As a Non-Native English Speaker This Game is the Most Hellish Game I Have Ever Played

[Garnix]

My take on this:
1) you don't need to understand every single word in a sentence to understand what is being said. That's basically the first thing that you have to accept when you learn a new language. Even in my mother tongue there are plenty of words I don't know.
2) Urianger's way of speaking is mostly a joke at this point. It's just as funny as Mikoto using her scientific lingo that nobody understands in the Ivalice/Bozja questline.

[Fyrebrand]

This is all Koji Fox, whom is known to be a big showoff. He cares more about letting anyone know just HOW MUCH English he knows than offering a smooth and understandable experience for the player.

I have to google soo many words bc they DO use many that have a far more common synonym. First thing that comes to my mind is 5.3 where G'raha speaks of halcyon days. Dude just say happy?

I agree that accessibility and language barriers are an important consideration for any product, but at the same time, that can stray too far into anti-intellectualism. No one should be shamed out of using a perfectly valid word they know, for fear of offending others who might not know that word. Imagine telling somebody "You shouldn't say that word, because I don't know it." See how ridiculous that is? This is classic Karen behaviour. It's not their fault that they know something you don't. In the same way you can fail a combat encounter, perhaps you can fail a vocabulary encounter. And that's okay! It's not a problem! You have an opportunity to learn from it, and gain experience. Finding out what you don't know is one of the most important things you can do for yourself.

Koji Fox has a specialized skill set in English, and I applaud him for wanting to make full use of his tool kit. He isn't just some random guy who localizes a finished Japanese script and then hijacks it to suit his selfish agenda. He is inseparable from the creative development of the game, as yeast is from bread. He's a ground-level trooper. Did you not see him on stage at Fan Fest, struggling to hold back his emotions as he live-translated Soken's cancer confession? Do you really think he regards all this as just some ego trip?

[Krotoan]

Urianger speaks very formally, but his choice of vocab is not difficult at all.

Difficult? Not really. Unusual though and understandable that someone not versed with the pop-culture idea of ye-olde-english would find confusing. He's supposed to be speaking unnecessarily verbosely while using a non-contemporary lexicon. That's all.
This being obvious when his lines are examined through the lens of another language (likely the source material) are similarly portrayed.

Complaining that he should be simplified and made more understandable is missing the entire point of how he's written though.

[Sicno]

I agree that accessibility and language barriers are an important consideration for any product, but at the same time, that can stray too far into anti-intellectualism.

First: I don't see how making things simple to understand can be called "anti-intellectualism". I don't know why npc dialogue in a videogame should be the place where you go to seek "intellectuality".

Second: If straying too far into that direction is bad then going too far into the opposite direction is bad too, and this style of localization does exactly that. Where you need a deeper understanding of the language and still keep scratching your head at every turn. This isn't just a sprinkle here and there for flavor. The entire game is a maze of ye olde English, pirate talk, etc. Your focus should be in understanding the story and not get too distracted by the quirks of the language.

It's not their fault that they know something you don't. In the same way you can fail a combat encounter, perhaps you can fail a vocabulary encounter. And that's okay! It's not a problem! You have an opportunity to learn from it, and gain experience. Finding out what you don't know is one of the most important things you can do for yourself.

I'M TRYING TO PLAY A GAME FFS, NOT TO BE AN ENGLISH MAJOR. Why should the language in the game be a "test", COMPARABLE TO COMBAT?

Do you really think he regards all this as just some ego trip?

The ammount of screen/stage time he gets does reinforce for me the big ego he has and how much he wants to be in everything and be a visible face and do things people will recognize him for. Remember what I said about "invisibility" being a desirable trait in localization? Yeah he goes the total opposite way. I don't mean to say that he shouldn't be recognized for his work. What I say is you shouldn't recognize him in the work. Subtle difference in semantics, but a world of difference in the meaning.

[TheMightyMollusk]

I'M TRYING TO PLAY A GAME FFS, NOT TO BE AN ENGLISH MAJOR. Why should the language in the game be a "test", COMPARABLE TO COMBAT?

I mean, the combat's not really a test in anything less than Extreme either. (And even that depends on which Extreme.)

[Sicno]

I mean, the combat's not really a test in anything less than Extreme either. (And even that depends on which Extreme.)

