Astrologian changes 6.0

[inhaledcorn]

Now...Watch as I solo heal Emerald Weapon extreme with one tank.

Look at you thinking it's impressive to solo heal content designed to be cleared in Augmented Crystarium gear.

[Mortex]

I know alot of people are much more excited about the new kid on the block. But I honestly believe that AST is the healer that got the most improvements. Even though Astrodyne and Minor Arcana do absolutely have the potential to hurt the player from poor RNG, it's at least done in a way that doesn't directly hurt their rdps contribution. It certainly does seem the devs where trying to figure out a way to give ASTs the randomness of the old cards without ruining their ability to buff their party more consistently.

That aside. The new tools they have are pretty cool as well, I'm definitely going to be looking forward to seeing how Macrocosmos is used. Exaltation isn't the most fancy tool, but I do love that it and Macrocosmos are joining Horoscope and Earthly star in the "predict the future" style heals they've slowly been getting.

I mean astro was in anyway better then whm already. The new abilities just got improve his status in the ogcd no cost 1 Minute up for all aoes department. Like astro is the most busted healer we have in the game (to be fair we have only 3 so yeah………). Also essential dignity is just a better tetra and benediction with less cd, also celestial intersect can crit bension can’t and it now has 2 charges. Also I rather take 10 % dmg reduce and a heal that can crit then 15 % dmg reduce in a expansion were all tank have high dmg reduce possibilities anyway. Macrocosmos is just lily bell with 1 minute less cd. And if the thin air changes do come whm is gonna have mana problems if you use glare a lot. Astro has it all.

[BlueMageQuina]

I mean astro was in anyway better then whm already. The new abilities just got improve his status in the ogcd no cost 1 Minute up for all aoes department. Like astro is the most busted healer we have in the game (to be fair we have only 3 so yeah………). Also essential dignity is just a better tetra and benediction with less cd, also celestial intersect can crit bension can’t and it now has 2 charges. Also I rather take 10 % dmg reduce and a heal that can crit then 15 % dmg reduce in a expansion were all tank have high dmg reduce possibilities anyway. Macrocosmos is just lily bell with 1 minute less cd. And if the thin air changes do come whm is gonna have mana problems if you use glare a lot. Astro has it all.

To add to the point that AST build is quite OP on paper, AST can throw cards and use Divination while receiving a new rng Cleric Stance/Fey Wind with the 3rd seal of Astrodyne, making it able to triple buff its own damage output yet WHM still can’t get Cleric Stance back and SCH doesn’t get Fey Wind back either.

AST is also receiving 2 new (AOE) attacks (Macrocosmos, Lord) and 3 heals (Macrocosmos, Lady, Exaltation)—this is before we add into context its attack upgrades on Malefic and Gravity, the buffs I mentioned before, and the fact that it’s keeping Neutral Sect.

Imagine a Neutral Aspected Helios supported with a Celestial Opposition under a Collective Unconscious while Earthly Star, Horoscope and Microcosmos burst at the same time. Imagine thinking your biggest simultaneous heal (Plenary Cure III under Asylum) mattered or even compared. In fact, just let AST solo heal all of Endwalker because its overpowered nature for the nth expac in a row is complete taurus feces.

Sure, people are going to play whatever class they like but honestly why bring a WHM if it’s likely going to have MP issues with its Thin Air nerf, a nerf that will be exacerbated by the PoM buff? Why bring WHM with its deafening lack of raid utility now that Divination has no upkeep?

[Mortex]

To add to the point that AST build is quite OP on paper, AST can throw cards and use Divination while receiving a new rng Cleric Stance/Fey Wind with the 3rd seal of Astrodyne, making it able to triple buff its own damage output yet WHM still can’t get Cleric Stance back and SCH doesn’t get Fey Wind back either.

AST is also receiving 2 new (AOE) attacks (Macrocosmos, Lord) and 3 heals (Macrocosmos, Lady, Exaltation)—this is before we add into context its attack upgrades on Malefic and Gravity, the buffs I mentioned before, and the fact that it’s keeping Neutral Sect.

