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  1. #11
    Player
    Lauront's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Amaurot
    Posts
    4,449
    Character
    Tristain Archambeau
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodric View Post
    Is this not a case of simply moving the goalposts? It was stated with certainty that it was not possible for a Pureblood Garlean to wield aether, though an exception was found - and we've not yet delved into their homeland to see how many exceptions to the rule exist.

    Or is every scrap of lore put forward now at the mercy of potentially being inaccurate because it just so happens to be present in the game's lore book?
    It very much is moving the goalposts. Much like it is irrelevant whether or not a Pureblood in-game has been shown to use magic or not. The lorebook makes it clear that this eludes all but a few. So why would that matter?

    All that is required is an opening that would allow for some exceptions to use magic - and that exists. It is in the lorebook. Now, being an in-universe perspective, could it be wrong? Yes, but until such time as it is shown to actually be wrong, I fail to see why it cannot serve as an opening to allow for a Pureblood which could wield magic.

    It really is no more jarring than how the addition of male Viera fits with the existing lore given by the dramaturge.

    I am not expecting that they will add Garlean Purebloods as a race, but I find the lore or "immersion" based reasons to be exceptionally weak, especially given how they've handled prior additions of new races to the game and, again, nothing a glamour can't hide, which is no more jarring than trying to explain why, in spite of being one of those very well hidden male bunnies, no one ever thought to ask you about that. Nevermind Au Ra wandering Ishgard without much fanfare.

    With that said, I'd like to see enhanced customisation options allow for the possibility of creating a Pureblood. And much as with my request for them to add male Viera, I am not convinced that the lore will matter as an excuse to prevent it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bhearil View Post
    Lucia using spells was either an oversight, or her using some magitech device to mimic heal, since her origins as garlean was kept in the dark and making her not using magic would spoil it.

    Imagine how worthless garleans spies would be if they didnt have any way to disguiss their complete lack of magic.
    It could be an oversight. It could be magitek. Or she could be one of those rarities the lorebook touches upon.

    With no real understanding of how their limitation works, beyond it having a genetic cause (according to Aulus), it is left open to the devs to write that as they please. Current lore is certainly no hindrance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jandor View Post
    Viera males aren't seen due to their societies rules, it's not like it's physically impossible to see them. The rules can change and/or more Viera can decide to break them.
    Also, as much as I do like my Viera, as a race they're not important to the story.

    Garleans can't really use magic because of their biology, it's not something that can be waved away with some excuse like "they changed their minds lol."
    Garlemald is also, unlike the Viera clans, pretty important and functions as one of the stories two main factions of antagonists.
    The lore book says they by and large cannot do that. Not that every single one of them can't.

    Quote Originally Posted by MikkoAkure View Post
    If Garlean sorcerers were a real thing and had the ability to do more than "aqua vitae", then why does the lore double-down hard on Garleans not being able to cast magic everywhere else in the game? Why have none of the high profile Garleans we've met and battled with cast damaging spells on us? Why do in-game sources mention multiple times about how they use conscripts for their mage forces? And why do they spend so much time, money, and energy in Stormblood to create the resonant if Garleans have been able to cast magic this whole time?
    What does it even matter why we've yet to encounter one? They can invent any number of reasons for that. We already know from the lorebook that it is but a rare few who can wield magic. If it's some tiny fraction of their population, there is your reason.

    As for why the in-game sources mention their use of conscripts for mage forces, simple - they lack the numbers amongst their own to form any grouped forces out of them. It's of little consequence to whether the WoL could be one, anyhow, and this to me is irrelevant to the point that they already have a source of lore they could exploit to allow for this without a retcon.

    Like I've said before, even disregarding the lore, they're still the enemy through the whole game and yes, there are exceptions, but the whole point of those characters is that they're exceptions. WoL isn't special until they start collecting crystals and they're not treated as special by the city-states until partway through the storyline. Why would a pureblood Garlean be running around without getting arrested? The only other pureblood Garleans who are mixing among the Eorzeans hide their 3rd eye. If we have a playable Garlean hide their 3rd eye too, then what's the point?
    Because the eye can be hidden. Not sure what's so hard to grasp about this one. Your own comments allude to them essentially looking like Hyur for the most part. Is it really any more jarring than any number of other things people have on their characters, that you can just imagine are not there for the purposes of immersion?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vyrerus View Post
    That singular passage is leaving room for its author to be wrong, and that is pretty much it. Name one notable pureblooded Garlean that is capable of using magic. I won't wait, because you cannot. They have yet to show even a single one that wasn't possessed by an Ascian or treated to a special procedure.

    That same book also says,

    "The Empire has banned religion, seeing it as a barbarian practice that all too often results in the summoning of primals. Many of the inhabitants of Garlemald proper are atheists, a fact attributable to their biological and spiritual inability to harbor and wield aether-based magicks. As theologians believe that religion can only truly develop alongside magic, it is little wonder that the Garleans are disinclined to keep any faith."

    Something that is integral to the WoL is that we all believe in a patron deity from The Twelve. As a Garlean pureblood it wouldn't make any sense for us to believe in one of The Twelve. That would have to be removed from character creation, specifically for Garleans. Then Garlean players would feel left out.

    Also note that the WoL's age is rather young, mid 20s to late 30s. This means that a pureblooded Garlean WoL would have been born after the introduction of Magitek to their society, and would have even less of a reason to leave Garlemald, to learn arcane arts, and to come be a hero in Eorzea.

    As for the Echo, we've been shown half-blooded Garleans can have it through Arenvald. Never a pureblood, though. I'd posit that since the Echo is tied to a being's aetheric waveform, yes, it would be entirely possible for Garleans to have the Echo, but in my opinion it would lay dormant until they learned how to manipulate aether. If their body even could. Of course, even that wouldn't be enough to know they had the Echo. They'd have to encounter an event that let them know they had it. Considering the Echo lies dormant even in individuals who can readily manipulate aether, who's to say that a pureblooded Garlean would ever meet the right condition short of artificial means to precipitate the activation of their Echo? Further still, if Garleans could have the Echo, then why would it be a surprise to them to learn about such a thing from their warring with Eorzea?

    To let us play Garleans would be to make the lore bend over backwards to accommodate the possibility. It would break too much while giving so little while also injecting dissonance into nearly every sidequest and cutscene. No thanks.
    Then feel free to do as many of us do with characters we find jarring, e.g. in chicken suits, and pretend they don't exist. Problem solved.

    None of the reasons enumerated there are in any way compelling blockers to adding them nor do they rule out an exceptional Garlean taking a different view on the matter.

    As I said above, while the book can be wrong, it's a "so what?" At present, there is nothing to contradict it - and if it is correct, then along with that fall any objections regarding the Echo.

    Trying to mount an argument based on the fact that we've yet to see one (aside from Lucia) do so in-game is not really going to make a difference here, because rarity alone of such individuals would be a sufficient reason for that and does not refute what the lore book is saying.
    (4)
    Last edited by Lauront; 06-17-2021 at 12:58 AM.
    When the game's story becomes self-aware:


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