Monk - Greased Lightning :(

[Marxam]

MNK could have easily had a rotation similar to BLM astral and umbral but for fire and wind fists. The closest we got was the pre 5.4 opener with fire into wind. A real missed opportunity for the weaponskills to change in their respective stances similar to how the Inner Chaos works. It would effectively double their gcd rotation without actually increasing the skill bloat. Imagine FoF doing some beefy crits and DH then switching to FoW to apply dots and buffs. Some examples of the same skill but in different stances:

Fist of Fire dmg +5%, GL4:
-Bootshine deals 100% Direct hit crit with DK buff
-Twin Snakes increases chakra gauge by 1 if performed from rear
-Demolish reduces cd of elixir field and shoulder tackle by 5 secs
-Snap Punch unchanged
-Forbidden chakra increased potency

Fists of Wind dmg +5%, GL4:
-Bootshine unchanged
-Twin Snakes adds movement speed for set duration regardless of stance
-Demolish unchanged
-Snap Punch adds a dot
-Forbidden chakra refreshes all dot timers

Just some random ideas. All I can hope for in 6.0 is that MNK doesn't get another skill that counteracts its playstyle at lvl 90 i.e. Six sided star.

[Neoyoshi]

I miss the green/lightning aura so much!

That animation was sharp as hell, i do miss it.

[Shurrikhan]

I miss the days of Double TK, three GL stacks and 60 second Perfect Balance, but alas the damage from ShB has already been done. Though I don't agree with SE's methods of "if we can't make it work then we'll just friggin delete it," them not wasting time on GL is for the better because they utterly mishandled every attempt to expand on it.

I mean, if the problem was the attempted expansions onto GL (via Anatman, etc.), and the version just prior to those expansions was frequently held as the best state MNK has ever been in... couldn't they have just deleted the pointless additions and gave back the tools (e.g., 60-second PB) that they previously removed as to shoehorn those additions in? Voila. Fixed without having to delete a thing.

More than a lack of vision, it seems like Monk over the last 2 years has suffered from a developer-perceived need to apply the sledge hammer over the chisel. 4.3's problem wasn't the double or even triple TK builds; it was how optimal play punished ping. Had they simply move the GL generation from Riddle of Wind to Wind Tackle, that'd have mostly been fixed. There were occasional issues with Tornado Kick, since it's now used rotationally, being unable to see use just before a jump? Then you remove its cooldown, which it has zero need for anyways. Incredibly simple, yet far more effective than the nerfs and dung-presented-as-diamonds additions of Shadowbringers.

[Kolsykol]

I miss the green/lightning aura so much!

And MNK was my very first class too, but removing such a core concept like GL was too much, it literally killed the class to me.

YES.

I want it back ( the glow ) .........
I am hoping that they're keeping it for a new mechanic and that's why we don't have it anymore.

[Neihel]

The devs wants phase transitions to be part of the normal gameplay but monk wasn't designed for that also spamming form shift until the tank pulls isn't very fun

I hope next expansion they make monk more flashy maybe we could be like that one monk boss in that one dungeon and toss tigers around

[Morzy]

Monk's changed a lot.

I think one thing I'm certain of, is I don't miss the TP management, I recall how the way greased lightning used to work drained TP fast, like really fast. xD

Only if you didn't properly use Invigorate & Purification <<

[Morzy]

Monk is likely in the middle of a massive rework. Endwalker will likely see the class remade from the ground up. Greased Lightning was really fun, until it didn't fit the game. Every transition or unhittable phase and your damage is gone and it became a lot less fun. So right now it looks bad, with many skills that are very niche or straight up never used, but hopefully September we'll get a peak at what they're planning and fingers crossed it's good.

Even with boss interrupts, MNK damage was fine. It just meant that the skill ceiling was raised high.

