Pulling wall to wall isn't fast enough?

[Reinha]

Ironic too that you talk about "jobs" when you're enabling DPS that aren't doing their job and you're refusing to do your job yourself.

The dps who pulls mobs and starts hitting them is doing their job, which is to deal damage. If you're slacking and they take on your role as well as their own, I'll happily heal them and give them a comm too. Dungeons are too easy for tanks (or any role) to act like they are irreplaceable.

Pull faster, and no one can pull for you.

[Tanis_Ebonhart]

The dps who pulls mobs and starts hitting them is doing their job, which is to deal damage. If you're slacking and they take on your role as well as their own, I'll happily heal them and give them a comm too. Dungeons are too easy for tanks (or any role) to act like they are irreplaceable.

Pull faster, and no one can pull for you.

Oh? So you're saying a DPS knows better than the tank? Even in randoms? The DPS magically knows the tank's skill level thus they have the sole authority to dictate runs and the tank should adjust to do what the DPS wants even if they aren't comfortable with it? Geez. Sounds like that DPS should switch to Tank then since they know more about tanking than the tank!

I'm a competent enough healer that I can keep a dps alive without a tank. If you don't want to tank, I don't need you.

Sure, I don't necessarily agree with DPS pulling. I find it annoying. But what gets under my skin more is egomaniacs like you who think they are the most important person in the duty. Get over yourself before you look like a complete fool.

I highly doubt that.

I can assure you... if this is another MMO, you'll probably correct. But FFXIV is different. Tanks are -not- the king. It's the group's decision. If people are dissatisfied they each have 33% power over the group that's also known as Vote Dismiss count.

A single pulling tank is as good as a gimped dps with constant Weakness debuff. Why? Because in addition to tanks' already lower damage output than a legit DPS, tanking a single pack is something that's not exclusive to tanks. Single pulling devalues qualities where tanks shines at: their tankiness. Why would you waste that advantage of yours by playing chicken? If you don't want to see anybody pulling ahead in lv50+ contents, then pull until there's nothing left to pull.

Do note that I specifically mentioned lv50+ because that's how easy tanking progresses into late game. If it's lv15-50 where walls aren't so apparent (i.e. Aurum Vale first room), taking consideration of your healers' limited tools, dps AoE firepower, and your own survivability is completely fine. Under normal circumstances, big pulls are almost always preferred. Horror stories happen but they're not the norm.

Please don't fall into "Tanks/Healers are the king"-trap, that's a relic from another MMO. I repeat; FFXIV is entirely different.

Ah. So in FF14 it's okay to abuse and disrespect tanks?

[LittleImp]

Ah. So in FF14 it's okay to abuse and disrespect tanks?

You're already disrespecting your parties time by refusing to put even a modicum of effort into a team activity; Why on earth would you expect them to respect you back?

[Reinha]

Oh? So you're saying a DPS knows better than the tank? Even in randoms? The DPS magically knows the tank's skill level thus they have the sole authority to dictate runs and the tank should adjust to do what the DPS wants even if they aren't comfortable with it?

If a dps pulls and doesn't die because the healer is on board with it, then your discomfort is unwarranted. Clearly the mobs don't hit very hard. So yes, you should adjust to what your group wants instead of expecting them to adjust to what you want.

Your skill level is irrelevant to this conversation because tanking dungeons requires you to run forward, press a cooldown and press AoE buttons. The same thing you (hopefully) did in Sastasha.

[BaconBits]

Watching diva tanks get torn to shreds gives me life.

Imagine thinking holding w on the keyboard/forward on a joystick is some kind of forbidden art.

[Tanis_Ebonhart]

If a dps pulls and doesn't die because the healer is on board with it, then your discomfort is unwarranted. Clearly the mobs don't hit very hard. So yes, you should adjust to what your group wants instead of expecting them to adjust to what you want.

Your skill level is irrelevant to this conversation because tanking dungeons requires you to run forward, press a cooldown and press AoE buttons. The same thing you (hopefully) did in Sastasha.

Disagree. The DPS shouldn't require being babysat while they walk all over the tank and force the healer to work harder to save them from their suicidal tendencies.

If tanking was so simple then why do most play DPS? Simple. Tanking isn't easy nor is healing. So most players don't want that responsibility as they know that when a DPS messes up that the Tank and sometimes healer are blamed for not carrying harder.

You're already disrespecting your parties time by refusing to put even a modicum of effort into a team activity; Why on earth would you expect them to respect you back?

You assume a lot while giving the DPS the benefit of the doubt no matter what they do while placing all blame on the tank.

[Xtrasweettea]

When you learn to be respectful and stop being toxic then we can talk. Not that I see much gain from it considering you see tanks as glorified Babysitters meant to accommodate suicidal "go, go, go" DPS that blatantly disrespect the tank like yourself.

Rinhi is correct.

Tanks are (for the most part) just glorified babysitters. Especially in dungeons and other non-threatening content.

I am speaking as a tank main, not as a DPS main.

Tanks do not set the pace. DPS set the pace. How fast the enemies are defeated dictates how quickly the group can move to the next set of enemies and how many enemies to grab. DPS have majority control over this. Tank and Healer damage are used to substitute lacking DPS damage and/or helps speed up the kill if there is an adequate enough damage from the DPS.

Tanks and Healers are custodians. They set an environment to allow DPS to do their jobs without worry. For tanks, this is just holding enemies in a certain way, using damage reduction, and deal damage. They do not dictate pace. The help maintain the pace.

As for pulls, it would be easier to do an end-to-end hold by you as the tank pulling first. If a DPS or Healer does, then you are just saving a GCD/Provoke. Don’t take offence to it. Use it to your advantage and grab the mobs.

If you cannot get over this mentality that you have, I think you would be better off playing a DPS. Tanks are a service role, just like healers. DPS are your main character who drives forward the progression. This is not me being disrespectful to Tanks or Healers. It is just how SE has designed these jobs for FF14.

[Tanis_Ebonhart]

I don't subscribe to such a toxic mentality. If the DPS wants to pull then they should queue as tank then. Could always use more tanks. Or could it be that they want the ability to Dictate how the Tank should tank while putting all the blame and responsibility on the Tank if they're unable to adjust to their "Go, Go, Go" mentality? Seems to be the case based off the replies in this topic.

[Thurmnmurmn]

Disagree. The DPS shouldn't require being babysat while they walk all over the tank and force the healer to work harder to save them from their suicidal tendencies.

If tanking was so simple then why do most play DPS? Simple. Tanking isn't easy nor is healing. So most players don't want that responsibility as they know that when a DPS messes up that the Tank and sometimes healer are blamed for not carrying harder.

So you just answered your own question but decided to throw in a useless statement in the middle. "Tanking isn't easy" is a lie. you follow up right after by saying the real reason "So most players don't want that responsibility". It has nothing to do with how hard it is.

In terms of the actual job itself, your rotation is way easier so you can focus on nothing except keeping aggro and keeping others alive.

I also want to point out how hilarious it is that you use the argument about "force the healer to work harder" in the forums when there's always a bunch of threads about how healers are bored and have nothing to do but press 1 button.

[Tanis_Ebonhart]

Riiight. Then there should be plenty of tanks out, right? I mean it's "Totally" the easiest role! Then why, pray tell, do Tanks have near instant queues while DPS struggle to get in within a timely manner? Could it be that tanking isn't so simple hence why most players don't want to deal with such a big role? Yes, that is the case.