[Herebedragons]

This is all Koji Fox, whom is known to be a big showoff. He cares more about letting anyone know just HOW MUCH English he knows than offering a smooth and understandable experience for the player. He LOVES to show you that obscure word he learned yesterday. All those references to pop culture and whatnot on the names of fates and quests? Again, he wants you to know just HOW MUCH he knows. He also wants you to know that HE INVENTED THE DRAGON LANGUAGE so that gives him almighty power to alter the script of the game from what the scenario writers intended to accomodate his own vision (hello, Midgardsormr). He's the one who originally put a super spoiler on the English title for clearing the patch 3.5 main story because he wants you to know HOW CLEVER he is for making a connection to Coils of Bahamut.

They have explained in the past that localization isn't a direct translation and certain things are modified to account for cultural differences. I understand that, I truly do. But what they do in this game goes in really weird directions that don't adhere to those principles. Localization should be as "invisible" as possible. It's not the place for expressing your own knowledge or "creativity". It's just so the players can understand and enjoy the game. If things make sense and the intent of the original writers are understood and it all feels natural then you're doing a good job. But here things are often unintelligible and you can tell there's a heavy hand influencing things.

You're a funny one! I'm dying over here!

It took me a while to get used to type of English used in this game. I believe Final Fantasy 12 and Tactics also make a lot of use of this type of English if i am remembering correctly.

No wonder I feel at home then.

[Packetdancer]

I'M TRYING TO PLAY A GAME FFS, NOT TO BE AN ENGLISH MAJOR. Why should the language in the game be a "test", COMPARABLE TO COMBAT?

Apropos of nothing, I now kind of what want Endwalker to introduce a 'debate' mechanic for scholars once we get to Sharlayan. Linguistic combat!

(...yeah I should get some sleep.)

[Iscah]

Difficult? Not really. Unusual though and understandable that someone not versed with the pop-culture idea of ye-olde-english would find confusing.

While I don't know enough to say if he's speaking it right or not, he's doing it a lot better than the average person whom thinketh thou just sticketh superfluous endings on thy wordeths. (And now my brain hurteth from writing that.)

But yeah. There are times where I don't think it sounds quite right, but at least he uses thou/thy/thee and verb endings correctly (I do, thou dost, it doth) and being able to sift through those is half the battle. And he's gotten better over time.

If nothing else, you can justify that he's apparently picked it up entirely from reading too many old books and not talking to people enough, in which case he might not have a full grasp of the grammar himself.

Second: If straying too far into that direction is bad then going too far into the opposite direction is bad too, and this style of localization does exactly that. Where you need a deeper understanding of the language and still keep scratching your head at every turn. [...] Your focus should be in understanding the story and not get too distracted by the quirks of the language..

Having a deeper understanding is what stops you from scratching your head in the first place. To me, the wording can be odd but not enough to stumble on.

I think I was looking up more things in the dictionary earlier in in the game, but for me that's honestly appealing. It's interesting to come across new words or to come across them used in an unfamiliar way and learn another application for them.

[Lanadra]

This is all Koji Fox, whom is known to be a big showoff. He cares more about letting anyone know just HOW MUCH English he knows than offering a smooth and understandable experience for the player. He LOVES to show you that obscure word he learned yesterday. All those references to pop culture and whatnot on the names of fates and quests? Again, he wants you to know just HOW MUCH he knows. He also wants you to know that HE INVENTED THE DRAGON LANGUAGE so that gives him almighty power to alter the script of the game from what the scenario writers intended to accomodate his own vision (hello, Midgardsormr). He's the one who originally put a super spoiler on the English title for clearing the patch 3.5 main story because he wants you to know HOW CLEVER he is for making a connection to Coils of Bahamut.

They have explained in the past that localization isn't a direct translation and certain things are modified to account for cultural differences. I understand that, I truly do. But what they do in this game goes in really weird directions that don't adhere to those principles. Localization should be as "invisible" as possible. It's not the place for expressing your own knowledge or "creativity". It's just so the players can understand and enjoy the game. If things make sense and the intent of the original writers are understood and it all feels natural then you're doing a good job. But here things are often unintelligible and you can tell there's a heavy hand influencing things.

Some real bitterness you got going on there.

You ever heard of 'immersion' and 'flavouring'? The characters speak the way that they do because the setting doesn't take place in god damn 1995 Chicago. Characters like Jacke and generally rogue guild/Limsa folks use 'thieves' cant' because it makes sense, they're pirates, outlaws. Generally characters speak in more archaic english because such makes sense in the games setting. It's about, again, immersion and flavouring, I absolutely love that characters don't use contemporary English because the setting is not modern day.

Yes, it being fantasy does not mean they have to use archaic/Shakespearean english, I'll give you that, but neither does it mean that they can't.

Ultimately it comes down to this: