ARR needs two simple fixes until an actual revamp

[Awha]

In truth does ARR offer any compelling content outside the setup of the world?

[TheMightyMollusk]

In truth does ARR offer any compelling content outside the setup of the world?

Does bread offer anything compelling to a sandwich other than holding the fillings?

[wereotter]

In truth does ARR offer any compelling content outside the setup of the world?

Literally every expansion to date had its story roots in ARR.

Dragonsong War? You're introduced to this when going through the quests in Central Coerthas.

Liberation of Ala Mhigo? You're introduced to this at level 1 if you start in Ul Dah and everyone else when going through the MSQ in Little Ala Mhigo.
Liberation of Doma? This was brought up around 2.2 when Yugiri lands in Vesper Bay

Endwalker's Story? This was more dispersed, but you can argue that this started with the Crystal Tower raid series where we actually travel to one of the other shards for the first time.

[van_arn]

In truth does ARR offer any compelling content outside the setup of the world?

Nothing that can't be glossed over with a quick scroll of text. The rest can be learned in media res. If further details are desired, that's what NG+ is for.

Are you asking them to make...Like, a movie or something to get people caught up to what happened/what is going on when HW starts?

Not really, those already exist on youtube for those that care enough to find them.

[Awha]

Nothing that can't be glossed over with a quick scroll of text. The rest can be learned in media res. If further details are desired, that's what NG+ is for.



Not really, those already exist on youtube for those that care enough to find them.

Aye, I feel the same way.

Does bread offer anything compelling to a sandwich other than holding the fillings?

I get what you are going for but by the definition of sandwich it would not be one without the bread.

Point is while it could be said for any expansion I do feel more so for ARR every major beat could be addressed in a short exposition dump and the game itself would not be drastically altered that it could no longer be considered a game. Especially with NG+.

From a gameplay perspective it is dull. Classes generally feel for the most part shallow at 50, the dungeon design is dated. Overall ARR did not age well imo.

[TheMightyMollusk]

I get what you are going for but by the definition of sandwich it would not be one without the bread.

Point is while it could be said for any expansion I do feel more so for ARR every major beat could be addressed in a short exposition dump and the game itself would not be drastically altered that it could no longer be considered a game. Especially with NG+.

From a gameplay perspective it is dull. Classes generally feel for the most part shallow at 50, the dungeon design is dated. Overall ARR did not age well imo.

If you're replacing game play with exposition dumps, then it's not much of a game anymore. And saying "but NG+" isn't really relevant, because what's the point of abridging the game if you have to go back and play it all anyway?

I'm not gonna pretend ARR is a masterpiece (a lot of jobs really do need more to do at lower levels, for one thing, and a lot of the English voice work is.....questionable, at best), but to say you could just turn it all into a couple of cut scenes is terribly reductive.

I would also argue that most of the old dungeons are fine, the later ones are overly streamlined. The problem most of them run into is the overly generous item level sync.

[Awha]

If you're replacing game play with exposition dumps, then it's not much of a game anymore. And saying "but NG+" isn't really relevant, because what's the point of abridging the game if you have to go back and play it all anyway?

I'm not gonna pretend ARR is a masterpiece (a lot of jobs really do need more to do at lower levels, for one thing, and a lot of the English voice work is.....questionable, at best), but to say you could just turn it all into a couple of cut scenes is terribly reductive.

I would also argue that most of the old dungeons are fine, the later ones are overly streamlined. The problem most of them run into is the overly generous item level sync.

Thing with an MMO as time goes on parts become obsolete and serve no real purpose in terms of raw gameplay that would alter the core experience if they just did an large exposition dump. While a sandwich would not be much a sandwich without the bread.

Sure it is reductive but personally I think it would be better use or dev time to have the lore writters to make a quick abridged scroll and if people want to go back they can use NG+ though I do not think they should try to keep fixing it.

Just the nature of MMO's. I get this will never be done.

[Lanadra]

Thing with an MMO as time goes on parts become obsolete and serve no real purpose in terms of raw gameplay that would alter the core experience if they just did an large exposition dump. While a sandwich would not be much a sandwich without the bread.

Sure it is reductive but personally I think it would be better use or dev time to have the lore writters to make a quick abridged scroll and if people want to go back they can use NG+ though I do not think they should try to keep fixing it.

Just the nature of MMO's. I get this will never be done.

People hate exposition dumps. I would rather take ARR as it is now over some half hour long exposition dump of which I won't remember half by the end. Removing content is never, ever a good idea.

Saying that it's fine is okay if you already gotten past it, but can you honestly do it all again vs the other expansions? SE wants more players and the game needs more to help the game not fall into irrelevance.

Yes, actually. I did it just now in the last two weeks with a new character on Lamia. It really isn't as horrendous as people make it out to be. It didn't age well, but I would never recommend people buy a skip or just skip cutscenes in ARR on their first character.

[Awha]

People hate exposition dumps. I would rather take ARR as it is now over some half hour long exposition dump of which I won't remember half by the end. Removing content is never, ever a good idea.



Yes, actually. I did it just now in the last two weeks with a new character on Lamia. It really isn't as horrendous as people make it out to be. It didn't age well, but I would never recommend people buy a skip or just skip cutscenes in ARR on their first character.

ARR at the core is just an exposition dump though. Also with NG+ the content is not being removed the option to go back will always exist. They could also just toss in a free ARR story skip for first time buyers.

Granted this will also never be done due to profits.

In the end I will always tell my friends and new players buy a story skip for ARR and just lo ok up lore videos if they want the nitty gritty. ARR is a poor representation of FFXIV in its current state. Everything about ARR is dated would take far too much effort to make it tolerable.

[Shurrikhan]

Thing with an MMO as time goes on parts become obsolete and serve no real purpose in terms of raw gameplay that would alter the core experience if they just did an large exposition dump. While a sandwich would not be much a sandwich without the bread.

Sure it is reductive but personally I think it would be better use or dev time to have the lore writers to make a quick abridged scroll and if people want to go back they can use NG+ though I do not think they should try to keep fixing it.

Wouldn't it make more sense to do any of this abridging after the conclusion of the Hydaelyn arc, leading directly to that new arc with a sort of two-pronged focus? (Hell, that could be massive in terms of bringing in new players, as they could go straight to the newest expansion alongside everyone else, albeit it on an adjusted path of discourse and NPC interactions, while the previous Arc is available via Echo for leveling other jobs).

In the meantime, though, we need only make more of the much less relevant arcs (Haukke Manor, much of the Company of Heroes, etc.) optional and improve the early combat experience, much of which could have more universal implications.