The cat's (or femhroth in this case) outta the bag

[Allegor]

*ehem*

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

*ehem*

Stop it, we're all wrong, it has to be a Hrothgar Female based on Circumstantial Evidence.

[Lihtleita]

*ehem*

i dont know how to say this, but you get the same result overlaying a femroe face. surprisingly, we all have eyes, noses and mouths in the same general area

[Allegor]

i dont know how to say this, but you get the same result overlaying a femroe face. surprisingly, we all have eyes, noses and mouths in the same general area

You notice that's literally the problem here, right. A cat shouldn't have a human's face

[MikkoAkure]

*ehem*

Aren't her ears facing the wrong way to be a miqo'te? I'm not sure why people are fighting this either, it's just concept art. I missed a couple of pages but why all the argument?

It also makes more sense that a blue cat girl wearing the garb of the Queen of the blue cats, is the blue cat girl from that country and not the variation of blue cat girls from the other side of the planet, none of whom have any representation in that country at all so far.

[SherlottaEryut]

Aren't her ears facing the wrong way to be a miqo'te? I'm not sure why people are fighting this either, it's just concept art. I missed a couple of pages but why all the argument?

I think people are concerned the female Hrothgar is just gonna be another 'pretty character' as opposed to beast-like. Majority of the races are attractive characters and considering this most likely will be the last race we'll get in the game, it's the last chance to have an actual 'beast race' for the females. The Viera were supposed to be more animalistic but that opportunity was missed.

[MikkoAkure]

I think people are concerned the female Hrothgar is just gonna be another 'pretty character' as opposed to beast-like. Majority of the races are attractive characters and considering this most likely will be the last race we'll get in the game, it's the last chance to have an actual 'beast race' for the females. The Viera were supposed to be more animalistic but that opportunity was missed.

How were the Viera supposed to be more animalistic? We already saw Fran in-game before a whiff of them existing beyond concept art was released and she looks identical to what we have now minus an original face and hairstyle. Viera have never been consistent and even in their debut game, Tactics Advance, some of them have normal hands and feet and others have long hands and feet. If you've been playing XIV for awhile you would know there would be 0% chance that they would give a new race in this game different hands and feet than all the other races. The devs take shortcuts and making something true to FFXII Viera would be extra work they wouldn't bother with.

[SherlottaEryut]

How were the Viera supposed to be more animalistic? We already saw Fran in-game before a whiff of them existing beyond concept art was released and she looks identical to what we have now minus an original face and hairstyle. Viera have never been consistent and even in their debut game, Tactics Advance, some of them have normal hands and feet and others have long hands and feet. If you've been playing XIV for awhile you would know there would be 0% chance that they would give a new race in this game different hands and feet than all the other races. The devs take shortcuts and making something true to FFXII Viera would be extra work they wouldn't bother with.

No, I'm not that familiar with the developers taking shortcuts or anything of the sort considering I've only been playing the game for 3-4 months. I worded my sentence wrong but what I meant to say was, the Viera to be more beast-like was a missed opportunity.

And from a new person's perspective, if I saw Fran at the time of the expansion prior to Viera being implemented as a playable race, I would have assumed the developers would have retained the FF12 Viera's appearance.

[Iscah]

The irony in your reply is that your logic is failed from the start by making assumptions.
"Putting 100% work into male Viera"
We have absolutely no reason to assume that they haven't worked on Hrothgals, we simply know that they're focused on releasing Male Viera first for 6.0 and Hrothgals "when every we finish them".

They said "focus". I take that to mean putting all their resources into the one race before starting on the other.

And B makes no sense, as this art shows us finalized art of the queen without a femroe head. So if she was meant to have a Femroe head "early on" then said art would show a Femroe's head.

Not if the decision to make her a Roegadyn happened after this initial concept art stage but before they moved on to implementing it into the game as a 3D model.

The only facts we can say for sure is that she was a Hrothgar at this concept stage and a Roegadyn in the game, and the plan was changed somewhere in between. That is not proof they started to build it according to this art.

Topic 1- Is this a drawing of a female Hrothgar?
I would say yes, this looks exactly like the canon Hrothgal art we have in game. You would have to make a lot of assumptions to think this was a Miqote that ended up having different looking head features "just because" and turned into a Femroe face 2 instead of having a rando Miqote head for w/e reason. Given what we see, the simplest answer is that this drawing it a Hrothgar.

If you're arguing aganist me specifically then you're the one conflating arguments, because I never sad it looked like a Miqo'te.

And yes, I agree the concept art is of a Hrothgar.

But no, I do not agree it looks like the specific piece of in-game art you think it matches.

As I said last night, I think it looks like this one.