Imagine a Neutral Aspected Helios supported with a Celestial Opposition under a Collective Unconscious while Earthly Star and Microcosmos burst at the same time. Imagine thinking your biggest simultaneous heal (Plenary Cure III under Asylum) mattered or even compared. In fact, just let AST solo heal all of Endwalker because its overpowered nature for the nth expac in a row is complete taurus feces.

Sure, people are going to play whatever class they like but honestly why bring a WHM if it’s likely going to have MP issues with its Thin Air nerf, a nerf that will be exacerbated by the PoM buff? Why bring WHM with its deafening lack of raid utility now that Divination has no upkeep?

Also the upkeep for heals on whm is insane in comparison to astro. Blood lily is still a dmg lose in anyway. Lily heals are gcd and the plenary Is just a worse neutral. I actually think the only thing about whm that is better is in some situations wings. But even then you still can just tap the collective button and get free 10% dmg reduce for 5 seconds and a strong hot and it has just 60 seconds cooldown. It’s also like I said macrocosmos is just a lilybell that deals dmg,is a group benediction and has 1 mind less cooldown. And all of that because whm has his beginner and noob healer stigma

[Payadopa]

"Adjust" to what? This is what I mean by players deluding themselves there's a choice here. You just press it on cooldown and it either does damage or overheals, then you pretend you made a choice and adapted and you're a great player. Lady isn't a bad heal, it's practically an Indom, but no good player will plan around a heal that rng might choose not to give you for 4-5 minutes. And AST is all about heal planning and mapping your cd's.

What I honestly don't get about such statements is that we think of a scenario where nobody screws up. I'm raiding myself and people do screw up or the enemy gets a lucky hit in so it's nice to have it.

And AST was meant as an RNG healer from the beginning. If people hate the concept so much (which I understand, don't get me wrong), then there are 2 (soon to be 3) other options available, so where is the problem?

On one hand people are complaining about homogeneity and on the other the second a job deviates even slightly this forum throws a hissy fit.

As an AST main I really like the new changes. Not as good as SB AST, but not as bad as ShB's iteration.

In conclusion: leave it to the players to maximise the fun out of your game.

[AFuzzyMu11in]

What I honestly don't get about such statements is that we think of a scenario where nobody screws up. I'm raiding myself and people do screw up or the enemy gets a lucky hit in so it's nice to have it.

And AST was meant as an RNG healer from the beginning. If people hate the concept so much (which I understand, don't get me wrong), then there are 2 (soon to be 3) other options available, so where is the problem?

On one hand people are complaining about homogeneity and on the other the second a job deviates even slightly this forum throws a hissy fit.

As an AST main I really like the new changes. Not as good as SB AST, but not as bad as ShB's iteration.

In conclusion: leave it to the players to maximise the fun out of your game.

Totally agree with this. If astro is meant to be yugioh rng then let it be rng if people don't like rng then don't play it.
Its my next class to learn after DN up next.

[WaxSw]

What I honestly don't get about such statements is that we think of a scenario where nobody screws up. I'm raiding myself and people do screw up or the enemy gets a lucky hit in so it's nice to have it.

The problem from my point of view with that skill is how those reward the player.

Lord is always nice to have as there is no thing as "too much damage" no matter the content you're in, you press X and get Y no matter what

Lady however has 2 problems tied to it, the first one is that depends on your enviroment, if little to no healing is required be it because your cohealer has it covered or the more common and likely scenario of damage so low it doesnt require the heal then lady doesnt give you any meaningful reward. The second problem is how its a rng heal which is probably the worst kind of rng you can have coupled with rng mitigation, the reason? heals are planned and something that as you get better do less (minimize resource loss) and as such an rng heal is a heal that provides little value as it can't be planned and only gives you more potential on something you're trying to reduce.

This makes minor arcana a skill that has a chance of providing Y and another chance of providing X being that X something may hold no real value. That is something that even in games with rng involved (yu gi oh or warhammer comes to mind) is avoided, you want to get something be it X or Y but you want both to be equally valuable without being the same and from my perspective lord and lady fail at that.

However I do not think lady is not salvageable by any means, systems that may help the astro roughly predict how many ladies they'll get in a encounter and when would help a lot as they could make lady something you can count on and adjust to, kinda like how in card games you know your deck and while not knowing when certain cards will appear you can plan around them as you know they're there and how many.

