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  1. #1
    Player
    Nothv13's Avatar
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    Einulfr Nothson
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    Cactuar
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    Lancer Lv 88
    Quote Originally Posted by Altera View Post
    So its Rules for Thee, not for me huh? Streamer privilege I guess. They are livestreaming a breach/rule break. They should get first a 3 day ban, then if repeat offence 1 week, and another breach, Permaban imo
    Soon Addons and this Simtool will be demanded implemented into the game itself. This game has done really well long before all these new streamers came to this game, and atm the problems they bring due to unavaiable parts for servers might cause EW launch log in to be a nightmare
    Not at all, you also won't get banned for them as long as you don't use them harass people. Yoshi P has even said if you are getting banned for the 3rd party addons, your are likely already in trouble for some other violation. Yoshi P also said that technically, Discord is 3rd party, so if they enforced it as written, anyone using discord would also be banned.
    (5)
    Last edited by Nothv13; 10-27-2021 at 04:35 AM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Altera's Avatar
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    Bergen
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    Chandani Aranka
    World
    Odin
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    Black Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Nothv13 View Post
    Not at all, you also won't get banned for them as long as you don't use them harass people. Yoshi P has even said if you are getting banned for the 3rd party addons, your are likely already in trouble for some other violation. Yoshi P also said that technically, Discord is 3rd party, so if they enforced it as written, anyone using discord would also be banned.
    He also said to respect the ToS and not openly show using 3rd party software. I would say when promoting those very same things, is the opposite of respect. If Yoshida asked me to not do something, I would honor him by doing it.
    These streamers are pretty much pooping on his wishes
    (2)

  3. #3
    Player
    Nothv13's Avatar
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    Einulfr Nothson
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    Cactuar
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    Lancer Lv 88
    Quote Originally Posted by Altera View Post
    He also said to respect the ToS and not openly show using 3rd party software. I would say when promoting those very same things, is the opposite of respect. If Yoshida asked me to not do something, I would honor him by doing it.
    These streamers are pretty much pooping on his wishes
    You do you. People will continue to use them. No use getting bent out of shape.

    BTW, these addons have been around long before these streamers came to FFXIV. The only newish one I've seen making the rounds seems to be Limit's UI addon, everything else has been around for years and the only reason you didn't notice is because using them to harass or requiring them is what triggers the infraction, thus they aren't spoken of in game.

    Edit: Would say logitech g software be illegal? It can run macros and allow you to do things you wouldn't normally be able to do (such is a violation of the EULA)? If so, guess Yoshi P would be banned as well since he uses such. How about all the glitches people use to decorate house? Such abuses are also against the EULA. Going to ban them? See the issue with being hard nosed with the EULA yet?
    (3)
    Last edited by Nothv13; 10-27-2021 at 05:10 AM.

  4. #4
    Player
    Eien713's Avatar
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    Kiyora Valeriant
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    Odin
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    Bard Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Nothv13 View Post
    Yoshi P also said that technically, Discord is 3rd party, so if they enforced it as written, anyone using discord would also be banned.
    I don't get how Discord is comparable to Cactbot, ACT, and similar stuff. Discord is for communication. It doesn't affect the game itself and doesn't modify it. By this logic, would we also be banned for using phones to talk to someone while playing the game together? It's ludicrous.
    (0)
    Last edited by Eien713; 10-27-2021 at 05:26 AM.
    The Glamour Effect: That awkward moment when you realize you know FFXIV's gear pieces better than your own wardrobe X'D

  5. #5
    Player
    Nothv13's Avatar
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    Einulfr Nothson
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eien713 View Post
    I don't get how Discord is comparable to Cactbot, ACT, and similar stuff. Discord is for communication. It doesn't affect the game itself or modifies it. By this logic, would we also be banned for using phones to talk to someone while playing the game together? It's ludicrous.
    Because the EULA words it in such a way that Discord would be caught in it. Discord modifies your gameplay by allowing voiced communication, something the game itself does not allow. Communication is huge when high end raiding and drastically changes how the raiding would play out. We just take it for granted and not realize that it does violate the EULA by modifying gameplay. In Truth, there are so many things that violate the EULA that people do every day, enforcing everything but the most egregious would devastate the community.
    (4)
    Last edited by Nothv13; 10-27-2021 at 05:39 AM.