This version matches the proportions I'm seeing in that concept art: a large, rounded torso compared to the head. The angle on the new art also seems to be making her neck look thinner than it actually is, because the drape from her headdress is partly obscuring it.

The concept art actually clarifies some of the oddities of the mural - what is she doing, and where are her arms? They seem to be inserted into the machine and controlling it.

Topic 2- Why did the Femroe queen in game have a unique body, different from every other female?
If you accept the above as true, then you would have to accept that this character was intended to be a Hrothgar female up to the point of this finalized art. This would be a reasonable explanation as to why this character doesn't look like an arvg Femroe or any other female.

As I covered earlier, being designed as a Hrothgar up to the stage of this finished art does not inherently mean that it made it further along to the 3D model stage.

And have we proven that it is a fully unique body, or just unique for Roegadyn? I thought people have said it's derived from a Viera, or from Sophia.

Additonally, even if this art represents a model that they started working on but didn't finish, then (as I said above) I disagree that it would have necessarily been interpreted into the slender model from the other mural.

[reivaxe]

They said "focus". I take that to mean putting all their resources into the one race before starting on the other.

That's an assumption, and that's not how production works. A lot of different things at different phases go into making a race or finished product, and "focus" isn't a laser beam of all-the-resources that you point at something until it's done. YP talked about how the big eureka moment was realizing that, if they allowed themselves to release them separately, they would greatly lessen the impact on their development of the game and the strain on their team. We, however, have no idea how production is being managed on these races.

For all we know, they solidified the concept for both genders long ago so that they could add both into the pipeline for new gear and emotes being created for 6.0, allowing themselves to focus on making the 1000s of models and all the emotes from the past ten years fit the Male Viera Parameters without worrying about clearing that huge backlog for Hrothgals yet. Such a course of action could result in them lessening the work for releasing Hrothgals, as there would be less catch up work to do if you know what they look like and are already accounting for them in future designs/ models and their backlog could be finished when the team isn't trying to make stuff like ARR gear fit male Viera.

That's just an example, the point is that we have no idea what their pipeline and timetable is looking like. We only know that they plan to release these 2 options separately/ as they finish them. Any assumption that they couldn't know what Hrothgals look like at this point in time because of that statement is simply a fallacy.

Not if the decision to make her a Roegadyn happened after this initial concept art stage but before they moved on to implementing it into the game as a 3D model.

The only facts we can say for sure is that she was a Hrothgar at this concept stage and a Roegadyn in the game, and the plan was changed somewhere in between. That is not proof they started to build it according to this art.

That's a lot of assumptions there. "They designed her throughout the entire conceptual process to be a Hrothgal, even through the finalized art. BUT, this finalized concept art has no bearing on her final design. They didn't take the concept art into account when making the final product and just made a unique au ra/ viera mixed body for a Femroe for no reason related to any art for this character. The end product was not influenced by the finalized concept at all, and the devs just freestyled the body of an important NPC ... something we haven't seen them do".

If you're arguing aganist me specifically then you're the one conflating arguments, because I never sad it looked like a Miqo'te.

You took a post not directed at you in any way and inserted yourself into the discussion. That original post about occams razor was directed at people trying to convince themselves that this was a Miqote. Establishing that this is intended to be a Hrothgal clears that up and is actually important to other points of discussion.

Also, if you see this as concept art for a female Hrothgar, then it stands to reason that the devs know/ knew what they want them to look like already.

And yes, I agree the concept art is of a Hrothgar.

But no, I do not agree it looks like the specific piece of in-game art you think it matches.

If you can not see the resemblance in these faces then we're going to have to agree to disagree.


Tiny dot for nose indicating that it's small/ prominent human lips/ indication of eyebrows. For anyone who took the mural seriously, this art isn't a shock.
(And most people realize we can't clearly see what's going on with her body in the image we have, so it's not really a point of discussion.)

As I covered earlier, being designed as a Hrothgar up to the stage of this finished art does not inherently mean that it made it further along to the 3D model stage.

And have we proven that it is a fully unique body, or just unique for Roegadyn? I thought people have said it's derived from a Viera, or from Sophia.

Do you have any specific reason to think that the devs would full on freestyle an entire important NPC's body without consulting or creating concept art? That very notion seems like a whole ass element of complexity that isn't needed, given that we can find concept art for everything in this game. Fairly large leap in logic to.

And people simply assumed that because it's pretty. If you care to pick apart the few scenes we get to clearly see her body and compare them to other females in the CC, you'll see the differences. Like I said, her musculature and frame closely resemble a mixture of Au Ra and Viera, but not exactly matching either of them. She even has "slight virgin posture" which makes sense for giving Hrothgals something as close to a hunch as you can get yet still being pretty.

Maybe I'll finish the diagram some day.