[Leonerdo]

Man, I really love AST's current design. It has unique and powerful tools, it's the right amount of busy, and the RNG is manageable. But the EW changes just make it too RNG for my taste. I'll play it for Normal raids, but the RNG is just terrible for Savage where I want to plan everything out. And of course parsing with it is just about fishing for one run with good card draws... Almost as bad as dancer RNG.

Everytime I get a Lady of Crowns in the opener (100% useless when all my other cooldowns are available), I'm not gonna wipe and reset of course, but I'll be immensely disappointed.

It's ironic considering how cool AST looked in the job trailer and how bland SCH looked, but I think I'd rather play around with SCH's new speedboost than deal with AST cards now.

I'm not the type to complain usually, but I can't see the silver lining in this particular case. And supposedly the devs listen on the forums sometimes. Figured I would throw in my 2 cents.

[EthanMoonkin]

This is the second time in a row that you treat your interlocutor as an idiot that has no idea how healing and the game work, while you act like you are aware of the secrets of the universe. I know it's an alluring option when you have weak arguments, but it's also very obnoxious.

That being said, no. AST needs to do three things: damage, healing and party buffs. None of this is - and I'm quoting you - entirely RNG dependent. Not even close. Now that we - hopefully - made this clear and got rid of hyperboles, we can move on.

To address your question from your previous comment: why would anyone play AST over WHM? Because they like AST more. And because, unless balance is very off (and in this case, they will fix it), AST's basic damage spells, card and divination will, more or less, match WHM's personal damage. Astrodyne and Lord would very likely make AST deal more damage than a WHM if you have perfect RNG, but guess what: it's RNG. It's inconsistent. You can't replicate it realiably. It doesn't matter.


No, the job is not objectively flawed. Your lack of awareness is also so astonishing.
Let me get this straight: some people enjoy the AST changes, some don't. These AST changes make the job more different compared to the rest of the healers. You don't like the job and call it objectively flawed.
Your solution: scrap what makes AST different and make it similar to the rest, so one portion of the playerbase (=me) can be happy. So everyone that wants AST to change can play AST or - like you said - SGE and WHM. Everyone that wants to play EW's AST in its current form can instead play... Ehm... What can they play?
Sounds very healthy and not egoistic at all to me.

I'm sorry. Did I hurt your feelings? Your reasonings for wanting to keep AST the way they are a literally "because people like it", which is not even an argument. Some people like eating crap but that doesn't make it good.

You've failed to even address my argument, which is the current card system/astrodyne has about a 50% chance to punish players just from RNG. This is not something the player can improve upon and see results of their hard work. RNG for the sake of RNG in this game is a bad thing when it results in loss of damage consistently. People don't like that, and it will cause them to move to other classes.

The whole, if you don't like it, don't play it and just shut up argument is so condescending and dismissive. People ask for changes because they care about their main job. If the changes were for the benefit of all players, there's no reason to silence those players.

I'll say it again, the card system is flawed but I'm thinking there will be some adjustments that help us manipulate the RNG.

[Payadopa]

Man, I really love AST's current design. It has unique and powerful tools, it's the right amount of busy, and the RNG is manageable. But the EW changes just make it too RNG for my taste. I'll play it for Normal raids, but the RNG is just terrible for Savage where I want to plan everything out. And of course parsing with it is just about fishing for one run with good card draws... Almost as bad as dancer RNG.

Everytime I get a Lady of Crowns in the opener (100% useless when all my other cooldowns are available), I'm not gonna wipe and reset of course, but I'll be immensely disappointed.

It's ironic considering how cool AST looked in the job trailer and how bland SCH looked, but I think I'd rather play around with SCH's new speedboost than deal with AST cards now.

I'm not the type to complain usually, but I can't see the silver lining in this particular case. And supposedly the devs listen on the forums sometimes. Figured I would throw in my 2 cents.

So in the end it comes down to 'my number will be a bit smaller = sad'. I think parsing can have a place but if it gets into your head so much (no offense ) then you should take a step back. It's totally fine to not like a job. I don't like SCH, so I don't play it. They are all still viable.