  6. #6
    Player
    Eien713's Avatar
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    Kiyora Valeriant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nothv13 View Post
    Because the EULA words it in such a way that Discord would be caught in it. Discord modifies your gameplay by allowing voiced communication, something the game itself does not allow. Communication is huge when high end raiding and drastically changes how the raiding would play out. We just take it for granted and not realize that it does violate the EULA by modifying gameplay. In Truth, there are so many things that violate the EULA that people do every day, enforcing everything but the most egregious would devastate the community.
    I still think this is a reach. We can use phones to communicate, or any other means, really. Play Station players can use the PS VC with their fellow PS players. Using Discord or communication tools is no different from being in the same room as someone or close enough to them for you to be able to talk to each other and communicate. Communication is not the same as using a program to automate stuff for you because it's still a human being you're interacting with.
    (0)
    Last edited by Eien713; 10-27-2021 at 06:34 AM.
    The Glamour Effect: That awkward moment when you realize you know FFXIV's gear pieces better than your own wardrobe X'D

  7. #7
    Player
    Nothv13's Avatar
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    Einulfr Nothson
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eien713 View Post
    I still think this is a reach. We can use phones to communicate, or any other means, really. Play Station players can use the PS VC with their fellow PS players. Using Discord or communication tools is no different from being in the same room as someone or close enough to them for you to be able to talk to each other and communicate. Communication is not the same as using a program to automate stuff for you because it's still a human being you're interacting with.
    The EULA specifically mentions changes gameplay, and that is what voice chat does, it drastically changes the gameplay. For example, back in DAoC You could really see the difference in battles and even PvE between those using the brand new (at the time) teamspeak and those not. It does change it. Like I said, its so common now we just take it for granted now and don't think about what it actually does on the game side.
    (3)

  8. #8
    Player
    Eien713's Avatar
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    Kiyora Valeriant
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    Odin
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nothv13 View Post
    The EULA specifically mentions changes gameplay, and that is what voice chat does, it drastically changes the gameplay. For example, back in DAoC You could really see the difference in battles and even PvE between those using the brand new (at the time) teamspeak and those not. It does change it. Like I said, its so common now we just take it for granted now and don't think about what it actually does on the game side.
    If you're fast enough at typing, you can type in chat to alert other people to stuff (at least in normal content). Should we do something about this too? After all, it modifies gameplay too. Or are you gonna say that since it's using something built in the game, it's ok? I don't think what people here are discussing is about modifying the gameplay itself but about some people having an advantage over others and relying on something that's not a human to do part of their work for them. VC isn't harmful and anyone can use it (PS players included), unlike 3rd party programs.
    (0)
    Last edited by Eien713; 10-27-2021 at 06:42 AM.
    The Glamour Effect: That awkward moment when you realize you know FFXIV's gear pieces better than your own wardrobe X'D

  9. #9
    Player
    Saraide's Avatar
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    Saraide Derosa
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    Odin
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eien713 View Post
    If you're fast enough at typing, you can type in chat to alert other people to stuff. Should we do something about this too? After all, it modifies gameplay too.
    I feel like this exact logic has been talked into the ground with human shot caller vs cactbot calls right in this thread.
    (4)

  10. #10
    Player
    Nothv13's Avatar
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    Einulfr Nothson
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    Cactuar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eien713 View Post
    If you're fast enough at typing, you can type in chat to alert other people to stuff (at least in normal content). Should we do something about this too? After all, it modifies gameplay too. Or are you gonna say that since it's using something built in the game, it's ok? I don't think what people here are discussing is about modifying the gameplay itself but about some people having an advantage over others and relying on something that's not a human to do part of their work for them. VC isn't harmful and anyone can use it (PS players included), unlike 3rd party programs.
    The game has built in text chat thus no violation of the of the EULA. Voice coms is straight up advantage. Type as fast as you want, most are not as fast as speaking it is harder to notice than a shot caller in your ear. Correct voice coms isn't harmful, and neither are other 3rd party programs unless they are forced by players, which is what triggers a violation.
    (3)