something that's not a human to do part of their work for them. VC isn't harmful and anyone can use it (PS players included), unlike 3rd party programs.

The game has built in text chat thus no violation of the of the EULA. Voice coms is straight up advantage. Type as fast as you want, most are not as fast as speaking it is harder to notice than a shot caller in your ear. Correct voice coms isn't harmful, and neither are other 3rd party programs unless they are forced by players, which is what triggers a violation.