[silverdragontyr]

It had nothing to do with skill ceiling. GL was literally 20% of Mnk's damage and a lot of fights started having phases where you literally couldn't keep it up causing you to have to rebuild your damage. No amount of skill matters when you literally can't do anything as you watch the timer run out. Yes it could be rebuilt with PB or form shift but that was the point. Perfect balance, Form Shift, Anatman, Riddle of Earth all of these abilities were almost exclusively used to maintain, rebuild or extend GL timer. Then when you include Fists stances and SSS before the tweek you're looking at a class that had the most niche or unused skills of any class. One or two is understandable. Six is a bit much. The simple fact is Monk as it was designed in 2.0 Doesn't fit the design philosophy of 5.0 and beyond. I'm not saying it didn't have it's charm, it just didn't fit the game anymore.

[Shurrikhan]

It had nothing to do with skill ceiling. GL was literally 20% of Mnk's damage and a lot of fights started having phases where you literally couldn't keep it up causing you to have to rebuild your damage.

"A lot of fights"? Even back when GL was a mere 10 seconds, across all of Twisting Coil there were only 2 forced drops, in T9 meteor phase and T13 transition. Plenty of Monks dropped it far more often, but those were the only two actually unavoidable.

Perfect balance, Form Shift, Anatman, Riddle of Earth all of these abilities were almost exclusively used to maintain, rebuild or extend GL timer.

Perfect Balance: Let's not pretend 4.3 Monk didn't happen. It did, and it was pretty damn good. There, PB had nothing to do with GL maintenance, only the initial generation. In all else, it simply interplayed with Tornado Kick. I.e., not just for GL maintenance.
Form Shift: Was not used solely to maintain GL, but instead often for alignment across forced downtime. (It also would work fine, if not better, as a passive -- no button required.) I.e., not just for GL maintenance.
Anatman: We already have a community consensus that Anatman was redundant rubbish in the context of RoE. A redundant tool being added later does not suddenly break a mechanic that worked until then.
Riddle of Earth: The points at which RoE was useful also marked resource wastes or awkward cooldown alignments for many another job. Ultimately, it would have been better if transition phases, or at least those that stopped character control, also paused all buff durations (and maybe even ability cooling, as not to unfairly favor high %oGCD-damage jobs), but it is what it is.

The simple fact is Monk as it was designed in 2.0 Doesn't fit the design philosophy of 5.0 and beyond. I'm not saying it didn't have it's charm, it just didn't fit the game anymore.

I fully disagree, as the problems stemmed more from conflicts in the most recent design additions alone, and two very simple long-time oversights (there being no need for all stacks to fall at the same time, nor to tie so damn damage %damage to GL), rather than any and all iterations upon building up and expending a speed-affecting buff being doomed to fail. The latter idea smacks of Hw-era DRG complaints, where some called it a fundamentally impossible design simply because they couldn't be bothered to learn how to use it.

But even if it were somehow as impossible a fit as you say, leaving a job utterly gutless is no solution. When literally just having removed the job-specific changes of the latest expansion would leave you with a deeper, more engaging, and more cohesive job... that's a problem.

[Kolsykol]

Outside of the glow I personally don't care much about GL as it was coming back.
To me I'd like to see them go deeper into the combo actions and make that part of the identity of MNK.
Rework the combos to be less monotonous and with more moment to moment decisions.
Not really sure how I am not a game designer but personally I feel like it'd fit the fantasy more.

I want to it to be less predictable with actual decision making, sorta like on SAM for example if there's downtime and you have to sorta run a calculation in your head whether to skip the filler phase to line things up correctly.
Or with more dynamic refreshes of Demolish and Twin Snakes.
Our burst phase is sorta another good example of what I mean where our base combos are thrown off and our combos change, I want to see more of that but not necessarily so on rails.
I want it to feel rewarding to actually understand what's going on and having to make decisions.
It feels rewarding on SAM imo when things get thrown off because of downtime and you adapt and line things up perfectly, it feels like you're rewarded for skillfull play.

On MNK I just feel like it's awkward currently, it doesn't even necessarily feel good to try and adapt your burst phase to lineup correctly after things get thrown off.
And MNK is a Job that shouldn't be on rails imo, it should be more dynamic and fast-paced.
The only skill that really feels that way is Forbidden Chakra.